ECT Who is saved?

[heir]

"A dispensation of the gospel" and "THE dispensation of the gospel of the grace of God" are ONE AND THE SAME Gospel, o cluless, religious legalist.

When Paul was committed a dispensation of the gospel, to whom was he sent at that time? IOW, who were the called at that time?

When God gave Paul the dispensation of the grace of God, who was it toward? IOW, who were the called at that time?

Were there any differences in who they were, what they were commanded or what they heard preached by Paul or those who traveled with him or those to whom he wrote?


And FYI: The fact that some endevour to 2 Timothy 2:15 KJV to include the studying of what a term means, who the audience was, and with what gospel did they hear preached does not a "religious legalist" make. It makes one a workman that needeth not to be ashamed rightly dividing the word of truth.

 

[heir]

Lol - you're right - I'd forgotten your confused assertion is actually 3 supposed gospels of Paul, not two.

STP pointed that out to me on some other thread, but it momentarily slipped my mind.

You're right; you're even more confused than I had remembered you and your pals being :chuckle:

Nevertheless, heir - Romans 14:5 towards ya, in memory of Romans 5:8.

Your "graceless grace" is showing again.

 

[Danoh]

When Paul was committed a dispensation of the gospel, to whom was he sent at that time? IOW, who were the called at that time?

When God gave Paul the dispensation of the grace of God, who was it toward? IOW, who were the called at that time?

Were there any differences in who they were, what they were commanded or what they heard preached by Paul or those who traveled with him or those to whom he wrote?


And FYI: The fact that some endevour to 2 Timothy 2:15 KJV to include the studying of what a term means, who the audience was, and with what gospel did they hear preached does not a "religious legalist" make. It makes one a workman that needeth not to be ashamed rightly dividing the word of truth.

Nope - that is not what I am referring to by the phrase "religious legalist."

Not that you will, sis, but you might want to re-read my post. Much more carefully this time.

Romans 14:5 towards ya, in memory of Romans 5:8.

 

[Danoh]

Your "graceless grace" is showing again.

Romans 14:5 towards you, in memory of Romans 5:8 - on both our behalfs.

 

[heir]

Nope - that is not what I am referring to by the phrase "religious legalist."

Not that you will, sis, but you might want to re-read my post. Much more carefully this time.

Romans 14:5 towards ya, in memory of Romans 5:8.

Answer the questions, please.

 

[God's Truth]

"Grace without works is not dead!" ~STP

See: Ephesians 2:4-9 KJV

Even that scripture you referenced is about the ceremonial works.

The Gentiles were dead in their sins because they did not do the ceremonial works and get circumcised.

Colossians 2:13 When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins,


Paul is explaining that God did not make the Gentiles get circumcised before He would save them.

 

[God's Truth]

Ain't a MAD and or so called "MAD" who would dispute that - not - a - one.

Clearly, such as you and IP continue to misunderstand what either MADs are actually talking about.

But, you are where you are.

Romans 14:5 in memory of Romans 5:8.

What don't you get it is the scriptures that say JESUS is the good news.

Paul isn't the good news, and he doesn't have a better word than the Word when the Word came to this earth.

Jesus is grace and came with grace.

 

[God's Truth]

2 Corinthians 4:3-4 KJV

The gospel is hid because people love sin more than God.

 

[DougE]

While this is a good verse to use for salvation, technically, in Romans 10 look at verse 1 and note Paul is dealing with Israel.

Now look at verse 6. Paul is speaking of the righteousness of faith.

10:6 But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above

10:7 Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead.)

10:8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;

10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

Now look where else we see this; it is in Deuteronomy, to Israel;

30:11 For this commandment which I command thee this day, it is not hidden from thee, neither is it far off.

30:12 It is not in heaven, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go up for us to heaven, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it?

30:13 Neither is it beyond the sea, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go over the sea for us, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it?

30:14 But the word is very nigh unto thee, in thy mouth, and in thy heart, that thou mayest do it.

Here is the gospel we need to believe;

This is the gospel by which we are saved.

15:1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;

15:3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;

15:4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:
1 Corinthians 15

We are all sinners who can not save ourselves.

Christ died for our sins; He was our substitute, He paid the full penalty and debt for our sin by his blood sacrifice.

He was buried.

He rose again for our justification ( to declare us righteous) and forgiveness of all our sin. He gives us His righteousness and eternal life.

All we have to do is believe the gospel.

We don't need to confess or do anything but believe.

The moment you believe you have eternal life.

 

[Cross Reference]

While this is a good verse to use for salvation, technically, in Romans 10 look at verse 1 and note Paul is dealing with Israel.

Now look at verse 6. Paul is speaking of the righteousness of faith.

10:6 But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above

10:7 Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead.)

10:8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;

10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

Now look where else we see this; it is in Deuteronomy, to Israel;

30:11 For this commandment which I command thee this day, it is not hidden from thee, neither is it far off.

30:12 It is not in heaven, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go up for us to heaven, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it?

30:13 Neither is it beyond the sea, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go over the sea for us, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it?

30:14 But the word is very nigh unto thee, in thy mouth, and in thy heart, that thou mayest do it.

Here is the gospel we need to believe;

This is the gospel by which we are saved.

15:1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;

15:3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;

15:4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:
1 Corinthians 15

We are all sinners who can not save ourselves.

Christ died for our sins; He was our substitute, He paid the full penalty and debt for our sin by his blood sacrifice.

He was buried.

He rose again for our justification ( to declare us righteous) and forgiveness of all our sin. He gives us His righteousness and eternal life.

All we have to do is believe the gospel.

We don't need to confess or do anything but believe.

The moment you believe you have eternal life.

Please define "Believe".

