NFL 2014

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Arsenios

Well-known member
Nope. Saw his commercial, where he cashes in on the won't talk song and dance. I wonder if he's going to star in a Jock Itch commercial next. KAAAAAAAAA-ching. :plain:

Also, two thirds of the betting money is on New England. I still think it's a pick'em, but I'm crunching. Toughest SB call in a while. I hope the game is as close.

With the corporate controls via fines, he had better be cashing in...

And a jock itch commercial, with him leaping into the end zone onto his back grabbing his jock is perfect...

We are getting a tad repulsed by his grabs, no question... And he said in the interview I linked that "It ain't gonna be pretty..." So at least he is living truthfully in the open... And until that happens, there ain't no healing from THAT demon... And even with it, there ain't no guarantee of healing...

I think he knows what he is up against in himself, and is trying to bull his way through it beast mode style... It won't work and it will be and is ugly... So I admire his integrity, even seeing its tragic end, and pray for his success AFTER he fails in beast mode in his personal confrontation with his demons...

So do you have a link to the commercial? I don't follow this all that closely. I just love the game they play and the joy with which they play it...
 

chrysostom

Well-known member
Hall of Fame
With the corporate controls via fines, he had better be cashing in...

And a jock itch commercial, with him leaping into the end zone onto his back grabbing his jock is perfect...

We are getting a tad repulsed by his grabs, no question... And he said in the interview I linked that "It ain't gonna be pretty..." So at least he is living truthfully in the open... And until that happens, there ain't no healing from THAT demon... And even with it, there ain't no guarantee of healing...

I think he knows what he is up against in himself, and is trying to bull his way through it beast mode style... It won't work and it will be and is ugly... So I admire his integrity, even seeing its tragic end, and pray for his success AFTER he fails in beast mode in his personal confrontation with his demons...

So do you have a link to the commercial? I don't follow this all that closely. I just love the game they play and the joy with which they play it...

when you sit down with your family to watch the super bowl
you are not worried about deflated balls
but
obscene gestures may make you uncomfortable
so
we don't talk about that

we talk about deflated balls

as if it were the most important thing
 

Arsenios

Well-known member
but
obscene gestures may make you uncomfortable
so
we don't talk about that

That is exactly right...

And he is a crotch-self-grabber...

Not an appropriate gesture...

'Hawks front office fined him $20K for that TD Finale...

Off the field...

Still not appropriate...

Subs for his confession...

But in THIS culture???

Fairly mild...

I like him a lot...

Arsenios
 

chrysostom

Well-known member
Hall of Fame
That is exactly right...

And he is a crotch-self-grabber...

Not an appropriate gesture...

'Hawks front office fined him $20K for that TD Finale...

Off the field...

Still not appropriate...

Subs for his confession...

But in THIS culture???

Fairly mild...

I like him a lot...

Arsenios

next time it may cost the hawks 15 yards on the kickoff

that will get their attention
 

Town Heretic

Out of Order
Hall of Fame
Deflate-Gate

Deflate-Gate

Just because I'm bored waiting on the SB to come around (Granite, don't read this, it contains spoilers) two takes:

Take One, Deflate-Gate

Jack Trudeau: "Somebody who throws the ball every day knows the difference, trust me. It appears somebody did it on purpose. Because you would know. Anybody who touches a ball on a regular basis is going to know."

Drew Brees: "If you just gave me two balls right now and you said, 'Feel these balls and tell me if there's a difference in the weight or how much air is in them,' I could say yes, I could tell a difference..."

Montana: “I mean, it’s easy to figure out who did it. Did Tom do it? No, but Tom likes the balls that way, obviously, or you wouldn’t have 11 of them that way without him complaining, because as a quarterback, you know how you like the ball. If it doesn’t feel like that, something is wrong.”

Troy Aikman: "It's obvious that Tom Brady had something to do with this. For the balls to be deflated, that doesn't happen unless the quarterback wants that to happen, I can assure you of that."

Fran Tarkenton: "Tom Brady knows exactly what was done to the ball or what wasn't done with the ball as every other quarterback in the National Football League is...”

