Christian Kids in the Public School

[ebenz47037]

My mistake. I made an assumption and made an asss out of me.

That's all right. I think I mentioned, in this thread, that she's now seventeen years old and just finished eleventh grade. It's easy to think that I was talking about public schools now, even though she hasn't been to one in seven years.

 

[zoo22]

I disagree. At my school there are plenty of students that receive higher education than their grade level is required. Plus, there is a program called AP (Advanced Placement) that allows students to receive college credit in high school as long as the college will accept that credit and the AP Final is passed. I'm not 100% but I think that most states also have AP classes. From what I see, any child, that has the ability and chooses to use it, will be recognized and put ahead of their class.

Don't get me wrong. I don't mean that it's something that's an absolute. I know there are many, many public schools where kids are recognized in their talents/gifts and supported in them. There are a lot of great public schools. Like I said, I fully support public school. But the fact is, there are profound problems with many public schools, and there is deep-rooted problem with the entire system. I can be in support of something and still recognize it's problems. That's part of support.

AP classes are pretty standard for most schools. (Maybe all?) And AP is a great program. But I also think that it's generally geared towards "standard" learning.... Meaning that it's generally a math/science/english program. Which is fine and good. I'm all for it. But one of the things that I mean by the idea of overlooking gifts extending beyond typically gifted children is that many kid have gifts that don't necessarily fall into a typical area. It's something that some people might not agree with me on, but I think an education should be extremely rounded; far more encompassing than typical school curriculum is.

Also, it's not at all uncommon for a kid to be exceptional in one area and a dunce in others. I think those kids get overlooked a lot as far as AP goes. Fall into the cracks.

 

[zoo22]

My mistake. I made an assumption and made an asss out of me.

Well, what you said still applies to what I was saying, just not to to :jessilu:.

 

[ParsonJefferson]

ParsonJefferson, I've decided to leave off with neg-repping you for the last sentence in this post. You need to grow a thicker skin.

Oh really... Check out some of these "gems" thrown at me by your fellow "compassionate Christian" homeschoolers:

My girls being severely sexually harassed daily, experiencing fierce peer pressure, having poor self-esteem, picking up a few drug habits, learning to disrespect authority, use foul language, learn how to have oral sex and sleep around, become a homosexual, embrace relativism, feminism and tolerance as virtues, or possibly get sexually molested by their peers or raped by their teachers, or even shot and killed...just for starters.

Nothing like paranoia and broad-brushing, is there?

Sorry, but I love my kids.

And parents of public school kids don't? How judgmental!

Rape is quite a bit rarer, but we have a teacher who's raped every girl in our school visually/in his mind.

Really P8ntrDan? How do you know this? Or are you just making random slanderous accusations?

Obviously you have never walked in a public school hallway and heard the filthy language coming out of the mouths of students enough to make a sailor blush, or seen the news about the daily sexual assults from teachers to students.

Yes, let's make believe this happens in every public school every day. :kookoo:

Children are supposed to be discipled by their parents, not turned over to the enemy to become disciples.

More inflammatory rhetoric.

It's not my responsibility to take care of other people children. It is beyond my understanding as to why Christian parents would be willing to send their children into a hostile, perverted, godless environment, to be missionaries in an effort to lead others to Jesus.

I'm not surprised that you cannot understand how anything affects anybody but you and your children...

But, if for some reason I feel the need for them to be exposed to the perversion and wickedness of the world, I can order cable, put a television in their bedrooms and let them watch TV during the day where all of the humanists and homos of Hollywood can pervert their minds and destroy their character just as the public school would do.

Would that include listening to Eminem, GunsNRoses and Kanye West - and watching the movie 8-Mile?

Do you even know how many kids graduate these days who don't know how to read or write? :loser:

And there it is! The famous LOSER emoticon. How cute.

Of course, they sure know how to roll a joint and put a condom on, but basic learning skills - don't make me laugh!

Yeah, uhhh huhhh - that's what they teach in public school. Doobie Rolling 101.

If kids who attend public school are not sex-fiend drugees, then that is certainly the exception to the rule.

