Why Homosexuality MUST Be Recriminalized! Part 3

[Nazaroo]

Once again: Jesus repealed the penalty phase against homosexuality (there is a reason why Christian legislators [sic.] rarely imposed the death penalty on acts of homosexuality, and I'm thinking because they understood Scripture better than you).

You are simply a naive fool.

We have NEVER HAD ANY Christian legislators, in the USA or anywhere else.

All of the Freemasons who formed the USA were heretics,
or simply agnostics or vague deists.

Not even Emperor Constantine was a baptized Catholic.
He was a heretic who denied the deity of Christ and the Trinity.

You didn't answer my question Naz:

You haven't answered mine.
What BS argument are you going to put forward to try to demonstrate
that Jesus changed the law?
Specifically, show me where Jesus told you to no longer enforce the law
against Sodomy.

Instead of giving those children who are sexually confused the opportunity to repent, are you going to execute them by firing squad, hanging or lethal injection?

My bad, Torah law says that they should be stoned.

What nonsense are you talking now?
You showed me a picture of some teens hugging.
What evidence do you have that they committed sodomy?
Please don't post pictures: Just turn them into the police,
along with yourself if you are in possession of any child porn.

If the penalty phase didn't change, surely you can't change the method of execution can you Mullah Nazaroo?

There is no need to change the method of execution,
in a land where the Sodomy Law is strictly enforced.
Pretty much no one would dare do it.
The few who did would be dealt with immediately, reminding all others.

Moses only stoned one man for collecting sticks on the Sabbath.
The lesson was quite effective for some 200 years.

(Naz ... calls me a confused Christian?).

Was there ever any doubt?

Jesus Christ, the Son of God/God in the flesh amongst other things changed things such as Jewish dietary (ceremonial) laws for those who didn't practice the Jewish faith.

Jesus never changed the dietary laws. That is impossible.

Ask any farmer.
Every species has its own ideal diet.
The farther you stray from that diet, the sicker the animal gets.

Jesus never changed any food laws,
nor did he change any medical laws,
nor did Jesus change the laws of chemistry or physics.

People get sick and die from breaking the food laws today,
just as they did in Noah's time.
That combined with gluttony, drug abuse
and sexual immorality accounts for 99% of all disease.

Diet is not arbitrary, and if you refuse to follow the wisdom of God
in regard to diet and teach others to do so, you will die a horrible death,
and be told why as you die.

Bible Authority Flood and Food Laws: Where do you stand?

Drug Dealing and the Bible

While God's Universal Moral Laws (in this case against sexual sins) remained, the penalty phase against sinful sexual behaviors also changed.

And again, you make a nonsensical and unsubstantiated claim.
Presumably its based on the fact that priests diddle little boys,
and sodomize them, and so it must be okay now and no penalty phase
should be enforced.

Again, you aren't showing anyone a single Holy Scripture or example
of why we should believe that Jesus magically and secretly did away with
the death penalty for Sodomy, on your word alone.

Even the pope has never made such a claim,
and he has a lot of reasons to try.

Civil government penalizing sinful thoughts? How is that even possible?

Its obviously not, which is why there is no penalty for thoughts,
except from God Almighty who knows your thoughts.

Why do you think that civil governments, even those that don't practice your beloved religion of Islam have rarely if ever used the death penalty in cases of homosexuality/sodomy Mullah Nazaroo?

Its obvious.

The ruling class are the largest most powerful organized pedophile rings
in history.

Examine some police evidence about it and get back to me.

(I'll give you a hint: It isn't considered a capital offense in Christianized western civilization).

I'll give you more than a hint. I'll give you a FACT.

The West was never properly Christianized nor civilized.

You are living in la la land.

 

[aCultureWarrior]

Quote:
Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior
Children that are sexually molested often turn to homosexuality; I've shown case after case throughout this 3 part thread.

Face it aCW by far most gay people have never been molested but nevertheless are gay anyway.

How'd they get that way Al, did the homosexual desire bug bite them when they slept at night?

Your specially selected anecdotal spin doesn't make homosexuals as a group any more culpable of harming children than anyone else.

But Al, it's not harmful in the eyes of a homosexual pedophile, it's "love".

North American Man Boy LOVE Association.

Speaking of studies:

"The Associated Press noted in late 1998 that, according to an analysis of 166 studies covering the years 1985-97: "As many as one in five boys is sexually abused....It [also] concluded that sexual abuse of boys is underreported and undertreated."
Associated Press, "Study: As many as 1 in 5 boys sexually abused," Chicago Tribune, Dec. 2, 1998, section 1, p. 22.

