Reverse Terrorism?

[eider]

Nope. I see the evil in islam

The trouble is that both extreme Sunni and extreme Shi'ite Muslims perceive rather a lot of evil in you.
As far as they perceive, you did/do not recognise Muhammad as God's chosen prophet and you therefore are an infidel, steeped in primitive mammon and evil western primitive culture.

So what we need is for moderate and loving Christians to meet with moderate peaceful Muslims to guide their followings in the paths of peace and harmony.

I perceive you to be one of the more moderate Christians around here, but even you might be deemed to be too hot to help the cause of peace?

Just sayin'.....

 

[eider]

Like all other religions, Islam is a belief and has no power. Extremists, who come from all walks of life, have power. Not all Muslims are extremists ... and in order to prove me wrong, you would need to show how EVERY single Muslim who exists and existed has committed an act of terrorism.

I will wait for your list ... dates, times, names. Thanks.

That'll be a long wait.

I worked with many Muslims over 20 years and most young western Muslims are a bit like most young western 'Christians'...... they use the name of their faith because threy were brought up to call themselves 'good Muslims' or 'good Christians', but the vast majority of young men just wanted a decent 'motor', some street cred and a 'tasty chic'. I know that you could dissapprove of such mindsets, but aty least most of them on either side seemed totally disinterested in hating anybody.

Very few young persons were strong Christians, but I remember a lad who was a street-preacher in his spare time 'ordained by God' as he described self, and a very very few Muslims stopped work at midday for prayers. One, only one, Muslim was Hafiz and could recite the Koran by heart, because he parents beat him until he could. (the parents of a Hafiz get direct entry to heaven) so he was put off Islam despite his ability.

What I'm drivveling about is the simple fact that most young people here couldn't care less about ANY religions, and as long as we can keep them calm during these troubles then they may not feel like rising up against anybody.

We lost about 70 lives last week in the Grenfell Tower blaze near Lavender Gardens, Kensington and Chelsea, and the grieving families represented just about every race, nationality and religion that we have in this whole land...... and everybody grieved together. I just hope we can hold back the hatred.

 

[eider]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ahmadiyya

Excellent link.
The Ahmadiyya are quite the most delightful people that one could ever have the privilege of meeting.
They are one of the smaller sections of Islam, sadly, but they do show beyond any doubt that Islam can be and should be peaceful. 'Salaam' in action.

 

[eider]

You loonies think that you can live with radical muslims and simply love them and care for them.

No.... we know that we cannot get anywhere with radicals.
We just need to make radicals look crazy and daft so that our young will ignore them or report them for further obsevation. That of course includes radical Muslims, radical Sikhs and Hindus, and radical Christians, etc.

 

[Rusha]

That'll be a long wait.

I worked with many Muslims over 20 years and most young western Muslims are a bit like most young western 'Christians'...... they use the name of their faith because threy were brought up to call themselves 'good Muslims' or 'good Christians', but the vast majority of young men just wanted a decent 'motor', some street cred and a 'tasty chic'. I know that you could dissapprove of such mindsets, but aty least most of them on either side seemed totally disinterested in hating anybody. .

Exactly. Whether I agree or disagree with someone's religious beliefs, they are entitled to them UNTIL those beliefs cross the lines of violent actions. It's intentionally misleading to claim that ALL Muslims (or anyone else) are violent extremists.

 

[eider]

London's mayor is a feckless loser

Well, it is true that Sadiq did not do well, responding to last week's Tower-blaze which killed so many and made hundreds homeless. He just was not up to any suitable response or communication aftyer that dreadful incident. But then, nor was our PM, nor Kensington and Chelsea Council.

