These are NOT the same gospel

[Idolater]

ROFL!
It sounds just as useless and unresponsive when you say it as it does when they say it!!!!
I honestly don't know how anyone thinks that is any kind of an actual response, because saying it doesn't make it false either.
But you hear that silly ass platitude alllllllllllll the time in discussions.

You're right. It's unpersuasive.

It's because they have a lack of understanding of the old testament prophesy of the new covenant, or else they just forgot that Gentiles were included.
Just as Gentiles were included in being circumcised of the heart and having gifts of the Spirit.

If we were to try to 'piece together' the New Covenant from just the Old Testament, what would we 'come up' with?

It's a good thing that God did not leave that task for us to do, instead He provided Twelve Apostles. He trained them and taught them intensively, Personally (the Son). They teach the New Covenant; we do not teach the New Covenant ourselves, based on our own private understanding of the Old Testament record of the New Covenant; we are taught by the Apostles about the New Covenant.

Wherever we think the Apostles got it wrong, and that we instead are the correct interpreters of the New Covenant, we need to 'prune' that branch right off of our personalities. It is self-defeating to think we can ever rise above the Twelve Apostles in terms of who's correctly preaching and teaching the New Covenant.

Edit: We ought to just form our thoughts in their mold, as far as I'm concerned.

 

[Right Divider]

Saying it doesn't make it so.

You gave no argument against what I said. That's very telling.

 

[glorydaz]

Your faith has to endure also.

Saying it doesn't make it so.

And in this case, you're dead wrong.
It is extremely unsettling when believers have no assurance of their salvation.
Their trust and faith is in themselves rather than the Lord's work on the cross.
No assurance.....no salvation.

 

[Tambora]

If we were to try to 'piece together' the New Covenant from just the Old Testament, what would we 'come up' with?

All believers of all nations united.

It's a good thing that God did not leave that task for us to do, instead He provided Twelve Apostles. He trained them and taught them intensively, Personally (the Son). They teach the New Covenant; we do not teach the New Covenant ourselves, based on our own private understanding of the Old Testament record of the New Covenant; we are taught by the Apostles about the New Covenant.

Wherever we think the Apostles got it wrong, and that we instead are the correct interpreters of the New Covenant, we need to 'prune' that branch right off of our personalities. It is self-defeating to think we can ever rise above the Twelve Apostles in terms of who's correctly preaching and teaching the New Covenant.

Edit: We ought to just form our thoughts in their mold, as far as I'm concerned.

Agreed.
The apostles make it all about Christ as head of all believers of all nations, not Israel vs. Gentiles.

 

[glorydaz]

You're right. It's unpersuasive.

If we were to try to 'piece together' the New Covenant from just the Old Testament, what would we 'come up' with?

It's a good thing that God did not leave that task for us to do, instead He provided Twelve Apostles. He trained them and taught them intensively, Personally (the Son). They teach the New Covenant; we do not teach the New Covenant ourselves, based on our own private understanding of the Old Testament record of the New Covenant; we are taught by the Apostles about the New Covenant.

Wherever we think the Apostles got it wrong, and that we instead are the correct interpreters of the New Covenant, we need to 'prune' that branch right off of our personalities. It is self-defeating to think we can ever rise above the Twelve Apostles in terms of who's correctly preaching and teaching the New Covenant.

Edit: We ought to just form our thoughts in their mold, as far as I'm concerned.

What you fail to see is that the New Covenant was put on hold because the Jews crucified their King when He came.
They were supposed to be the light unto the gentiles. They failed.
So, the church age has to be completed before the New Covenant with the Jews can even begin.

 

[Tambora]

Saying it doesn't make it so.

You just don't understand scripture.
ROFL!

And in this case, you're dead wrong.

Hardly.
You believe the same, that one's faith must endure to be saved.
You just say it differently by saying that if they quit having faith then they were not saved to begin with.
Which is just another way to say their faith did not endure.

 

[glorydaz]

All believers of all nations united.



Agreed.
The apostles make it all about Christ as head of all believers of all nations, not Israel vs. Gentiles.

You like to jump to the end of all things, and we aren't in the fulness of time yet.

You're wrong, though, the Apostles made it all about the Kingdom on earth with Christ as King.
Show some scripture, girl. Don't be lazy. Support some of this nonsense you're preaching so boldly.

 

[glorydaz]

You just don't understand scripture.
ROFL!


Hardly.
You believe the same, that one's faith must endure to be saved.
You just say it differently by saying that if they quit having faith then they were not saved to begin with.
Which is just another way to say their faith did not endure.

NO, I do not say that. Total bull.

I say, and have said repeatedly, HE IS ABLE. Not I am able.

Philippians 1:6
Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:

So when we stand before the throne, Tam can say she endured....boasting in her own salvation.

 

[glorydaz]

You gave no argument against what I said. That's very telling.

Her new MO. Lots of talk, but no scripture backing it up.

 

[Idolater]

All believers of all nations united.



Agreed.
The apostles make it all about Christ as head of all believers of all nations, not Israel vs. Gentiles.

Yeah basically agreed.

 

[Idolater]

What you fail to see is that the New Covenant was put on hold because the Jews crucified their King when He came.
They were supposed to be the light unto the gentiles. They failed.
So, the church age has to be completed before the New Covenant with the Jews can even begin.

We had a whole thread about that. It was never resolved, it's still an open question whether something called an "eternal" covenant could ever be 'put on hold' or 'paused' or anything like that. It was certainly never positively proved in or with any scripture.

 

[Tambora]

You gave no argument against what I said. That's very telling.

Saying it doesn't make it so.

 

[Tambora]

NO, I do not say that. Total bull.

I say, and have said repeatedly, HE IS ABLE. Not I am able.

Philippians 1:6
Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:

So when we stand before the throne, Tam can say she endured....boasting in her own salvation.

Really?
Did not Christ began a good work with the 12 apostles?

 

[Tambora]

Her new MO. Lots of talk, but no scripture backing it up.

I've posted plenty of scripture, just to have you say I was reading it wrong.
It is you that reads it wrong.
We can go back and forth with this type of argument till the cows come home.

 

[Tambora]

You like to jump to the end of all things, and we aren't in the fulness of time yet.

It was the plan from beginning to end.
The plan never wavered.

You're wrong, though, the Apostles made it all about the Kingdom on earth with Christ as King.

The kingdom on earth was for all nations.

Show some scripture, girl. Don't be lazy. Support some of this nonsense you're preaching so boldly.

You wouldn't understand the scriptures.

 

[musterion]

No Gentile nor Jew has any covenant with God during this dispensation. No covenant is needed because His grace is sufficient.

If you disagree with that...well...

 

[glorydaz]

We had a whole thread about that. It was never resolved, it's still an open question whether something called an "eternal" covenant could ever be 'put on hold' or 'paused' or anything like that. It was certainly never positively proved in or with any scripture.

Well then we need to look at it again with fresh eyes. I think what Paul says in Romans 11 makes it very clear.

 

[glorydaz]

Really?
Did not Christ began a good work with the 12 apostles?

And you don't think they fulfilled their role?

 

[glorydaz]

I've posted plenty of scripture, just to have you say I was reading it wrong.
It is you that reads it wrong.
We can go back and forth with this type of argument till the cows come home.

Of course we can when you argue who the "we" is talking about, instead of showing scripture that proves your claim about Peter knowing about justification through faith because he was a Jew.

 

[Tambora]

And you don't think they fulfilled their role?

I think both Peter and Paul were fulfilling their role to bring men from all nations to Christ since they both knew that was the desire of God.