 

[God's Truth]

While this is a good verse to use for salvation, technically, in Romans 10 look at verse 1 and note Paul is dealing with Israel.

Now look at verse 6. Paul is speaking of the righteousness of faith.

10:6 But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above

10:7 Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead.)

10:8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;

10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

Now look where else we see this; it is in Deuteronomy, to Israel;

30:11 For this commandment which I command thee this day, it is not hidden from thee, neither is it far off.

30:12 It is not in heaven, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go up for us to heaven, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it?

30:13 Neither is it beyond the sea, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go over the sea for us, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it?

30:14 But the word is very nigh unto thee, in thy mouth, and in thy heart, that thou mayest do it.

Here is the gospel we need to believe;

This is the gospel by which we are saved.

15:1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;

15:3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;

15:4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:
1 Corinthians 15

We are all sinners who can not save ourselves.

Christ died for our sins; He was our substitute, He paid the full penalty and debt for our sin by his blood sacrifice.

He was buried.

He rose again for our justification ( to declare us righteous) and forgiveness of all our sin. He gives us His righteousness and eternal life.

All we have to do is believe the gospel.

We don't need to confess or do anything but believe.

The moment you believe you have eternal life.

Oh DougE it is not true.

We have to have faith, but faith without works is dead and cannot save anyone.

We have to have faith, have faith about what? We have to have faith that Jesus' blood cleans us of the sins we repent of doing. That means we have to have faith and repent of our sins.

Jesus came to earth and told us how to be saved, we have to do what he says.

We all are sinners and can save ourselves by believing and obeying Christ.

Acts 2:40 With many other words he warned them; and he pleaded with them, "Save yourselves from this corrupt generation."

Paul is speaking of the ceremonial/purification works that no longer save. Paul would not ever tell anyone the secret to salvation is to have faith and be careful not to obey anything.

Your teaching goes against Jesus Christ and hinders people from being saved.

Jesus didn't come to earth and speak all those words he did just to have Paul nullify them all for all. You misunderstand Paul.

 

[heir]

Oh DougE it is not true.

Yes, it is. Romans 10 does have to do with Israel. In fact, Romans 9, 10 and 11 do. It is not a formula for our salvation. If one is looking for one, Ephesians 1:13 KJV shows it.

Ephesians 1:13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

The word of truth, the gospel of our salvation is too as DougE set forth...1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV

 

[heir]

We have to have faith, but faith without works is dead and cannot save anyone.

And STOP preaching doctrine that is contrary to our doctrine as if it's unto us when it's not.

 

[God's Truth]

And STOP preaching doctrine that is contrary to our doctrine as if it's unto us when it's not.

Jesus is Lord of Jews and Gentiles. Jesus' words are life for all. Jesus IS the Word of God.

 

[God's Truth]

Yes, it is. Romans 10 does have to do with Israel. In fact, Romans 9, 10 and 11 do. It is not a formula for our salvation. If one is looking for one, Ephesians 1:13 KJV shows it.

Ephesians 1:13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

The word of truth, the gospel of our salvation is too as DougE set forth...1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV

The gospel is Jesus dying for our sins. We must ask forgiveness for those sins and repent.

Acts 26:20 First to those in Damascus, then to those in Jerusalem and in all Judea, and to the Gentiles also, I preached that they should repent and turn to God and prove their repentance by their deeds.

Acts 17:30 Therefore, although God has overlooked such times of ignorance, he now commands all people everywhere to repent,

 

[musterion]

Rom 10:9-10 much more closely aligns with the disciples' indictments/sermons to Jews in early Acts than it does 1 Cor 15:3-4. The reason is, Israel's repentance to Messiah is the focus of Rom 10 and early Acts.

 

[heir]

We all are sinners and can save ourselves by believing and obeying Christ.

Acts 2:40 With many other words he warned them; and he pleaded with them, "Save yourselves from this corrupt generation."

That is not eternal salvation, but saving themselves from apostate Israel by being identified with Christ and proving thus, by water baptism for the remission of sins (Acts 2:36-38 KJV) looking forward to the blotting out of their sins (Acts 3:19-21 KJV). It has nothing to do with the gospel of OUR salvation (1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV) which was a mystery at that time (Romans 16:25-27 KJV, 2 Corinthians 2:6-8 KJV).

 

[musterion]

The gospel is Jesus dying for our sins. We must ask forgiveness for those sins and repent.

Acts 26:20 First to those in Damascus, then to those in Jerusalem and in all Judea, and to the Gentiles also, I preached that they should repent and turn to God and prove their repentance by their deeds.

Acts 17:30 Therefore, although God has overlooked such times of ignorance, he now commands all people everywhere to repent,

Peter didn't tell one person in Acts 2 that Christ had died for their sins and rose again for their justification. He did not say it...he did not assume they knew it...it had not already been preached...he did not know it himself because He hadn't told any of them the full scope of the Cross yet.

 

[Right Divider]

That is not eternal salvation, but saving themselves from apostate Israel by being identified with Christ and proving thus, by water baptism for the remission of sins (Acts 2:36-38 KJV) looking forward to the blotting out of their sins (Acts 3:19-21 KJV). It has nothing to do with the gospel of OUR salvation (1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV) which was a mystery at that time (Romans 16:25-27 KJV, 2 Corinthians 2:6-8 KJV).

This is quite typical of her "understanding" of the Bible.

 

[heir]

Jesus is Lord of Jews and Gentiles. Jesus' words are life for all. Jesus IS the Word of God.

The Lord on earth was not sent to us, but these (Matthew 15:24 KJV) as this (Romans 15:8 KJV). James (that you were misquoting and misapplying as to us) is not the apostle of the Gentiles. Paul is (Romans 11:13 KJV). Follow him in doctrine (1 Corinthians 4:15-16 KJV).