Oh really? Nothing like a little blind, hateful broad-brushing is there?

We have neighbors and extended family and their kid's lives are the kind of train-wrecks you can predict from pubic schooling.

The public schools DID this to them? Yeah right...

One night when we had them over for dinner, the mom was telling us about how her 5th grade son came home from school, and explained to her that he had watched a video in school that day explaining explicitly how to give and receive oral sex.

I don't believe one word of that. ANY teacher in ANY school would be immediately fired for that, and probably prosecuted. This is nothing short of slander.

I'm sorry, but we love our kids enough to NEVER put them in public school. I would die first. Seriously!

Oh no, this is NOT arrogant and judgmental, is it? Apparently those of us who had/have our kids in public school do so because we don't love them. Interesting...

You should be very careful how you talk to someone.

This one is just CHOICE!

In most public schools, if a young boy has not had sex by his junior year in high school he is made fun of by his peers. I know because SADLY I was one of those arrogant young football players making fun of my peers, engaging in the womanizing mindset!

Speak for yourself.

I learned how to rolls joints, how to give blowjobs, how to seduce men, how to do drugs. I was sexually assaulted and the peer pressure to have sex was huge.

That's NOTHING like what my kids have done, or learned to do in public school. Did you have no choice in the matter?

And so the question is, if your kids didn't learn to roll a joint and put on a condom in public school, did they learn that at home?

Boy, there's a gem!

Again. You need to consider how your own attitude towards this subject has contributed to the responses you have received, and quit acting like an innocent victim.

Interesting...

Putting your chuildren into a Godless education system is a sin. I rebuke you.

Wow, how Christian! :kookoo:

I was 12 years old when I started engaging in sexual behavior and smoking pot because everyone else was doing it.

That's a PERSONAL problem, not a PUBLIC SCHOOL problem.

NO! The Public schools are run by FOOLS and swarming with reprobate delinquents.

Didn't Jesus say something about calling people FOOLS?


Now, would you care to re-evaluate the Christ-like attitudes displayed here by the Homeschooling crowd?

 

[Memento Mori]

Well, what you said still applies to what I was saying, just not to to :jessilu:.

Excellent! I'm not a complete Democrat.

 

[Memento Mori]

Now, would you care to re-evaluate the Christ-like attitudes displayed here by the Homeschooling crowd?

My friend, I think this my be a good time to turn the other cheek.

 

[Nomad]

My friend, I think this my be a good time to turn the other cheek.

I quite agree. PJ, your guff is not with Ebenz, no need to fuss at her for what others have said to you, if anything it validates what she said.

 

[ParsonJefferson]

I quite agree. PJ, your guff is not with Ebenz, no need to fuss at her for what others have said to you, if anything it validates what she said.

She was the one telling me to "grow some thicker skin". I answered that with examples.

Personally, I like Ebenz a great deal. We've had lots of very good conversations.

 

[ebenz47037]

Oh really... Check out some of these "gems" thrown at me by your fellow "compassionate Christian" homeschoolers:

Nothing like paranoia and broad-brushing, is there?

And parents of public school kids don't? How judgmental!

Really P8ntrDan? How do you know this? Or are you just making random slanderous accusations?

Yes, let's make believe this happens in every public school every day. :kookoo:

More inflammatory rhetoric.

I'm not surprised that you cannot understand how anything affects anybody but you and your children...

Would that include listening to Eminem, GunsNRoses and Kanye West - and watching the movie 8-Mile?

And there it is! The famous LOSER emoticon. How cute.

Yeah, uhhh huhhh - that's what they teach in public school. Doobie Rolling 101.

Oh really? Nothing like a little blind, hateful broad-brushing is there?

The public schools DID this to them? Yeah right...

I don't believe one word of that. ANY teacher in ANY school would be immediately fired for that, and probably prosecuted. This is nothing short of slander.

Oh no, this is NOT arrogant and judgmental, is it? Apparently those of us who had/have our kids in public school do so because we don't love them. Interesting...

This one is just CHOICE!

Speak for yourself.

That's NOTHING like what my kids have done, or learned to do in public school. Did you have no choice in the matter?

