The Politically Incorrect Truth About American Indians

[drbrumley]

Yes, I've seen that before - it uses the term "red-skin" to describe the individual, much as the native americans did and still do.

It does NOT refer to their scalps or other body parts to be turned in for a bounty

No, but there certainly was the appetite for it..

On the morning that Chivington’s raiders appeared outside the camp, Black Kettle raised the U.S. flag provided to him by Army commanders who promised to protect his band during their winter encampment. Neither the flag nor the promises it represented were honored by Chivington and his Colorado Volunteers. The ensuing slaughter, wrote Hampton Sides in Blood and Thunder: An Epic of the American West, “is now widely regarded as the worst atrocity committed in all the Indian wars.”At the time, however, Chivington and his men were embraced as heroes by the fine “Christian” people of Denver: “Chivington returned to Denver in triumph. At a theater his men paraded their war trophies before the cheering crowds: Scalps, fingers, tobacco pouches made from scrotums, purses of stretched pudenda hacked from Cheyenne women. The Denver newspapers praised the Colorado Volunteers for their glorious victory.” “Posterity will speak of me as the great Indian fighter,” boasted Chivington. “I have eclipsed Kit Carson.” Carson, who fought Indian warriors in actual military engagements before becoming thoroughly disillusioned with Manifest Destiny, had nothing but frigid contempt for “that dirty dog Chivington and his dirty hounds … up at Sand Creek.” “His men shot down squaws, and blew the brains out of little innocent children,” Carson complained in a letter to Army Inspector Col. James Rusling. “You call such soldiers Christians…? And Indians savages? What do you suppose our Heavenly Father, who made both them and us, thinks of these things? I tell you what, I don’t like a hostile Redskin any more than you do. And when they are hostile, I’ve fought ’em, hard as any man. But I never yet drew bead on a squaw or a papoose, and I despise the man who would. I’ve seen as much of ’em as any man livin’, and I can’t help but pity ’em, right or wrong. They once owned this country…. But now they own next door to nothing, and will soon be gone.”

 

[drbrumley]

Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior
There's no denying that. Why is it that you won't admit the fact that the American Indian played a part in it's near extinction as well?



280,000 bison/buffalo killed each year by the Comanche (which doesn't include the numbers killed by the other Midwestern tribes), does sound rather excessive.

Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior
BTW, the Comanche population at that time was anywhere from 7,000 to 30,000. Why was it necessary for them to kill 280,000 buffalo/bison a year?




The things one learns on the internet. When the most barbaric tribe of all of the Indian tribes (the Comanche) weren't butchering their fellow Indians, they were playing Mother Theresa and feeding the poor.

Regarding "they used almost every bit of the buffalo".

This post shows differently:

Similarly, where game was plentiful, Indians used only the choicest cuts and left the rest.
When buffalo were herded over cliffs, tons of meat were left to rot or to be eaten by scavengers (see Baden, Stroup, and Thurman 1981).
Samuel Hearne, a fur trader near Hudson’s Bay, recorded in his journal in the 1770s that the Chipewayan Indians would slaughter large numbers of caribou and muskox, eat only a few tongues, and leave the rest to rot.
http://theologyonline.com/showthrea...ican-Indians&p=5352896&viewfull=1#post5352896

Yep, the things ACW learns on the internet.

 

[aCultureWarrior]

Originally Posted by annabenedetti
Stupid white men on trains.

Close...though that did indeed happen....shooting buffalo from trains for sport.

Because herding buffalo over cliffs is so much more "sporty".

 

[drbrumley]

Is he really this dense?

 

[aCultureWarrior]

No, but there certainly was the appetite for it..

On the morning that Chivington’s raiders appeared outside the camp, Black Kettle raised the U.S. flag provided to him by Army commanders who promised to protect his band during their winter encampment.