There have been several TOL'ers that have admitted being sexually molested as a child (courageously I might add), two that I can think of right off hand.

One of them is working to overcome his homosexual desires (and very well might have since he last posted in this thread) through his faith in Jesus Christ. The other currently posts in this thread and pretends that he's not a practicing homosexual.

Which do you admire more Al?

 

[aCultureWarrior]

I see that Mullah Nazaroo has gone on yet another one of his rants while I was posting to Al the atheist (and I was so hoping that TOL's "Libertarian in denial"-WizardofOz would hurry back with his expert knowledge on Jewish Civil/Moral/Ceremonial Laws).

While I will devote an entire segment called "The 3 Tenets of Atheism" which will include this topic , here is a very good article that explains what Mullah Nazaroo and I have been discussing:

Should homosexuals be put to death?

"No, homosexuals...should not be put to death. We don't live under the Old Testament Law in which the moral and civil requirements are both in effect. Instead, as Christians we are to pray for the salvation of those who are lost in their sexual sin.

... we are not to support legislation that gives them special rights...

But then, what do we do about the Bible saying to kill homosexuals?

•"If there is a man who lies with a male as those who lie with a woman, both of them have committed a detestable act; they shall surely be put to death. Their bloodguiltiness is upon them." (Lev. 20:13, NASB)
•"If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them." (Lev. 20:13, ESV)

First of all, there are divisions within the Old Testament Law that are important. Basically, it is categorized into three main sections: Civil, Ceremonial, and Moral. Let's take a quick look.

1.Civil--Expired with the demise of the Jewish civil government
A.Justice practices (Exodus 21:12-36; Lev. 24:17-23)
B.Law of property redemption (Lev. 25)
C.Property rights (Exodus 22:1-15)
D.Be just with the poor, (Lev. 19:15)
E.Do not hate in your heart (Lev. 19:17)
F.Retain just scales in commerce (Lev. 19:35f)
G.Robbery, extortion, false witness, and restitution (Lev. 6:1-7)
H.Punishment of those who caused unwarranted death (Exodus 21:12-36)

2.Ceremonial--Expired with the fulfillment of priestly work of Christ (Matt. 3:15)
A.Various sacrificial offerings for sin (Lev. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6; Num. 28:1-31).
B.Priestly duties (Lev. 7:1-37; Numbers 3:25-39; 18:1-7)
C.Laws on animals for food (Lev. 11:1-47)
D.Cleaning house of leper (Lev. 14:33-57)
E.Law of Atonement (Lev. 16:1-28;17:1-16)
F.Regulations for Priests (Lev. 21, 22)
G.Festivals (Lev. 23:1-25)

3.Moral--No Expiration because it is based on God's character. "You shall be holy, for I the Lord your God am holy." (Lev. 19:2)
A.Do not steal or lie (Exodus 20:15,16; Lev. 19:12; Deut. 5:19-20)
B.Do not oppress your neighbor (Lev. 19:13)
C.No idolatry (Exodus 20:4-6; Lev. 26:1-13; Deut. 5:8-10; 13:1-18)
D.Do not commit murder (Deut. 5:17)
E.Don't sacrifice children to Molech (Lev. 20:1-5)
F.Don't commit adultery, incest, bestiality, homosexuality, etc. (Exodus 20:14; Lev. 20:9-21; Deut. 5:18)
G.You shall love your neighbor as yourself (Lev. 19:18)

The civil aspect of the law is no longer in effect because these laws were intended for a theocratic system; that is, a system where God's morals were enforced by the government. But the ancient governmental system is not in effect. Furthermore, the agent purity laws were in place to keep the Messianic line pure, so that Jesus would be born, die on the cross, be resurrected, and provide redemption to God's people. Now that the Messiah has arrived and accomplished his sacrificial work, the harshness of the Old Testament law is not necessary.

So, we're not to execute homosexuals any more than we are to execute adulterers. However, their sins should never be promoted in society."
http://carm.org/should-homosexuals-be-put-to-death

As seen throughout this thread, decriminalizing homosexuality has promoted the homosexual cause.

 

[Nazaroo]

I see that Mullah Nazaroo has gone on yet another one of his rants while I was posting to Al the atheist (and I was so hoping that TOL's "Libertarian in denial"-WizardofOz would hurry back with his expert knowledge on Jewish Civil/Moral/Ceremonial Laws).