Boy, there's a gem!

Interesting...

Wow, how Christian! :kookoo:

That's a PERSONAL problem, not a PUBLIC SCHOOL problem.

Didn't Jesus say something about calling people FOOLS?


Now, would you care to re-evaluate the Christ-like attitudes displayed here by the Homeschooling crowd?

Actually, no. I won't re-evaluate the Christ-like attitudes displayed here. This, like abortion, can be a touchy subject with fanatics on both sides of the issue. The reason I am the way I am about homeschooling is because I believe that the parents are the only people who should have the right to decide how their children are educated, whether that be homeschooling, public education, or private education. While reading some of your posts, I started wondering if you thought that homeschooling should not be allowed. That is why I started in this thread.

I told you before that I've gotten the same, if not worse, attitude from pro-public education people. Here is an example of a discussion I was having with a "professional educator" on TOL. His opinion of homeschooling was, "Homeschooling is like do-it-yourself brain surgery." I "met" him off of TOL and invited him here to discuss homeschooling with me and some other people.

And, like I said, no one really said anything insulting directly to/about you and/or your kids. Up to a point, it was all about public schools. You are taking things too personally if you think that everyone is insulting you when they say something bad about public schools.

 

[ParsonJefferson]

Actually, no. I won't re-evaluate the Christ-like attitudes displayed here.
Well, in all honesty, there's really not much to evaluate is there?

This, like abortion, can be a touchy subject with fanatics on both sides of the issue.
There have only been fanatics on ONE side of the issue, on this thread.

The reason I am the way I am about homeschooling is because I believe that the parents are the only people who should have the right to decide how their children are educated, whether that be homeschooling, public education, or private education.
I agree with you 100%.

While reading some of your posts, I started wondering if you thought that homeschooling should not be allowed.
Where would you EVER get that idea? You need to re-read my posts - including the ones where I have openly encouraged people to homeschool, if that's their choice.

That is why I started in this thread.
I thought DXPose started this thread...

I told you before that I've gotten the same, if not worse, attitude from pro-public education people. Here is an example of a discussion I was having with a "professional educator" on TOL.
What does that have to do with me?
What does that have to do with one of your fellow homeschoolers "rebuking" me for sinning by sending my kids to public school?

His opinion of homeschooling was, "Homeschooling is like do-it-yourself brain surgery." I "met" him off of TOL and invited him here to discuss homeschooling with me and some other people.
If I was part of that discussion, I would have disagreed with him - but I would not have "rebuked him for sinning" - nor would I have said stuff like "I love my kids enough to NOT send them to public school!"

And, like I said, no one really said anything insulting directly to/about you and/or your kids.
Oh really? I'm asked that if my kids didn't learn to roll joints and put on condoms at school, they must have learned it at home. I'm rebuked for the "sin" of sending my kids to public school.
Did you even read those quotes?

Up to a point, it was all about public schools. You are taking things too personally if you think that everyone is insulting you when they say something bad about public schools.
Again, re-read the quotes. If you cannot see it, it's only because you don't want to.

Now I'm going to ask you hard question: If the way the homeschoolers have behaved here on this thread is indicative of "Christians", do you think the homeschoolers have won anybody to Christ by what has transpired on this thread?

 

[ebenz47037]

Actually, no. I won't re-evaluate the Christ-like attitudes displayed here.
Well, in all honesty, there's really not much to evaluate is there?

This, like abortion, can be a touchy subject with fanatics on both sides of the issue.
There have only been fanatics on ONE side of the issue, on this thread.

The reason I am the way I am about homeschooling is because I believe that the parents are the only people who should have the right to decide how their children are educated, whether that be homeschooling, public education, or private education.
I agree with you 100%.

While reading some of your posts, I started wondering if you thought that homeschooling should not be allowed.
Where would you EVER get that idea? You need to re-read my posts - including the ones where I have openly encouraged people to homeschool, if that's their choice.

From Post #4 in this thread:

When and how are we going to get out kids out into "the real world"? I've known quite a few home-schooled kids who are, quite frankly, socially retarded and completely unable to deal with "life outside the house". Is this what we want for our kids? I'd rather have my children out in the world, in small doses, when they're little - and the consequences of bad choices are relatively minor.