We knew that aluminium burns explosively after HMS Sheffield got hit by an exocet missile during the Falklasnds war, it's alloy superstructure just erupting into a fireball, and yet we 'clad' several Tower blocks in this stuff because it was a cheaper-job. That, plus not fitting any sprinkler sysyems, putting up signs and training all residents to remain in their flats regardless (where they burned to death), and not providing ANY fire fighting equipment for residents to use....... did create a totally disgusting and outrageous tragedy within a holocaust.......... and the mayor of London was simply not the person to face the nation over it, nor was our PM.

So, not Sadiq's best week...... he looked very sad, very nervous and totally unable.

 

[eider]

Exactly. Whether I agree or disagree with someone's religious beliefs, they are entitled to them UNTIL those beliefs cross the lines of violent actions. It's intentionally misleading to claim that ALL Muslims (or anyone else) are violent extremists.

Exactly......
Problem is, how to pick up on the ones that go 'murderous' and 'terrorist'.

Darren Osborne's family in Wales are simply 'shellshocked' about what he did and never ever believed that it would be him, doing anything so shocking.

We hear the families of Islamic terrorists voicing exactly the same feelings about their children and husbands.

And our security services are so overrun with reports of suspicious behaviour that they are failing to respond in time.

Tricky situations........

 

[Arthur Brain]

You loonies think that you can live with radical muslims and simply love them and care for them.

That was a really silly thing to say PJ. No, it isn't possible to cohabit peacefully with violent fanatics but it's more than possible to live in peace with those that aren't, which is the vast majority. It's only paranoia and ignorance that's preventing you and others from seeing this, else all Christians are Phelps' clones...

 

[Arthur Brain]

Being spiritually judged by an agnostic. Priceless.

Eh, if you advocate terrorism and murder (which you do by supporting nuking places) then you have no ground for talking about spirituality doofus.

They are more holy than God, more moral, more righteous. So say them.

Really, so sending nukes into the middle east is holy?

Yeah, right...

 

[jgarden]

Unfortunately, the facts bear out that islam is a dangerous fake religion

Muslim nations didn't initiate or were major protagonists in WW1 and WW2 or the genocide of Jews in Europe

One could make a far more persuasive argument that based on the number of casualties alone, Christianity is a much more dangerous religion!

 

[eider]

That was a really silly thing to say PJ. No, it isn't possible to cohabit peacefully with violent fanatics but it's more than possible to live in peace with those that aren't, which is the vast majority..

The above sent to another....

Have you heard?
BBC Teletext News: A son of the proprietor of the van rental firm who hired the van to the Welsh terrorist has been arrested.
He wrote on facebook that he's sorry that his father doresn't rent out tanks or road rollers because they could have done a better job. That was him, arrested and held.

We do have some scum here, really.

 

[Arthur Brain]

The above sent to another....

Have you heard?
BBC Teletext News: A son of the proprietor of the van rental firm who hired the van to the Welsh terrorist has been arrested.
He wrote on facebook that he's sorry that his father doresn't rent out tanks or road rollers because they could have done a better job. That was him, arrested and held.

We do have some scum here, really.

I've just done a health and social care course, passed it and been offered employment by the same company pending DBS checks. Our tutor was a woman of 27 who is as sharp as they come, an ex lawyer who I still have dealings with while doing another course with the same care company. We covered all manner of care through learning disabilities to dementia, palliative and end of life care and she once said that as a species we can be the most cruel and not up too much - and she was right unfortunately. Don't get me wrong, she wasn't saying that human beings themselves are scum, but rather the calculated way that people can inflict suffering or wish suffering on others is completely different to animals operating on pure instinct, and part of being in the care sector involves respecting diversity although not being tolerant to extremism and in fact to be on the lookout for it in cases of abuse.

And look at the attitudes towards those who think nothing of launching nukes or making excuses for those who commit retaliatory atrocities or are sympathetic towards them...