While I will devote an entire segment called "The 3 Tenets of Atheism" which will include this topic , here is a very good article that explains what Mullah Nazaroo and I have been discussing:
...

So, we're not to execute homosexuals any more than we are to execute adulterers. However, their sins should never be promoted in society."
http://carm.org/should-homosexuals-be-put-to-death

As seen throughout this thread, decriminalizing homosexuality has promoted the homosexual cause.

You seem to be speaking through both sides of your mouth here.

Whatever Matt Slick says on CARM (a Protestant by the way)
which you simply cut and pasted,
its not based on any sensible or intelligent use of Holy Scripture or reason.

Matt asserts there are basically 3 kinds of laws,
civil, ceremonial, and moral.

This is 'standard' PROTESTANT fare, but is not based on any consistent
interpretation or application of Holy Scripture.

(1) Neither Matt, nor anyone else offers any method or rationale for
this arbitrary division of Old Testament Laws.

In fact, neither Moses nor any ancient Israelites would have known of
or embraced this simplified system of three 'categories'.

Moses would have held that sacrificial routines would have remained
necessary even AFTER the 1st advent of the Messiah,
because people would still have to eat, and clean animals would still
have to be properly killed and cleaned according to priestly laws,
even if they no longer served as substitutes for sin, as long as the
central temple and priesthood remained, and needed financial support.

Peter would have held that the food laws were still in effect for Jews,
and at least a simplified form of them were required for fellowship
with gentiles, just as the early Church ordered.

Rules about washing would NEVER be considered "ceremonial"
in a world that REMAINS filled with disease and danger,
and when 'doctors' in England and Germany abandoned washing,
the mortality rate for childbirth soared to 90%,
until a doctor "rediscovered" washing and saved the lives of thousands
of children and wounded.

NO ONE who takes the moral law seriously advocates that we
no longer arrest and punish murderers, since
Thou Shalt Not Murder is one of the Ten Commandments,
and continues to be ENFORCED by governments everywhere.

Thou Shalt Not Commit Adultery is also one of the Ten Commandments,
and is classed as a MORAL law, not civil or 'ceremonial'.
So by what authority can anyone, Protestant OR Catholic,
claim that the Death Penalty for Adultery should not be enforced?

The argument from the separation of ritual, ceremonial and moral,
does NOTHING to demonstrate why MURDER should be policed by government,
while ADULTERY and SODOMY should NOT be policed by government.

So this pathetic attempt to justify why modern Christianity has
abandoned most of the Laws of God and the Bible completely fails.

The LAW stands, and so does the punishment.

'The man who commits the death-penalty sin, SHALL DIE.' (Ezekiel 18:20)

So please just answer this one question:

Why should MURDER be policed by government,
while ADULTERY and SODOMY should NOT be policed by government?

Where did Jesus make this distinction?

 

[aCultureWarrior]

So please just answer this one question:

Why should MURDER be policed by government,
while ADULTERY and SODOMY should NOT be policed by government?

Ummmm Naz, take a look at the name of the thread that you're in.

The argument between us isn't whether or not homosexuality should be legal (it's always been a serious offense, a felony in every state until the sodomites took control of our laws and culture), the argument is about the penalty phase.

Where did Jesus make this distinction?

As much as you and Aaron/WizardofOz hate copy and pastes (I just heard from Aaron via PM, he should be here shortly to share his pagan-homosexualist-Libertarian expertise on the bible with us).

The question is: should this harsh punishment be applied to today’s world? Does it have universal application?
Jesus came to fulfill the law or Torah, not to destroy or abolish it (Matthew 5:17). He fulfills it in at least three ways, but the one we look at here takes away the law’s severe punishments. This benefits all of society, especially today.
Jesus fulfills the law by taking on himself the penalty for our sins. The Torah is filled with specific punishments for specific sins, but his death on the cross satisfies and propitiates divine wrath that is directed at our sins—this is the Christian doctrine of the atonement. It is for this reason that a Christian could never give up this doctrine and must totally reject Muhammad’s odd view that Christ never died on the cross (Sura 4:157)... Muhammad’s belief is completely misguided. Christ’s death is God’s gift to us. We are saved and on our way to heaven, not based on our own works, but on Christ’s good work on the cross. Therefore, those who trust in Christ do not have to pay the penalty for their sins.
It is therefore certain that homosexuals should not be put to death for their sins. The entire sweep of the New Testament says that all sexual sins begin in the heart and can only be healed in the heart, by transforming it. This is why Jesus and the inspired New Testament authors write often about the indwelling power of the Holy Spirit (Matthew 1:18; 3:11; Luke 11:13; John 20:22). He lives in them to enable and empower them to walk in love, which fulfills the law (Matthew 23:37-40; Romans 13:10). In contrast, a major problem with the law of Muhammad is the distortion of the blessed doctrine of the Holy Spirit, who has been reduced to the archangel Gabriel in Islamic theology. According to this doctrine, Muslims do not enjoy the Holy Spirit living in them in the way described by Jesus Christ and the New Testament, so they have to fulfill the old-new law of Muhammad by their own efforts.
This may be a major factor as to why Muhammad reinstituted the punishments found in the Torah. Being merely a human messenger (Sura 3:144), he could not send the Holy Spirit into the hearts of people so that they could be changed from the inside out. On the other hand, as the eternal Son of God, Jesus does in fact send the Holy Spirit into the hearts of all those who ask for him, and now they have living in them the power to be changed from the inside out.
http://www.answering-islam.org/Authors/Arlandson/homosexual.htm