Doesn't sound like you have a high opinion of homeschooling at all.

That is why I started in this thread.
I thought DXPose started this thread...

Look for the word "in". :chuckle: I didn't say I started the thread.

I told you before that I've gotten the same, if not worse, attitude from pro-public education people. Here is an example of a discussion I was having with a "professional educator" on TOL.
What does that have to do with me?
What does that have to do with one of your fellow homeschoolers "rebuking" me for sinning by sending my kids to public school?

I was making a point. You keep complaining about the attitudes of homeschoolers. I was telling you that we've gotten the same, if not worse, attitude for years from pro-public education folk. I know that two wrongs doesn't make a right. But, it kind of shows you a little bit about our mindset. And, just because some homeschoolers believe that sending your kids to public school is a sin, doesn't mean that all of us do. Crash (and others) know that I don't necessarily agree with them on that opinion. I don't think it's necessarily wise to send your children to public school, but I don't believe that it's a sin.

His opinion of homeschooling was, "Homeschooling is like do-it-yourself brain surgery." I "met" him off of TOL and invited him here to discuss homeschooling with me and some other people.
If I was part of that discussion, I would have disagreed with him - but I would not have "rebuked him for sinning" - nor would I have said stuff like "I love my kids enough to NOT send them to public school!"

The point of my showing you that thread was to show you an example of how "professional educators" tend to talk to homeschoolers.

And, like I said, no one really said anything insulting directly to/about you and/or your kids.
Oh really? I'm asked that if my kids didn't learn to roll joints and put on condoms at school, they must have learned it at home. I'm rebuked for the "sin" of sending my kids to public school.
Did you even read those quotes?

My opinion on that is that you took the thing about rolling joints and putting on condoms out of context. Crash has strong opinions about homeschooling. Like I said, a lot of people do. And, both he and PastorKevin said what they did after you talked to ShadowMaid the way you did.

Up to a point, it was all about public schools. You are taking things too personally if you think that everyone is insulting you when they say something bad about public schools.
Again, re-read the quotes. If you cannot see it, it's only because you don't want to.

Not everything that was said about public school had to do with you. That is what my point is with this discussion, ParsonJefferson. I decided to enter this thread when I saw your answer to ShadowMaid. I don't suppose that you know that she is a seventeen year old girl. Do you? She has asked you some questions that you find objectional. The question about rolling joints and putting on condoms, in my opinion, was actually funny if you take the conversation in context. Someone said something about learning those things in public school. You said that your kids didn't learn them in public school. ShadowMaid asked if they learned it at home since they didn't learn it at school. Maybe it was said in bad taste. But, I took what she said as a joke.

Now I'm going to ask you hard question: If the way the homeschoolers have behaved here on this thread is indicative of "Christians", do you think the homeschoolers have won anybody to Christ by what has transpired on this thread?

In this thread? Probably not. But, although I should make a more concerted effort that way, I know that I don't try to win people to Christ every minute of every day. I'm guessing that they don't either.

 

[PKevman]

One night when we had them over for dinner, the mom was telling us about how her 5th grade son came home from school, and explained to her that he had watched a video in school that day explaining explicitly how to give and receive oral sex.

I don't believe one word of that. ANY teacher in ANY school would be immediately fired for that, and probably prosecuted. This is nothing short of slander.

I shared with you a real story, and your only response is to accuse me of making it up and lying? That is the slander. You are a blooming hypocrite. Plain and simple. You have exposed yourself in this thread, and its interesting that someone who has been regarded for conservative posts is now fighting right alongside the liberals, the Universalists, and the atheists.

You Parson were the one who turned the discussion nasty with your insults of homeschoolers, so come down off of your high horse before you further embarrass yourself. My rebuke of you initially was in your attitudes towards homeschoolers as much as anything, and that was based on your responses in this thread. But now you have nothing substantive to say other than to accuse others of lying.