John Madden: "That would have to be driven by the quarterback. That's something that wouldn't be driven by a coach or just the equipment guy. Nobody, not even the head coach, would do anything to a football unilaterally, such as adjust the amount of pressure in a ball, without the quarterback not knowing. It would have to be the quarterback's idea."

Mark Brunell: “I don’t believe there’s an equipment manager in the NFL that would on his own initiative deflate a ball without the starting quarterback’s approval. I just didn’t believe what Tom Brady had to say.”

Tom Brady: "They felt fine to me."

That said, it's a stupid rule that began because idiot kickers were monkeying with the ball too much to gain a kicking advantage. Give every quarterback the option of lowering the number and you'll make foul weather games more entertaining for the fan.


Take Two: the not so great debate over greatness

Does Deflate-Gate tarnish/put in question Tom's greatness as a quarterback? Tarnish? Sure. A little. And more if people see a longer pattern. Put in question? No, he's played out of his mind great in many a dry, warm day too. So he would have been great regardless. And so would Barry Bonds... But comparing Tom with Montana and the "Is he better/he's better" media nonsense remains a homer's absurd and losing fight.

Collin Cowherd, one of the leading ESPN Brady talking head fans, has argued Brady's numerous appearances trump the four Montana wins...good news for Jim Kelly, whose unprecedented four straight appearances in the SB must have him right there in the mix. :rolleyes:

To me it's simpler: the first Patriots' SB win is tainted and Tom only contributed 157 yards to it anyway. Like Bradshaw or Big Ben in their first, he isn't so much responsible for winning the game as not losing it.

Montana, on the other hand, was arguably MVP of every SB he played in and literally was in three.

But, Collin argues, Montana was home watching the SB more than Tom, who is a set to appear in his 6th. Okay, and if you don't think an untraded Montana, who beat his understudy and made the KC Chiefs a contender in his first year with them, wouldn't have taken that Niners team to his fifth you're not really paying attention. Not to slight Steve who was the logical, Andrew Luck like choice (and one cemented by Joes retirement shortly after his Chief's last gasp) by then and for similar reasons.

Six to make four over a four and four that could easily have been five?

Joe Montana was the greatest quarterback to ever step onto a championship field. Tom is just the next generations best challenger for the throne, as Kobe was for Michael once.

~fini~​
 

tetelestai

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
has argued Brady's numerous appearances trump the four Montana wins...

Collin Cowherd's argument is ridiculous.

Using Cowherd's logic, John Elway would also be better than Montana because Elway's 5 Super Bowl starts would trump Montana's 4.

Joe Montana was the greatest quarterback to ever step onto a championship field. Tom is just the next generations best challenger for the throne, as Kobe was for Michael once.

Jordan, like Montana never lost a championship while winning many championships.

Once a player loses a championship, it puts him in a different category than the ones who won multiple championships without losing one.

Kobe lost a few, so has LeBron. That's why neither will ever be in the Jordan category no matter how many more they may win.

Jordan, Montana, Bradshaw, etc are always going to be talked about differently than Brady, Elway, Kobe, LeBron, etc.

There's a certain "mystique" about being perfect in championships, especially four or more. Very few have been able to do it.
 

chrysostom

Well-known member
Hall of Fame
why are we talking about quarterbacks?
the coach makes the team
and
the team wins the game

you don't get it, do you?
 

Town Heretic

Out of Order
Hall of Fame
Collin Cowherd's argument is ridiculous.
No real shock if you listen to him often enough. He falls irrationally in love with a player or a team and this sort of thing happens. Skip "the front runner" Bayliss is another one who can say the darndest things with a straight face.

Using Cowherd's logic, John Elway would also be better than Montana because Elway started 5 Super Bowls.
Believe me, he hasn't considered it.
 

Town Heretic

Out of Order
Hall of Fame
why are we talking about quarterbacks?
the coach makes the team
and
the team wins the game

you don't get it, do you?
You're not without a point, but you over play it. A great team can win with an adequate qb (a-la Trent Dilfer). A good team can win with a great quarter back (a-la Tom Brady). A great coach can win with either combination, but won't win without it (a-la Chuck Noll).

