ECT WHAT ACTS 2:28 REALLY MEANS !!
- Thread starter DAN P
- Start date
It is not one or the other.
It is both plus---
1Jn 5:5 Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God?
1Jn 5:6 This is he that came by water and blood, even Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth.
Read all through Acts.
They were all baptized in water.
It must be important to God.
LA
lifeisgood
New member
It is not he who “does,” but he who “believes” that is saved.
Living Word becoming flesh [Jn. 1:1, 4] symbolized by “water” and then as the Lamb of God who took away the sin of the world, which was effected by the shedding of His blood on the Cross of Calvary.
Incarnation within itself, although absolutely necessary, was not enough. The phrase testifies to the absolute necessity of the Atonement.
The Holy Spirit bore witness to the divine birth of Christ, and to the divine sacrifice of Christ [Mat. 1:18; Heb. 9:14].)
turbosixx
New member
This is how you twist the word. You can't take it as written, you have to re-write it.
3And he said, "Into what then were you baptized?"
If baptism(HS) happens at belief, why ask "Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?"
turbosixx
New member
Good luck with that. I've done my duty.
lifeisgood
New member
Which was?
lifeisgood
New member
And they answered, "Paul, No, we have not even heard whether there is a Holy Spirit."
TRANSLATION: If we have not even heard whether there is a Holy Spirit, how can we receive Him?
Interplanner
Well-known member
This is part of the proof of Jn 16:13 that the Spirit does not speak of himself. The Spirit of God does not speak of the Spirit's work. The Spirit of God speaks of the work accomplished by the Son. He glorifies Christ. This orientation is why you have the apostles at work in places and the people have become Christians but don't know about the Spirit of God. That does not mean the Spirit was not at work, because they believe. It means that the categories of Jn 16:13 were kept intact.
turbosixx
New member
To help you see things objectively instead of subjectively. My conscience is clear.
turbosixx
New member
I would suggest that you have a misconception of grace. Grace is unmerited favor but in order to be saved by grace we must obey God. God’s grace shows us the path of salvation, but we must walk the path. Jesus's work is finished, but that's where ours begins.
Couple of examples, Noah received grace but in order to save himself and his family he had to do obey.
Gen. 6:7 And the Lord said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them. 8 But Noah found grace in the eyes of the Lord.
God’s grace warned Noah of the pending destruction and gave him a way of “salvation”.
Heb. 11:7 By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house;
Grace through faith.
Another example, the Passover which is a shadow of how Christ’s blood saves us.
21 Then Moses called for all the elders of Israel, and said unto them, Draw out and take you a lamb according to your families, and kill the passover. 22 And ye shall take a bunch of hyssop, and dip it in the blood that is in the basin, and strike the lintel and the two side posts with the blood that is in the basin; and none of you shall go out at the door of his house until the morning. 23 For the Lord will pass through to smite the Egyptians; and when he seeth the blood upon the lintel, and on the two side posts, the Lord will pass over the door, and will not suffer the destroyer to come in unto your houses to smite you.
Yes, Jesus sacrifice was sufficient to save our souls, but how is his blood applied to each individual? In our case, the lamb offered himself and his blood is in the basin waiting to be applied. Once he offered himself, how does he tell us to be saved, effectively applying his blood to the lintel and side posts?
Mark 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
Grace teaches us the path of salvation, but we must walk it by obeying it’s instructions. For conversion and how to live.
Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men, 12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;
What happens to those who do not obey the gospel.
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
This is my current understanding of grace.
heir
TOL Subscriber
I suggest you stop flaunting the big ole "but" of religion. It is contrary to the dispensation of the grace of God. It is you who do not understand grace. Just look at you comparing the gift of God given by grace through the faith of Jesus Christ and His finished work on the cross in our place with something that you think we should do to be saved. pathetic
turbosixx
New member
Can you find one NT writer that talked about the "finished work" on the cross. Those are man's words.
heir
TOL Subscriber
I'm speaking of the faith of Jesus Christ and the event of the cross and what it accomplished for us. Search out those terms!
turbosixx
New member
I understand what your implying by "finished work". We use words and phrases to convey thoughts and concepts. If the words are changed the concepts change. Here is an example of changing punctuation to change the meaning from the Jehovah Witnesses.
Luke 23:43 And He said to him, "Truly I say to you, today you shall be with Me in Paradise."
They move the comma to after today so Jesus is telling him today and not that today he would be in paradise to support their beliefs.
"Truly I say to you today, you shall be with Me in Paradise."
Man has taken Jesus' words "it is finished" and built a concept around it. I hear it all the time "finished work of Jesus", but I never read it from inspired writers.
I think it's best if we take the word as written. If we try to "interpret" that is where we can go off course.
lifeisgood
New member
How can grace be UNmerited favor (which is correct) but I have to do something (be water baptized) to be afforded that UNmerited favor?
You, I, and every body else in the whole world that has ever been saved have NEVER OBEYED God TO BE SAVED. Never.
That is why it is called UNmerited favor.
Salvation is ALL of God and ABSOLUTELY NOTHING of us.
Nothing of us.
Absolutely nothing of us.
If 'water baptism' has to be added for a sinner to be saved then you are saying that Jesus Christ and what He did at the Cross of Calvary was not enough / was not a completed/finished work / and we have to add our being water baptized to finish the already finished/completed work of God.
Last edited:
lifeisgood
New member
heir
TOL Subscriber
I'm not implying. I'm emphatically stating:
that Christ died for our sins is the work of our salvation that is finished!
Romans 4:25 KJV, Romans 6:23 KJV, 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV, Colossians 2:10-13 KJV
Salvation is NOT by something we can do, will do or won't do. It's by what God through the faith of Jesus Christ did!
2 Corinthians 5:19 KJV, 2 Corinthians 5:21 KJV, Ephesians 2:4-9 KJV, Titus 3:4-7 KJV
God's Truth
New member
That scripture is about Jesus fulfilling the Law and the Prophets.
That scripture is NOT about humans not having to obey God anymore.
God's Truth
New member
No one is saved unless they do what the Way says; which goes against what you just stated.
Jesus says to believe and repent of our sins, and call on his name.
Those who obey are the ones that love him and will be loved by the Father; THAT IS WHAT THE BIBLE SAYS.
Those who obey are the ones that are given the Holy Spirit.
Those who obey are Jesus' family.
Those who obey are Jesus' friends.
I just told you what scriptures say.
Are you going to believe the scriptures or or you going to keep fighting for what you decided was the truth?