On Deservedness

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ok doser

ok doser

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glorydaz said:
Let me help you out, Artie. Baring a toenail is not wrong, but dancing nude on 42nd street is wrong. So if you bare your toenail and get raped, you're an innocent victim. If you're dancing nude down 42nd street and get raped you're merely a victim. People suffer consequences for bad behavior all the time. It's why we should always avoid doing things we know to be wrong. I realize that is an impossible pill for some folks to swallow, but don't say you haven't been warned. :)
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artie's not intelligent enough to realize that there are gradations of behavior, from totally reckless, irresponsible and perverted to not
 
glorydaz

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ok doser said:
artie's not intelligent enough to realize that there are gradations of behavior, from totally reckless, irresponsible and perverted to not
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It's kinda like changing the "claim" to two wrongs do make a right. A woman can act like a slut (wrong) and a man can rape her (wrong), and suddenly that makes the slut's wrong turn into right. It must be like that new math.....
 
B

bybee

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glorydaz said:
It's kinda like changing the "claim" to two wrongs do make a right. A woman can act like a slut (wrong) and a man can rape her (wrong), and suddenly that makes the slut's wrong turn into right. It must be like that new math.....
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I'm beginning to see a pattern here.
You really do not like women.:confused:
 
Rusha

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bybee said:
I'm beginning to see a pattern here.
You really do not like women.:confused:
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Eh, that's pretty obvious. There really seems to be double standards as well as *intentional* confusion at play here.

The word "slut" is being thrown around in reference to women when in reality, it is not gender specific. The definition, by the way it is being used in these threads is "a woman with the morals of a man."

Interestingly enough, there is no law against men sleeping with hundreds of women ... just because they can. Same thing with women. There just happens to be a double standard that grudge-holders against women rely on.

However, there is a law against RAPE. It is an illegal, violent attack towards another person. That person is always the victim. The aggressor is always 100% responsible for sexual assault.
 
Desert Reign

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Rusha said:
Interestingly enough, there is no law against men sleeping with hundreds of women ... just because they can. Same thing with women. There just happens to be a double standard that grudge-holders against women rely on.

However, there is a law against RAPE. It is an illegal, violent attack towards another person. That person is always the victim. The aggressor is always 100% responsible for sexual assault.
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The belief that your conduct is correlated with events that have no obvious connection to do with that conduct is justifiable. It may seem illogical to some but it isn't. A famous thought experiment was invented to reflect this principle called Newcomb's Paradox.

In the case in discussion, whilst we all agree that if the lady says no or does not give explicit permission then if the man forces himself on her, it is rape and he is 100% responsible - this does not mean that a woman is unjustified in doing all she thinks is rational to avoid such events happening to her. And it is not demeaning of herself if she dresses deliberately modestly or avoids certain interactions. Surely, the woman is more concerned about avoiding the situation in the first place than in getting the right person to blame after the event? It doesn't mean that she is blaming the woman who dresses in a way that gives unwanted messages to men. It just means that she is wiser than her. And such a woman is not restricting her own freedom to dress or associate however she wants; she is just exercising her own freedom to act according to her chosen attitudes. I don't see how this can be labelled as judgementalism on those who dress more openly. Saying - or believing - that woman B is not as wise as woman A is not blaming her for anything, even though woman A knows that woman B is more likely to get raped than herself.
 
Rusha

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Desert Reign said:
The belief that your conduct is correlated with events that have no obvious connection to do with that conduct is justifiable. It may seem illogical to some but it isn't. A famous thought experiment was invented to reflect this principle called Newcomb's Paradox.

In the case in discussion, whilst we all agree that if the lady says no or does not give explicit permission then if the man forces himself on her, it is rape and he is 100% responsible - this does not mean that a woman is unjustified in doing all she thinks is rational to avoid such events happening to her. And it is not demeaning of herself if she dresses deliberately modestly or avoids certain interactions. Surely, the woman is more concerned about avoiding the situation in the first place than in getting the right person to blame after the event? It doesn't mean that she is blaming the woman who dresses in a way that gives unwanted messages to men. It just means that she is wiser than her. And such a woman is not restricting her own freedom to dress or associate however she wants; she is just exercising her own freedom to act according to her chosen attitudes. I don't see how this can be labelled as judgementalism on those who dress more openly. Saying - or believing - that woman B is not as wise as woman A is not blaming her for anything, even though woman A knows that woman B is more likely to get raped than herself.
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That isn't what has been suggested ... as per the title of the OP: Deservedness. In this case, they are applying that word towards rape victims.

Women do not deserve to be raped.
 
patrick jane

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What if a straight man ends up at a gay party and drinks and dances and gets plastered, does he deserve to be raped by the gay men ?
 
glorydaz

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Rusha said:
That isn't what has been suggested ... as per the title of the OP: Deservedness. In this case, they are applying that word towards rape victims.

Women do not deserve to be raped.
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Women deserve to reap what they have sown just like men deserve to reap what they have sown.

That means bad behavior has consequences that are deserved by the one engaging in that bad behavior.


Too complicated I guess. :think:
 
Rusha

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patrick jane said:
But what if he enjoys himself and looks a little slutty to some gay guys ?
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IF those gay guys (in your scenario) cannot control themselves, they need to wear blinders ... stay at home ... or they should be behind bars.

The most disturbing part of this whole discussion is the dangerous, evil rapists (such as Larry Singleton) are being seen as a righteous, vigilantes of justice.

It takes a special kind of evil to declare that women DESERVE to be raped.
 
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