 

[eider]

I've just done a health and social care course, passed it and been offered employment by the same company pending DBS checks. Our tutor was a woman of 27 who is as sharp as they come, an ex lawyer who I still have dealings with while doing another course with the same care company. We covered all manner of care through learning disabilities to dementia, palliative and end of life care and she once said that as a species we can be the most cruel and not up too much - and she was right unfortunately. Don't get me wrong, she wasn't saying that human beings themselves are scum, but rather the calculated way that people can inflict suffering or wish suffering on others is completely different to animals operating on pure instinct, and part of being in the care sector involves respecting diversity although not being tolerant to extremism and in fact to be on the lookout for it in cases of abuse.

I often had to deal with violence, and I trained people to deter and reduce conflict. Humans can have a dreadful characteristic of wanting to exert extreme violence for hardly any reason. The drunk who picks a fight with a person who holds eye contact for slightly too long, knocks him to the ground and then stamps on his head as hard as possible, presumably hoping to crush it. We used to study violence intently, because such studies could save us later.

And look at the attitudes towards those who think nothing of launching nukes or making excuses for those who commit retaliatory atrocities or are sympathetic towards them...

What I can't figure is that some of them are Christians? :idunno:

 

[Arthur Brain]

I often had to deal with violence, and I trained people to deter and reduce conflict. Humans can have a dreadful characteristic of wanting to exert extreme violence for hardly any reason. The drunk who picks a fight with a person who holds eye contact for slightly too long, knocks him to the ground and then stamps on his head as hard as possible, presumably hoping to crush it. We used to study violence intently, because such studies could save us later.

The same company I'm with hold 'security courses' in how to be alert to and deal with potential violence. It makes sense as some clients have drink and drug addictions and that in itself can make their behaviour erratic. Kudos to you.

What I can't figure is that some of them are Christians? :idunno:

I was in a care home the other day, one that specializes in elderly and dementia care and all I can say is that it was a humbling experience. I take it for granted that I can dress and wash myself, that I can think and have independence etc. I don't get these vile attitudes at all. There's anything but love informing it.

 

[fool]

We knew that aluminium burns explosively after HMS Sheffield got hit by an exocet missile during the Falklasnds war, it's alloy superstructure just erupting into a fireball, and yet we 'clad' several Tower blocks in this stuff because it was a cheaper-job.

From what I understand it was aluminum sandwich panels where you have a polymer (Plastic) honeycomb core with a sheets of aluminum on either side. There's nothing cheap about them, there was a lot on the project I built last year and I was a bit taken aback by the price. They do create a space behind them when installed which would create a chimney effect and the plastic core would be flammable just like a soda bottle is.

That, plus not fitting any sprinkler sysyems,

Right, putting new cladding on the outside of a building without sprinklers is like painting your barn while it on fire.

putting up signs and training all residents to remain in their flats regardless (where they burned to death),

That in my mind is criminal and whatever committee that approved that should be in prison.
Never stay in a building that's on fire. Even if contained you'll have an air quality issue and utilities will be affected. Your apartment is of NO USE without power and water and filled with toxic smoke.

and not providing ANY fire fighting equipment for residents to use....... did create a totally disgusting and outrageous tragedy within a holocaust.......... and the mayor of London was simply not the person to face the nation over it, nor was our PM.

The local fire marshall should be the first in the stocks, at least in the U.S. Over here the Fire Marshall has a badge and a gun and he will shut you down in a heartbeat if he doesn't like your set up.

So, not Sadiq's best week...... he looked very sad, very nervous and totally unable.

He's probably realizing how utterly retarded his cities fire code and over-sight is.
He's wondering how many of those stupid "Stay Put" stickers are out there and finding out the reason for them is that the exits are too small to actually evacuate in a timely manner.

 

[fool]

Muslim nations didn't initiate or were major protagonists in WW1 and WW2 or the genocide of Jews in Europe

One could make a far more persuasive argument that based on the number of casualties alone, Christianity is a much more dangerous religion!

OR.....
The Germans :think:

 

[eider]

From what I understand it was aluminum sandwich panels where you have a polymer (Plastic) honeycomb core with a sheets of aluminum on either side. There's nothing cheap about them, there was a lot on the project I built last year and I was a bit taken aback by the price. They do create a space behind them when installed which would create a chimney effect and the plastic core would be flammable just like a soda bottle is.