Ok fine, believe that the public schools are this wonderful place where children are taught to love and honor God, and the Bible is taught openly. But you will be believing a lie. You defend a system that denies the very Jesus Christ that you say you love and honor. The very Christ who DIED for you and BOUGHT you with His blood is NOT WELCOME in the public schools you are defending. And for you to spend this thread attempting to argue that He is, is absolutely ludicrous. Christ is not taught in the public schools and He is NOT welcome there.

 

[PKevman]

Okay, I'm calling you out on this one.

It's OBVIOUS that you believe that those of us who DON'T pull our kids out of public school don't love our kids. Is this is an example of you NOT being judgmental and critical? Is this an example of you NOT being "abusive" toward those of us who aren't homeschoolers?

Actually it wasn't. I was simply sharing how I feel about homeschooling and that I would never put my kids in a public school for a number of reasons. Not the least of which is the fact that my Savior who bought me and paid for my sins with HIS LIFE on the cross IS NOT WELCOME THERE! So quite frankly, there is no way I am going to allow my kids to be indoctrinated with anti-God mumbo jumbo. If you have chosen that for your kids, that is your decision. But guess what, I love my own kids and my Savior more than that. If Jesus isn't welcome there, neither am I or my family. As for me and my house, we will serve the Lord.

Again can you please share with us what public school you were allowed to openly teach the Bible and Jesus Christ in? I would love to commend them for it! Seriously!

 

[PKevman]

Boy... talk about being judgmental about people you don't even know!

Parson. Are you aware that Jesus taught that we are to judge rightly?

Red77 is openly a Universalist, which is what I said to him. You should seriously investigate something before firing off by the seat of your pants. I have been discussing and debating Universalism with Red77 for 8 months! I am pretty aware of his positions on things.

 

[ParsonJefferson]

I shared with you a real story, and your only response is to accuse me of making it up and lying? That is the slander. You are a blooming hypocrite. Plain and simple. You have exposed yourself in this thread, and its interesting that someone who has been regarded for conservative posts is now fighting right alongside the liberals, the Universalists, and the atheists.

You Parson were the one who turned the discussion nasty with your insults of homeschoolers, so come down off of your high horse before you further embarrass yourself. My rebuke of you initially was in your attitudes towards homeschoolers as much as anything, and that was based on your responses in this thread. But now you have nothing substantive to say other than to accuse others of lying.

Ok fine, believe that the public schools are this wonderful place where children are taught to love and honor God, and the Bible is taught openly. But you will be believing a lie. You defend a system that denies the very Jesus Christ that you say you love and honor. The very Christ who DIED for you and BOUGHT you with His blood is NOT WELCOME in the public schools you are defending. And for you to spend this thread attempting to argue that He is, is absolutely ludicrous. Christ is not taught in the public schools and He is NOT welcome there.

Do you believe everything a 5th Grader tells you?

I do NOT believe that a 5th Grade teacher was showing kids videos giving them explicit information concerning how to give and receive oral sex. That is insane, and you should be ashamed of yourself for spreading that kind of slander without ANY basis for it.

IF a teacher had done something like that, he/she would be fired immediately and prosecuted. WHY? Because that kind of activity is illegal.

I don't believe one word of it - and you've provided nothing other than 3rd-had hearsay to back up your wild and outlandish claim.



So I'm a hypocrite for pointing that out? You're a slanderer for saying it. Would you care to tell me what the Bible says about slander? Or are you too steeped in your own self-righteousness to see it?

 

[ParsonJefferson]

Actually it wasn't. I was simply sharing how I feel about homeschooling and that I would never put my kids in a public school for a number of reasons. Not the least of which is the fact that my Savior who bought me and paid for my sins with HIS LIFE on the cross IS NOT WELCOME THERE! So quite frankly, there is no way I am going to allow my kids to be indoctrinated with anti-God mumbo jumbo. If you have chosen that for your kids, that is your decision. But guess what, I love my own kids and my Savior more than that. If Jesus isn't welcome there, neither am I or my family. As for me and my house, we will serve the Lord.

Again can you please share with us what public school you were allowed to openly teach the Bible and Jesus Christ in? I would love to commend them for it! Seriously!

