I'm Not Anti-Christian - I'm anti-theocracy

[I drank what?]

how to tell if your rights are being violated

is this the part where i bite on this big shiny hook?

/at least put a worm on it..

 

[I drank what?]

If the Bible said murder was okay, would you do it?

If people understood the difference between Ethics and Morality, would they ask such silly questions?

If up was down would fire be cold..?

/imma deep feelolcifer
//there is no spoon
///..SPOOOOOOOON!1!11!!!!

 

[Quetzal]

If people understood the difference between Ethics and Morality, would they ask such silly questions?

If up was down would fire be cold..?

/imma deep feelolcifer
//there is no spoon
///..SPOOOOOOOON!1!11!!!!

We are discussing the Bible and its impact on what is right and what is wrong. I believe the Bible, as a whole, is a terrible source for laws to be written from. Given this topic I feel my question is appropriate. No one has answered, by the way.

 

[musterion]

Quisp is a punk. So where'd that Horn fella go? He seemed to have potential.

 

[john w]

You don't have to, but I can support myself knowingly because social and legal trends are aligning with my way of thinking, not conservative Christians.

"You don't have to, but I can support myself knowingly because social and legal trends"

Translated: You call the shots, on morality, verified by the "consensus."

So, here is what we know:

1. You're mind is the standard, for assessing morality. For Christians, it is the volume of the book.

Contrasts.

What right do you have, to impose your "fuzzy" assessment of morality, on me? Who made you boss, Hoss?

2. "social and legal trends" determine morality, Hoss? So, if the "trend" came back to slavery, your OK with that?

 

[john w]

Take your time, I will wait.

Why should I accept your imposition of what your vision of morality is? Who says you call the shots?


Should I not muder, because you say so? Who made you boss?


How do you decide what laws should be made? Let me guess: Feelings? What you think is right? What's your standard? Ours is the bible.

 

[john w]

Yep, murder is wrong because I say so. Also, secular law and ethics conveniently support me. Now, back to my question...

There you go, folks:


"Yep, murder is wrong because I say so. Also, secular law and ethics conveniently support me. Now, back to my question..."

=My mind is my "god"(Judges 21:25 KJV), as subjectivity/feelings/mysticism, back by consensus, determines morality.

"Christians cannot and must not have "special rights ". They cannot use their religious beliefs as an excuse to demand that our government make laws based on THEIR religious beliefs ."-The Horn, starter of this thread


Why are you demanding that your "mind beliefs" be employed to make laws?


See how that works?

Any other questions for this subjective mystic?


Why should your vision of what is right/wrong, i.e., morality, be imposed on me/others?


Let me guess: "Cuz" you say so.


And you are venturing into the ring with me, and other TOL members? Sit down.

 

[john w]

We are discussing the Bible and its impact on what is right and what is wrong. I believe the Bible, as a whole, is a terrible source for laws to be written from. Given this topic I feel my question is appropriate. No one has answered, by the way.

So, your mind, because you say so, is not "a terrible source for laws to be written from?"

The bible


Vs.

You.



Contrasts. I like 'em, Mikey. Continue to make that "argument," Hop Sing. Go ahead.

 

[john w]

Class dismissed, TOL audience:


"Yep, murder is wrong because I say so.."-quetzal

 

[Jose Fly]

Many conservative Americans Christians accuse liberal Non-Christians of being
"Anti-Christian " and supposedly being out to "persecute " them .
Nothing could be farther from the truth , and this is certainly true of me . I believe absolutely in religious freedom for everyone on earth .
But too many Christians in America mistakebeing criticized for being hated and being "persecuted ".
Far from being "persecuted ", Christians are the majority in America . They have most of the political and economic power in America .
On the contrary , it is Christians , certainly not all of them , who are trying to interfere with the private lives of others who do not share their faith , social and political views .
But the founding fathers wanted freedom for followers of any and every religion , including non-believers . Too many Christians today fail to realize this fact . Every American has the right to follow any religion , or no religion at all .
Christians cannot and must not have "special rights ". They cannot use their religious beliefs as an excuse to demand that our government make laws based on THEIR religious beliefs .
As I just said , I'm not anti-christian , I'm anti-theocracy . Or anything which brings America closer to it .
The problem is that there are too many Christians who even though they deny it, DO want to bring America closer and closer to
a Christian theocracy in which Non-Christians would be second class citizens . They say "America is a "Christian nation ". It is only in the sense that the majority of Americans happen to be Christians .
But don't forget the millions of Americans who foolow Judaism , Islam, Hinduism, Budddhism and just about every other monro religion in existence , not to mention millions of atheists and agnostics . There are now more atheists in America than there were people at the time of our founding .
We are all in it together , whatever religion we follow , and we must all learn to get along and live together peacefully , or we are
doomed to the kind of religious strife which has caused so much death and destruction over the centuries .
As an agnostic , I don't "hate" Christians , nor do I condemn anyone merely for being a Christian . But I do fear those who refuse
to respect the rights of those who do not share their faith , and there are too many of these in America now .