Right, putting new cladding on the outside of a building without sprinklers is like painting your barn while it on fire.

That in my mind is criminal and whatever committee that approved that should be in prison.
Never stay in a building that's on fire. Even if contained you'll have an air quality issue and utilities will be affected. Your apartment is of NO USE without power and water and filled with toxic smoke.


The local fire marshall should be the first in the stocks, at least in the U.S. Over here the Fire Marshall has a badge and a gun and he will shut you down in a heartbeat if he doesn't like your set up.

He's probably realizing how utterly retarded his cities fire code and over-sight is.
He's wondering how many of those stupid "Stay Put" stickers are out there and finding out the reason for them is that the exits are too small to actually evacuate in a timely manner.

Excellent review of the whole situation, imo.
We are told that two cladding products were available, and that the authorities chose the one that was £2.50p less expensive per panel, or maybe per M2.

There are scores of Tower blocks in Britain with the same cladding, same signs, same lack of sprinklers and fire equipment..... at least, there were last week.

And yes, the Fire commissioner's reports were very loud, forced, determined as she explained what her force had done, and was doing. Fire officers checked and approved this block recently. I really would not want to the architect, planning authority, building inspector, contractor, sub contractor, fire officer who had anything to do with this.

 

[eider]

The same company I'm with hold 'security courses' in how to be alert to and deal with potential violence. It makes sense as some clients have drink and drug addictions and that in itself can make their behaviour erratic. Kudos to you.


I was in a care home the other day, one that specializes in elderly and dementia care and all I can say is that it was a humbling experience. I take it for granted that I can dress and wash myself, that I can think and have independence etc. I don't get these vile attitudes at all. There's anything but love informing it.

From the above it looks as if you are involved with 'care in the community' patients, 'warden-accomodation' and 'care homes' for elderly. I retired in 2010 and a friend gave me a part-time job cleaning carpets which I did for 5 years. (I loved it). We had contracts in East Kent with a Care-in-Community contractor. I would visit a woman in her late 30's twice a year.... she had a life-size doll in a baby sling held to her chest, and this 'baby' had its own room, birthday cards (one sent by a virtual father), and toys. She would speak to her 'child' as she did her housework. I never discovered anything about her, but I would often see the c-in-c visitors when I returned keys to the c-in-c offices, and these untrained, inadequate nasty scumbags would joke with each other about how they took the mickey out of her when they called to hers and others' flats. The World is full of ignorant nasty people, and I still haven't really got used to it.

 

[ok doser]

Why would he go out of his way to throw shade on London's mayor in the first place?

they have a history

 

[Arthur Brain]

From the above it looks as if you are involved with 'care in the community' patients, 'warden-accomodation' and 'care homes' for elderly. I retired in 2010 and a friend gave me a part-time job cleaning carpets which I did for 5 years. (I loved it). We had contracts in East Kent with a Care-in-Community contractor. I would visit a woman in her late 30's twice a year.... she had a life-size doll in a baby sling held to her chest, and this 'baby' had its own room, birthday cards (one sent by a virtual father), and toys. She would speak to her 'child' as she did her housework. I never discovered anything about her, but I would often see the c-in-c visitors when I returned keys to the c-in-c offices, and these untrained, inadequate nasty scumbags would joke with each other about how they took the mickey out of her when they called to hers and others' flats. The World is full of ignorant nasty people, and I still haven't really got used to it.

I'm not actually actively involved in care work as yet but I'm more than aware of abuse and malpractice that can sometimes go on unfortunately. What you describe is not only abuse but blatant breach of confidentiality as well as gross misconduct. Thankfully there's more recognition for this kind of crap lately and any sort of malignant gossip is clamped down on although it will still go on if under the radar unfortunately.