It's good to know how proud you are of being such a superior parent. It's good to know that you "love your own kids and your Savior" more than that. It's good to know that you'll proudly condemn parents who don't pull our kids out of public school.

Do you have ANY idea how incredibly arrogant you are being?

 

[ParsonJefferson]

From Post #4 in this thread:

Doesn't sound like you have a high opinion of homeschooling at all.

Look for the word "in". :chuckle: I didn't say I started the thread.

I was making a point. You keep complaining about the attitudes of homeschoolers. I was telling you that we've gotten the same, if not worse, attitude for years from pro-public education folk. I know that two wrongs doesn't make a right. But, it kind of shows you a little bit about our mindset. And, just because some homeschoolers believe that sending your kids to public school is a sin, doesn't mean that all of us do. Crash (and others) know that I don't necessarily agree with them on that opinion. I don't think it's necessarily wise to send your children to public school, but I don't believe that it's a sin.

The point of my showing you that thread was to show you an example of how "professional educators" tend to talk to homeschoolers.

My opinion on that is that you took the thing about rolling joints and putting on condoms out of context. Crash has strong opinions about homeschooling. Like I said, a lot of people do. And, both he and PastorKevin said what they did after you talked to ShadowMaid the way you did.

Not everything that was said about public school had to do with you. That is what my point is with this discussion, ParsonJefferson. I decided to enter this thread when I saw your answer to ShadowMaid. I don't suppose that you know that she is a seventeen year old girl. Do you? She has asked you some questions that you find objectional. The question about rolling joints and putting on condoms, in my opinion, was actually funny if you take the conversation in context. Someone said something about learning those things in public school. You said that your kids didn't learn them in public school. ShadowMaid asked if they learned it at home since they didn't learn it at school. Maybe it was said in bad taste. But, I took what she said as a joke.

In this thread? Probably not. But, although I should make a more concerted effort that way, I know that I don't try to win people to Christ every minute of every day. I'm guessing that they don't either.

First of all, how or why would I know that Shadowmaid is a 17-year old girl? Second, if she wants to smart off at me, she needs to put on her big girl undies and not go crying to mommy if somebody smarts off back at her.


I'm sorry, but I have lost virtually all - if not all - of my respect for homeschoolers, as a result of this thread. What has been expressed here has been nothing short of arrogant, dishonest, shameful and unChristian. I have never before seen such hostility, nastiness, condescension and hatred coming from people who claim to be Christians.

I'm sure that PastorKevin will feel God is leading him to Neg-Rep me - yet again - for this. I'm sure that I'll be condemned to hell for this. I'm sure I'll be rebuked - again - for this. I'm sure that I'll be told I don't love my kids - again - for this. I'm sure I'll be accused of all manner of stupid things for this. But I don't care any more than I care what Fred Phelps thinks.

 

[kmoney]

Parson Jefferson, I think everyone would like you to realize that when we say all public schools, we do not literally mean, all public schools. When we say all public schoolers, we do not mean, all public schoolers.

Then maybe you should say what you mean and people wouldn't be confused.

"All homeschoolers are social rejects. But by "all homeschoolers" I don't actually mean all homeschoolers, just some. :freak:

 

[kmoney]

NO! The Public schools are run by FOOLS and swarming with reprobate delinquents.

And you think it's impossible for the teaching of the parents to trump what the child may see/hear in school?

 

[Layla]

Yeah - we can generalize based on all the schools we went to, based on all the schools our friends went to, all the schools in the surrounding areas, all the schools in the news, ect. ect....need I go on?

Yet you're happy to discount all those who had a great public school education and never went through any of the things you talk about (sex, drugs, etc). Anecdote is only reasonable when it fits your case?

Pastor Kevin brought up a good point when you said, "Maybe I'd have done better with private school or homeschool, but I would have missed out on the majority of my experiences, which taught me a lot and made me who I am."

Is that why you are a self-proclaimed atheist? Pat yourself of the back then - the public school considers you to be a GREAT success! :thumb:

Did you read my reply to that post? I was taught christianity at school, I'm an atheist all by myself.