Please do try and stay up with the posts in this thread. http://theologyonline.com/showthrea...ican-Indians&p=5352841&viewfull=1#post5352841

 

[drbrumley]

Please do try and stay up with the posts in this thread.

http://theologyonline.com/showthrea...ican-Indians&p=5352841&viewfull=1#post5352841

I dont believe I was talking to you...

 

[aCultureWarrior]

Is he really this dense?

Now those are some real sportsmen.

 

[drbrumley]

Please do try and stay up with the posts in this thread.

http://theologyonline.com/showthrea...ican-Indians&p=5352841&viewfull=1#post5352841

I see now....thanks for helping me out here....Chivington and his men, and the Colorado governor were absolutely correct to kill every last indian in Colorado to make up for the deaths of those innocent people...

No doubt the right call...

 

[aCultureWarrior]

I see now....thanks for helping me out here....Chivington and his men, and the Colorado governor were absolutely correct to kill every last indian in Colorado to make up for the deaths of those innocent people...

No doubt the right call...

One must remember that the savage Indians were murdering settlers throughout the United States and that the barbaric murder of this particular family wasn't a sole occurrence.

 

[drbrumley]

One must remember that the savage Indians were murdering settlers throughout the United States and that the barbaric murder of this particular family wasn't a sole occurrence.

:up: Yep, those savages.....

 

[aCultureWarrior]

:up: Yep, those savages.....

Irving Howbert, an 18-year-old cavalryman who later became one of the founders of Colorado Springs, long defended Chivington's role in the events. In his autobiographical Memories of a Lifetime in the Pike's Peak Region, Howbert argues that the Indian women and children were not attacked, but a few who did not leave the camp were killed once the fighting began. He said that the number of warriors in the village was about equal to the force of the Colorado cavalry. According to Howbert, Chivington was retaliating for Indian attacks on wagon trains and settlements in Colorado and for the torture and the killings of citizens during the preceding three years; evidence of attacks on the white settlers – including "more than a dozen scalps of white people, some of them from the heads of women and children" – was found in the Indian camp after the battle.[10]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Chivington

Don't cha just hate it when the other side of the story is told?

Can we agree on the term barbaric savages?

 

[drbrumley]

Those primitive, backwards Neanderthals thwarting progress....and God forbid, Christianity...how dare they?

 

[Gary K]

The Indians slaughtered, i.e. killed off, the buffalo through wasting it. What a moronic statement. When the white man showed up the buffalo were everywhere. They ranged as far east as Kentucky and all the way to the Rocky Mountains and from down into what is now Mexico north into what is now Canada.. The buffalo flat out thrived when there were only Indians on the continent.

The Comanches killed 280,000 buffalo? LOL. Is that all? Where did you get your stats? That you think that is an excessive slaughter of the buffalo shows your ignorance. The mainstay of the Comanche diet was buffalo meat. They used the hides for bedding and shelter. How long do you think a single buffalo would last in a village of 200 warriors? That means the total population of that village was probably 800-1000 people. And the Comanche didn't have an idle lifestyle. They burned calories like they were going out of style. They didn't go sit behind a desk and look at a computer screen all day. They were continually burning calories. Ever rode a horse 12 or 14 hours a day? How about walked 10 to 20 miles all the while bending, stooping, digging, while in the process of finding herbs, wild edible plant life including edible roots which were dug up with a stick not a metal shovel. I would not be surprised at all to learn that the average adult Indian burned 5000 calories a day, or more. How about having to scrape a buffalo hide and tan it. It's hard work. It's an extremely active life the NA Indians lived.

You look at your own life style and go from there rather than looking at how the Indian lived, putting yourself in his place, and use that as your starting point. All I did here was barely scratch the surface of how the Indian lived and what his dietary needs were, and how many uses the Indian had for different parts of a buffalo. Buffalo robes were an important part of the wealth of an Indian. They didn't waste them. If they did they froze, went hungry, exposed themselves to elements, all winter long.