What we're seeing in the US is a backlash in response to the lessening of Christianity's influence on our society. It wasn't that long ago that the country was run by Christians, for Christians and everyone else knew it and knew their place.

But now we find ourselves in a place where non-Christians are more numerous and influential, and things are changing fairly rapidly. Now Christians don't get to call all the shots the way they used to, so some are lashing out against their eroding influence on society.

I think once the baby boomers have mostly died off the changes will start to accelerate even more.

 

[TracerBullet]

i dont get into my private business on the internet

so...no persecution.

 

[TracerBullet]

Nice talk like a kid. Giving me your "argument"(reasons for a conclusion), instead of pouting.

Perhaps you should take your own advice

 

[TracerBullet]

"You don't have to, but I can support myself knowingly because social and legal trends"

Translated: You call the shots, on morality, verified by the "consensus."

So, here is what we know:

1. You're mind is the standard, for assessing morality. For Christians, it is the volume of the book.

Contrasts.

What right do you have, to impose your "fuzzy" assessment of morality, on me? Who made you boss, Hoss?

2. "social and legal trends" determine morality, Hoss? So, if the "trend" came back to slavery, your OK with that?

slavery is fine by biblical standards.

 

[TracerBullet]

Why should I accept your imposition of what your vision of morality is? Who says you call the shots?


Should I not muder, because you say so? Who made you boss?


How do you decide what laws should be made? Let me guess: Feelings? What you think is right? What's your standard? Ours is the bible.

can you answer your own questions?

 

[musterion]

Perhaps you should take your own advice

Don't be catty

 

[Quetzal]

Class dismissed, TOL audience:


"Yep, murder is wrong because I say so.."-quetzal

Am I wrong? Here is the thing. I don't accept the Bible as a legal standard for a few, simple reasons.

1. I do not believe the Bible was written by God, as such, it has no more authority than any other written text.
2. The social/legal environment was so drastically different at the time it was written, it does not compare to today. Not even a little bit.

I do not need the Bible to tell me things are wrong in order for me to know they are wrong. I was raised outside of a Christian community and I have a conscience. I am able to determine (with a decent amount of success) what is the right thing to do. I do not need a 1700 year old book that is used to oppress to tell me anything. And I certainly don't need a narcissistic moron on the internet trying to tell me otherwise. Good day, sir. :e4e:

 

[TrakeM]

"Christians cannot and must not have "special rights ". They cannot use their religious beliefs as an excuse to demand that our government make laws based on THEIR religious beliefs ."-you


What "special rights?" What would that be? An "excuse?" No, it is our reasoning. You are making an emotional appeal. Knock it off.

We "demand?" No, it's called persuasion. More emotionalism on your part.


"make laws based on THEIR religious beliefs"-you

How do you decide what laws should be made? Let me guess: Feelings? What you think is right? What's your standard? Ours is the bible.

Laws, by definition, are an imposition of morality. Dig?

No. I don't care for a theocracy. You're really no different from al-Qaida. They too want the rule of law to be based on a "holy" book. We developed a constitution that guarantees you freedom of religion, but in so doing bars you from turning your religion into law. What part of "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion" don't you understand?

If muslims managed to enforce the quaran on you, I doubt you'd consider that fair game. I look at you the same way, Mr. Bin Laden.

 

[TrakeM]

slavery is fine by biblical standards.

So is murdering anyone who openly opposes your religion. The bible is one of the most vile things ever written.

 

[Quetzal]

So is murdering anyone who openly opposes your religion. The bible is one of the most vile things ever written.

It is certainly up there.

 

[shagster01]

I think there is FAR more persecution of christians going on in the US than anyone will admit. Certainly ahteists do not like to admit that they are perseucting christians.. (and liberals ditto)

My life situation is NOT good right now and i know 4 a FACT it is b/c I am being persecuted by liberals, whether they call themselves that or not

long, bizarre story but i know what i am talking about. You don't... so you can't criticize me or say i am screaming Persecution when i am not being persecuted

I'll play this game too.

I'm persecuted for being Taoist, but I'm not going to tell anyone how or why.

See I proved my point just the same as you.