Sometimes a great coach with a great quarterback and a good team can lose to a really good team and a really good quarterback with a really good coach, which is what happened to the Pats against the Giants.

It's all about the mix.
 

tetelestai

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
why are we talking about quarterbacks?
the coach makes the team
and
the team wins the game

you don't get it, do you?

That would mean Chuck Noll is the greatest coach in the Super Bowl era.

Do you agree with this?

No other coach won as many Super Bowls as Noll, and Noll was a perfect 4-0 in Super Bowls.

???
 

tetelestai

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
Coaches with at least 3 Super Bowl wins:

1) Chuck Noll 4-0
2) Bill Walsh 3-0
3) Joe Gibbs 3-1
4) Bill Belichick 3-2

Of the 4, Belicheat has the worst winning percentage.
 

Town Heretic

Out of Order
Hall of Fame
I think the mix argument works. If either of you get around to it I'll be back later. Off to do some dog wrestling and leave rustling.

:e4e:
 

chrysostom

Well-known member
Hall of Fame
Coaches with at least 3 Super Bowl wins:

1) Chuck Noll 4-0
2) Bill Walsh 3-0
3) Joe Gibbs 3-1
4) Bill Belichick 3-2

Of the 4, Belicheat has the worst winning percentage.

noll was a good coach for six years

belichick was a good coach for 14 years and counting
 

tetelestai

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
Coaches with most Super Bowl appearances:

6) Bill Belichick - (3-2)
Don Shula - (2-4)

5) Tom Landry - (2-3)

4) Chuck Noll - (4-0)
Joe Gobbs - (3-1)
Bud Grant - (0-4)
Marv Levy - (0-4)
Dan Reeves - (0-4)
 

chrysostom

Well-known member
Hall of Fame
Coaches with most Super Bowl appearances:

6) Bill Belichick - (3-2)
Don Shula - (2-4)

5) Tom Landry - (2-3)

4) Chuck Noll - (4-0)
Joe Gobbs - (3-1)
Bud Grant - (0-4)
Marv Levy - (0-4)
Dan Reeves - (0-4)

now that's what I am talking about

these are the guys we should be talking about

thank you for this
 

chrysostom

Well-known member
Hall of Fame
Coaches with most Super Bowl appearances:

6) Bill Belichick - (3-2)
Don Shula - (2-4)

5) Tom Landry - (2-3)

4) Chuck Noll - (4-0)
Joe Gobbs - (3-1)
Bud Grant - (0-4)
Marv Levy - (0-4)
Dan Reeves - (0-4)

how many of them are religious?
I know about landry and grant
 

tetelestai

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
noll was a good coach for six years

It was a lot more than six years.

From 1972 - 1984 (13 years) Noll and the Steelers had a winning season every year except for one, when they finished .500

During that span, they went to the playoffs every year except 2 years, and appeared in SEVEN AFC Championship Games, winning four of them.

belichick was a good coach for 14 years and counting

Ok, let's compare Noll and the Steelers from 1972 - 1984 (13 years) with Belicheat and the Patriots from 2001 - 2014 (14 years)

Playoff appearances:

Steelers - 11
Patriots - 12

Division Titles:

Steelers - 9
Patriots - 12

Playoff Wins:

Steelers - 15
Patriots - 20

AFC Championship Appearances:

Steelers - 7
Patriots - 9

Super Bowl Appearances:

Steelers - 4
Patriots - 6

Super Bowl Wins:

Steelers - 4
Patriots - 3

As we see above, the Patriots lead in all the categories except the most important one, which they have a chance to tie tomorrow.

However, it's not apples to apples. The extra wild card round with extra wild card teams didn't exist during Noll's coaching days, and there was a strike shortened season in 1982 that produced no division winners that year.

Had there been more wild card teams, and an additional round in the playoffs, Noll and the Steelers probably would have played in more playoff games.

Belicheat and the Patriots played three playoff games in the wild card round.

And of course the most important thing of all.....Chuck Noll never CHEATED
 
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