The Indian actually threw away very little of a buffalo. They used the intestines, the sinews, the bones, the meat, the hide, the brains, the blood, and more that I can't remember off the top of my head. The white man? He killed the buffalo, skinned it, and left the rest to rot. Oh, he might take the tongue and the hump out of 2 or 3 of the 50 to 100 buffalo he killed in a day,as those were considered choice cuts by buffalo hunters, but that was it. Out of the 1500 lbs a buffalo weighed the buffalo hunters wasted all but the 100lbs or so of hide.

This entire thread is just another troll as all you have is the merest of surface information and knowledge and then proclaim yourself to have a very informed position. ***rolls eyes***

 

[ok doser]

I'm reminded of the viewers first introduction to the character of Tywin Lannister, the power behind the throne in Game of Thrones. He's talking strategy and tactics with his idiot son, all the while up to his elbows in gore, skinning a deer/elk.


Warning, may not be appropriate - language, images:

Spoiler

Men who lived like this, up to their elbows in gore, didn't think of their enemies as human, just as obstructions to be overcome.

This applies equally to indians and colonials/settlers, by the way.

Yes, they were brutal and savage.

Yes, we were brutal and savage.

We won.

Get over it.

 

[aCultureWarrior]

I'm reminded of the viewers first introduction to the character of Tywin Lannister, the power behind the throne in Game of Thrones.

First Steve Martin and John Candy in Plains, Trains and Automobiles, and now Game of Thrones? I guess when the evidence of American Indian savagery is presented and can't be defended, why not change the subject and talk about movies?

 

[aCultureWarrior]

The Indians slaughtered, i.e. killed off, the buffalo through wasting it. What a moronic statement. When the white man showed up the buffalo were everywhere. They ranged as far east as Kentucky and all the way to the Rocky Mountains and from down into what is now Mexico north into what is now Canada.. The buffalo flat out thrived when there were only Indians on the continent.

Already addressed in an earlier post.

Interestingly enough, the rise of the American buffalo may have coincided with the fall of the Native American tribes. According to this theory, put forth by Charles Mann, the Native Americans originally created grasslands for the buffalo population and heavily regulated their activities.
“Hernando De Soto’s expedition staggered through the Southeast for four years in the early 16th century and saw hordes of people but apparently did not see a single bison.” ~ Charles Mann, 1491: New Revelations of the Americas Before Columbus
When the Europeans first arrived in the New World, they inadvertently brought along diseases with them. Native Americans died off in massive numbers and buffalo herds found themselves free. They began to roam and quickly spread across the land, eventually becoming the most dominant large animal in what is now the United States.
http://theologyonline.com/showthrea...ican-Indians&p=5353388&viewfull=1#post5353388

The Comanches killed 280,000 buffalo? LOL.

A year.

Is that all?

That's a lot of buffalo to sportingly herd over cliffs.

Where did you get your stats?

I addressed it in an earlier post. Being that this is a short thread as it is, please do your homework before you write.

And the Comanche didn't have an idle lifestyle. They burned calories like they were going out of style. They didn't go sit behind a desk and look at a computer screen all day. They were continually burning calories. Ever rode a horse 12 or 14 hours a day?

While I can't speak from experience, I would imagine disemboweling and scalping women and children would cause a savage to work up a robust appetite.

The Indian actually threw away very little of a buffalo.

Historians have stated differently. Again, that topic was already discussed in earlier posts.

This entire thread is just another troll as all you have is the merest of surface information and knowledge and then proclaim yourself to have a very informed position. ***rolls eyes***

I realize that as an American Indian that this thread is very offensive to you Aar...ahem, ffreeloader, but since liberalism has taken over the history books, you won't read or hear this information unless you make special efforts to seek it out.

 

[aCultureWarrior]

The insanity continues...

