Is the doctrine of Eternal Conscious Torment biblical or not?

God's Truth

God's Truth

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Is the doctrine of... December 18th, 2013 10:18 PM Vaquero45 adgsdg


Quero is neg rep'ing me with codes.

He gets a taste of the fear of God when I post the truth.
 
God's Truth

God's Truth

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Vaquero45,

Jesus did not come to preach for three years then throw away what he said.

Everything Jesus said stands to ALL forever.
 
Vaquero45

Vaquero45

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godrulz said:
My post is an accurate assessment of theology, church history, etc. Refute it instead of the ad hominem attacks. I don't see you here defending the Deity of Christ, gospel, Word of God, etc. in the face of heretical attacks.

You are just mad that I expose MAD.
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My post was right and yours was wrong, etc and so-forth, deny it all you want, throw water balloons and blow bubbles at it, I don't see you doing anything but throwing feathers in the air. I defend the faith against Goliath and company while you fart in the wind.

You couldn't even explain MAD let alone "expose" it, whatever that means.
 
Vaquero45

Vaquero45

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God's Truth said:
Is the doctrine of... December 18th, 2013 10:18 PM Vaquero45 adgsdg


Quero is neg rep'ing me with codes.

He gets a taste of the fear of God when I post the truth.
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You are all bluster just like gr, I gave you as much comment as you deserved, there is no code there, it is me filling in the blank absolutely randomly with no effort what-so-ever because that is all the respect your post commanded.
 
R

rstrats

Active member
God's Truth,

re: "I gave scriptures that say they will be thrown in the lake of fire and tortured forever. You keep saying it does not say that."


He's saying that because you still haven't identified any scripture that says (at least in the KJV) that anyone other than the devil will be tortured forever.
 
God's Truth

God's Truth

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rstrats said:
God's Truth,

re: "I gave scriptures that say they will be thrown in the lake of fire and tortured forever. You keep saying it does not say that."


He's saying that because you still haven't identified any scripture that says (at least in the KJV) that anyone other than the devil will be tortured forever.
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I gave scripture that says people will be thrown in the lake of fire and tortured forever.


The scriptures say:
PEOPLE will be THROWN IN HELL, to the UNQUENCHABLE FIRE.
Mark 9:43-45

And if your hand causes you to sin, cut it off. It is better for you to enter life crippled than with two hands to go to hell, to the unquenchable fire. And if your foot causes you to sin, cut it off. It is better for you to enter life lame than with two feet to be thrown into hell.

This scripture says PEOPLE will be thrown in the same eternal fire prepared for the devil.
Matthew 25:41

“Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.

This scripture says people will tormented with fire and sulfur, and they have no rest, day or night.

Revelation 14:10-11

he also will drink the wine of God's wrath, poured full strength into the cup of his anger, and he will be tormented with fire and sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb. And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever, and they have no rest, day or night, these worshipers of the beast and its image, and whoever receives the mark of its name.”
 
Levolor

Levolor

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freelight said:
All have physical vision, but psychic and spiritual vision may be another matter (considering degrees & qualities)
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As I already mentioned.

You know one could quote any passage to support their point of view, or offer an 'interpretation' on it.
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I do know this.

A 'chapter & verse' is not necessary for everything, but only if discussing something within a so called 'biblical' context, which is limited to itself, and still open to sundry translations.
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Except for when it is claimed that scriptures have been previously provided concerning a certain issue and no one is able to validate that claim.

I can only prove or know my own 'being-ness', and that is all. All 'else' is a projection, conception, perspective or assumption from some point in space or time, reflecting other points out there :) - so its all 'relative', unless I consider the pure absolute knowledge of being itself, which is ever Self-evident, as long as I AM. 'God' is the only and ever-reality, omnipresently existing.

Heaven, if cognizing my own God-presence, is ever present. There is nowhere I could go, apart from it (whether there is a conscious or unconscious state assumed). - this puts the whole 'heaven' or 'hell' thing in a different light, more a play of the 'ego' or religious myth-making,...but that's another chapter ;)
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My question of: "can you prove yourself" was in regard to the claim that scriptures had been already provided. It was not a question regarding 'beingness'.

As far as being able to prove your own beingness... I wouldn't be too sure of that, freelight. Afterall, as revealed, "you are just part of someone else's projection", and additionally as you say: "'God' is the only and ever-reality, omnipresently existing."

God is all, in all.
 
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godrulz

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The False Prophet and Antichrist are thrown in the lake of fire (still conscious when the others join them). 1000 years later, Satan joins them and the unregenerate after the Great White Throne judgment. This is explicit in Revelation, reality, not figurative.
 
chrysostom

chrysostom

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godrulz said:
The False Prophet and Antichrist are thrown in the lake of fire (still conscious when the others join them). 1000 years later, Satan joins them and the unregenerate after the Great White Throne judgment. This is explicit in Revelation, reality, not figurative.
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the lake of fire is the second death
so
do you believe in the lake of fire
but
not in the second death?
 
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godrulz

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chrysostom said:
the lake of fire is the second death
so
do you believe in the lake of fire
but
not in the second death?
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They are the same thing. Death is separation, not cessation/annihilation (don't think like a materialist).

Physical death is separation of spirit-soul from physical body.

Spiritual death is relational separation from sinner and holy God (still conscious Eph. 2).

Eternal/second death is separation of unregenerate after death/judgment from God forever, conscious.
 
T

Timotheos

New member
God's Truth said:
You are spiritually blind, and ensnared by the devil.
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I'm rubber and you're glue!

HeHe H'HeHe Heeee!

Actually, you only think I'm spiritually blind and ensnared by the devil because I believe what the Bible says.
"For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord."
 
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rstrats

Active member
God's Truth,

re: "PEOPLE will be THROWN IN HELL, to the UNQUENCHABLE FIRE. Mark 9:43-45"

Nothing said here about eternal torture.



re: "And if your hand causes you to sin, cut it off. It is better for you to enter life crippled than with two hands to go to hell, to the unquenchable fire. And if your foot causes you to sin, cut it off. It is better for you to enter life lame than with two feet to be thrown into hell."

Nothing said here about eternal torture.



re: "“Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels."

Nothing said here about eternal torture.



re: "This scripture says people will tormented with fire and sulfur, and they have no rest, day or night."

Doesn't say for how long.




re: "he also will drink the wine of God's wrath, poured full strength into the cup of his anger, and he will be tormented with fire and sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb."

Doesn't say for how long.



re: "And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever..."

This only says that smoke will go up forever - doesn't say the torment will go on forever.
 
Aimiel

Aimiel

Well-known member
Where the smoke from their torment ascends for ever and ever... there must be torment taking place or the smoke would eventually cease. :duh:

Revelation 14:11
And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.

Torment continues day and night: for ever and ever and ever.
 
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12daysofchristmas

New member
I have been perusing the posts and quotes on this topic. I believe many of the posts on this thread are a little off-kilter. There is a lake of fire, and moment by moment, if an individual is progressing in his/her faith, we are shedding old beliefs, and moving forward to be more like Jesus. That which we shed is thrown into that lake of fire, and this is actually good news. Thankfully, as Christians mature in faith, they are constantly becoming new creatures in Christ.

For Scripture, I will point to the parable of the ten bridesmaids found in Matthew 25:1-13. Out with the old, in with the new! Thanks to all for providing this stimulating reading!
 
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