Do most guys? That is the part that seems to intentionally missed (by some) in this discussion.
On Deservedness
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Do most guys? That is the part that seems to intentionally missed (by some) in this discussion.
glorydaz
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Rewards are earned. We deserve what we have earned. Rewards can be either bad or good. We see when Alexander did Paul "much evil", Paul asked or stated the "Lord reward him according to his works." Paul didn't request or expect any particular "reward" for the evil that was done him, because he knew that was the Lord's own business to decide what that "reward" would be.
2 Tim. 4:14
Alexander the coppersmith did me much evil: the Lord reward him according to his works:
Alexander the coppersmith did me much evil: the Lord reward him according to his works:
Girls who "act slutty" at parties reap all kinds of "rewards" for their bad behavior. Some are raped. Some have to walk home. Some have to live with a ruined reputation. Rape is just ONE of the possible consequences for bad behavior.
No, most do not. I guess I have a problem with both; deserve and earn.
expect expected - certain expectations. That's better than earn or deserve
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
| Psalm 118:24 This is the day which the Lord hath made; we will rejoice and be glad in it. |
they're all His, kmo
Considering the offense (rape), the terms were used to create conflict. I am glad you see the problem with both of them being used in this context.
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
i was just about to respond in a similar manner :thumb:
We don't know what Paul meant by it though. He could have meant in the final judgment. And we also don't know how Paul would have reacted had something bad happened to Alexander a couple days later. Would he have said, 'You deserved it Alexander, God is punishing you'. :idunno:
Rape isn't like the other things you mention though. Walking home could be a direct result of her turning down or missing a ride. A ruined reputation would be a direct result of her acting slutty. Being raped is not a direct result of acting slutty. Someone makes a decision to sexually assault the girl. Something that I wouldn't consider a natural consequence of her behavior.
EDIT: And to follow up on that with a quote from Trad from another post....
Traditio said:
:thumb: A good thing to remember. However, 'Day of the Lord' still means a specific thing in certain contexts.
glorydaz
Well-known member
He wouldn't have meant final judgment because we are not punished according to our works but for our unbelief. I never said we should go up to a stripper who had been raped and tell her she got what she deserved. We are discussing reaping what we sow on an internet forum.
Being raped could very well be the result of a woman acting slutty. I don't know why that is so hard for people to admit.
Trad made some good points, but all his points weren't addressed in that one section. Nor does what he says there mean there are no other legitimate points of view.
Rom 2:6 Who will render to every man according to his deeds:
I might accept using the concept of reaping/sowing. Still nothing about deserving or earning. As I said before, I don't think sowing/reaping necessarily means deserved.
And I don't know why it's so hard to admit the opposite. :idunno:
glorydaz
Well-known member
I didn't say they were unbelief, PJ. If you can't follow the conversation, it's best to not jump in as if you had a reason to be speaking.
You can't get enough of me :chuckle:
No, you showed we aren't judged on works, therefore God does not judge and punish strippers in the here and now. Try and keep up with reality.
glorydaz
Well-known member
Paul was speaking of when righteousness came from the law. Paul then goes on to say this...."BUT NOW the righteousness of God without the law is manifested...." and "To declare, AT THIS TIME...."
Romans 3:21-22 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:
Romans 3:26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.
Romans 3:26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.
So let's just back up to the verse I was citing. I said Paul would not have been talking about the final judgment, because the final judgment will be based on whether men are believers or unbelievers. Paul speaks of the evil the coppersmith did to him (personally), and asks that the Lord reward him according to his works. I'm sure we can agree that Paul was not being spiteful and damning Alexander as an unbeliever wanting the Lord to send him to hell. Rather, he was asking the Lord to have him suffer consequences right here on earth so that he would learn that doing evil does not pay.
2 Timothy 4:14
Alexander the coppersmith did me much evil: the Lord reward him according to his works:
Alexander the coppersmith did me much evil: the Lord reward him according to his works:
We see a similar thing here....which speaks to the value of reaping what we sow right here in this life.
1 Corinthians 5:1-2
It is reported commonly that there is fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father's wife. And ye are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he that hath done this deed might be taken away from among you.
1 Cor. 5:5 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.
It is reported commonly that there is fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father's wife. And ye are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he that hath done this deed might be taken away from among you.
1 Cor. 5:5 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.
Consequences for one's actions are always deserved. Actions have consequences. They may be unintended consequences, but that doesn't remove the fact that they have been earned by the very doing of them.
I can't "admit" something that isn't true. :idunno:
glorydaz
Well-known member
Nonsense, I've had more than enough of you. Be gone if you're going to keep acting the fool.
Arthur Brain
Well-known member
You are on record for saying that "sluts" deserve rape on here GD, are you going to deny that?
Nobody's advocating that it's a great idea to get sloshed and strip off at a frat party or some equivalent but then she still doesn't deserve it. Is a fashion model asking to get stalked or attacked because she models bikinis and lingerie for magazines?
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
borderline retarded, considering what you're responding to
not retarded :noway:
wrong, but still not retarded :thumb:
ohhhhhhhhhh
and you were doing so well, too
glorydaz
Well-known member
If a slut gets raped, then I can safely say she got what she deserved. Do you understand the difference between talking about a situation on an internet forum, and going up and shouting in someone's face that they got just what they deserved? Maybe you don't. :think:
Adults can sit around and talk about facts from an objective perspective without making up imaginary little scenarios about how such talk would hurt someone's feelings if they heard what was being said.
Shut up, Artie. The teeny boppers are listening to music in the next room....go back where you belong. :wave:
Arthur Brain
Well-known member
Yeh, you think they get what they deserve if they're raped. Not even talking about going up to someone's face and yelling that they deserved it, your view is bad enough without that.
Eh, grow up GD else go and join them yourself...
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