David Hogg: Today’s Mass Shootings Stem from America’s ‘Indigenous Mass Shootings’ and ‘White Supremacy’

Sept. 6, 2019

Friday on MSNBC’s All In, March for Our Lives co-founder David Hogg discussed what he believed was the origin of mass shootings in the United States.
Hogg said, “I think it comes down to reckoning with our history and our history of white supremacy in the United States. The fact that we live in a post-genocidal society oftentimes that was orchestrated by the United States government in that if we want to talk about mass shootings, we need to recognize the massive number of indigenous mass shootings that was conducted by the United States government. I think back to the battle of Wounded-Knee and the several hundred Native Americans, predominately men, woman, and children that were slaughtered by the United States government back in the nineteenth century. And how that is never discussed as a mass shooting. And that was wrong because those people were not armed, and we were stealing their land.”
https://www.breitbart.com/politics/...ingenious-mass-shootings-and-white-supremacy/

 

[aCultureWarrior]

I want to talk more about the battle at Wounded-Knee. Back with that later.

 

[aCultureWarrior]

Unburying the Truth at Wounded Knee

Rosemary W. Pennington · 21 June, 2015

A firsthand report from an army officer who was there
Introduction: John Greenway, Professor of Anthropology at the University of Colorado and a specialist in the history of American Indians has found thirteen errors on the first page of the introduction to Dee Brown’s bestseller Bury My Heart at Wounded Knee. He also has evidence that the author plagiarized two chapters of the book. As an antidote to this barefaced tour de force of Redskin propaganda, we reprint a letter to the Cavalry Journal on April 5, 1938 by Colonel Harry L. Hawthorne (pictured), who was awarded the Congressional Medal of Honor for his bravery at the Wounded Knee shootout.

AS A PARTICIPANT in the engagement at Wounded Knee Creek, I will quote freely from a report made by me in 1931 to the Historical Division of the War Department. In this engagement my station was on a low hill overlooking the camp occupied by the Indians, and from which I could view the disposition of our troops, and every detail of events which led up to the opening of the fight, and the final dispersion and pursuit of the Indians...

The night passed peacefully, during which the third squadron of the Seventh Cavalry with General Forsyth arrived and additional artillery under Captain Caprom. Major Whitside, having learned that Big Foot was ill, sent the surgeon of the command to visit him. He was suffering from pneumonia and was attended by our surgeon several times during the night.

The Indian men had been summoned to a powwow and leaving their tepees they appeared wrapped in their blankets, with their arms concealed under them, a fact unknown to our Commanding Officer at the time. They sat down in the open space within their camp and during the talk, details from the cavalry passed among the tepees looking for their arms. This resultless search proved that the Indians had their rifles with them and they were called upon to give them up as a preliminary to terms of surrender. Big Foot, lying on a litter, had been brought out of his tepee at the first gathering of his men and was present among them during the entire scene. While waiting for a decision by the Indians their Medicine Man began a dance and chant. A few minutes after this, our interpreter, much alarmed, reported to General Forsyth that he was inciting his people to arise and attack the whites and that their ghost shirts would protect them from the bullets of the soldiers. In a moment the Indians were on their feet pouring volley after volley into two troops of dismounted cavalry standing near and in close order. This sudden, wholly unexpected and unprovoked attack by the Indians was so fierce and overwhelming that the ranks of the soldiers facing them melted away with scarcely a shot in reply leaving about twenty-five dead and thirty-five wounded on the field.…

The fight at Wounded Knee was wholly unnecessary. There was no act nor demand by the army which could have justified this violent and savage attack by the Indians. All that was asked of them was that they return to the reservation and that they surrender their arms as an act of good faith.
Very truly, H. L. Hawthorne
As a postscript to Wounded Knee, we turn to Brigadier General S.L.A. Marshall, one of America’s foremost military historians and himself part Indian:
There is no doubt who started that day’s fight, though it is often called a massacre. Forsyth may have been clumsy and his soldiers have been rude and provocative, but deliberate Sioux action, so timed as to indicate that it had been well plotted, initiated the slaughter. Bury My Heart at Wounded Knee may be a lovely phrase. [It was cooked up by the Majority renegade poet Stephen Vincent Benet.] It is still a false and misleading sentiment, dignifying conspiracy and honoring treachery.

Source: Instauration magazine, January 1977

Read more: https://nationalvanguard.org/2015/06/unburying-the-truth-at-wounded-knee/

 

[annabenedetti]

Source: Instauration magazine, January 1977

Why am I not surprised that both your sources are from white supremacist/white nationalist publications...

Instauration is not brilliant, intelligent or witty. It is a vulgar hate sheet. Nearly every article is filled with racist venom.

There will be no black progress, said one article, "until someone tells us how you can get inside genes and do a little redesigning." It said "walls should be erected around such cities as New York, Philadelphia, Detroit and Los Angeles to bottle up non-whites."

Harvey Milk, the San Francisco city councilman murdered by Dan White, was reviled as "another dead Jewish 'hero' . . . the faggot councilman." Accounts of Nazi genocide are "Holocaust atrocity-mongering." Jeane Kirkpatrick was castigated for defending Israel and urged to "stop pounding the drums for someone else's race and start pounding the drums for your own." Rep. Newt Gingrich, R-Ga., was suspected of being contaminated by Jewish ancestry and was criticized for hiring a black staff aide. Instauration said he is one of those conservatives who "couldn't care less about the tragic racial transformation of their country wrought by high non-white birthrates and vast torrents of legal and illegal non-white immigrants."

One conservative who gets different treatment is Sobran. In September 1985, Instauration ran an article titled "The Brave Pen of Joseph Sobran," which said he "has repeatedly defended white racial pride and solidarity."

Sobran isn't to blame for that article. But he is to blame for aligning himself with vicious hate-mongers who advocate race war and regret the defeat of Hitler. There is no way to praise a magazine like Instauration without being implicated in its vile fantasies.

In a telephone interview, Sobran conceded that Instauration is "racist" and insisted his praise of it was not "unqualified." But he declined to recant the complimentary words he wrote about the magazine. His only violation, he said, is one of "etiquette."


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Instauration was a monthly magazine published from December 1975 through February 2000, ending with volume 25, issue 3. It was published by Wilmot Robertson(Sumner Humphrey Ireland), who also wrote The Dispossessed Majority (1973) and The Ethnostate (1992).

The Dispossessed Majority was decried as a white supremacist book when notice of it was mailed to students at the Marist School and the Lovett School in 1987.The magazine and Robertson's books share much in common. The editorial office of Instauration was in Cape Canaveral, Florida, and the publisher was Howard Allen Enterprises, Inc.

Instauration was a magazine with diverse coverage, including economic theory, social commentary, international trends, literary pieces, and letters to the editor. Many people found the subject matter distasteful, and as a result, authorship was often anonymous or pseudonymous. For those who approve of eugenics, historical revisionism, and discussions of the racial makeup of populations, the writing of Instauration was very pleasing. But many would characterize the publication as promoting racism and Holocaust denial. Instauration also published numerous articles arguing that Christianity was a contrived religion.

Mitch Berbrier, in an article titled "Impression Management for the Thinking Racist", characterizes the effort embodied in the magazine as "stigma transformation", intended "to present an intellectualized rhetoric of racism and white supremacy".


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Read more: https://nationalvanguard.org/2015/06/unburying-the-truth-at-wounded-knee/

National Vanguard was a magazine published by the National Vanguard Books, Inc., a non-profit corporation linked to the National Alliance. It is a follow-up of the publication Attack!. National Vanguard's first editor was William Luther Pierce, the founder of the National Alliance. The magazine covers issues from a white nationalist perspective. The headquarters of the magazine was originally based in Arlington County, Virginia and later relocated with National Alliance offices to Hillsboro, West Virginia.



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