It's all about the sacrifice Christ paid on the Cross for us (redemption). None of your posts has compassion for the weak Naz, that's why I have to question your understanding of Christianity (plus you want to kill dogs that hump your leg).

 

[aCultureWarrior]

While thinking about the conversations that I had with homosexualist atheists alwight and Truths4yer, and then the Christian Nazaroo, I realized that both have something very much in common:

Homosexuals would rather see a sexually confused person die than have them change, hardliners like Nazaroo would rather have them killed than give them the opportunity to change. (Don't get me wrong Naz, homosexuals can be a disgusting lot. When GFR7 and Uberpod1 went into one of their typical lisp rants the other night, I had to shut down the thread and go delouse. That doesn't mean that these lost souls don't need God and the tools that God gave us (righteous laws) to help them find the way to righteous living).

Looking over the "Ex Gay Truth" website
http://ex-gaytruth.com/ex-gay-testimonies/

and many of the testimonies of former homosexuals, I was amazed at how accurate Dr. Paul Cameron's article on

"What causes homosexual desire and can it be changed?" is.
http://www.theologyonline.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3393262&postcount=17

Looking at the various testimonies I noticed not only did physical molestation as a child play a big role into leading that person into a life of homosex, but not having a father or loving father present in the home.

Hopefully after reading the two articles that I posted regarding Jewish laws, hardliners like Nazaroo will realize that the death penalty for homosexuals (unless they commit a capital offense) is not the way for a society to handle this out of control cancer, but righteous laws with the opportunity to repent is.

 

[GFR7]

aCW, you're an idiot.
I'm not homosexual and you know it, so stop the libel and slander.

 

[Truths4yer]

I was amazed at how accurate Dr. Paul Cameron's article

Wikipedia presents a nice overview of Paul Cameron:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Cameron#Criticism

Incidentally, he is about the only person less credible than you on this topic. He was molested by a man as a child too, which is actually what made me realise the same was likely true of you. You two have quite a lot in common except that he is more focused on misrepresenting other scientist's work, while you just share anecdotes.

 

[aCultureWarrior]

aCW, you're an idiot.
I'm not homosexual and you know it, so stop the libel and slander.

Then quit acting like one.

 

[GFR7]

Then quit acting like one.

:think: You're right. :jawdrop:

 

[aCultureWarrior]

Quote:
Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior
I was amazed at how accurate Dr. Paul Cameron's article is [about what causes homosexual behavior and if it can be changed].

Wikipedia presents a nice overview of Paul Cameron:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Cameron#Criticism

Incidentally, he is about the only person less credible than you on this topic. He was molested by a man as a child too, which is actually what made me realise the same was likely true of you. You two have quite a lot in common except that he is more focused on misrepresenting other scientist's work, while you just share anecdotes.

You use a wikipedia article to smear Paul Cameron with? (and here I gave you credit for being a first rate homosexualist).

Review the testimonies from the Ex Gay Truth website and tell me that Cameron wasn't spot on in his article that I linked.

 

[aCultureWarrior]

Quote:
Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior
Then quit acting like one [a homosexual].

:think: You're right. :jawdrop:

You too should study the testimonies from the Ex Gay Truth website. They could help lead you down the path of righteousness (after all of those years of writing for homosexual publications and defending perverse behavior, you definitely need some mentoring).

 

[GFR7]

Quote:
Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior
Then quit acting like one [a homosexual].



You too should study the testimonies from the Ex Gay Truth website. They could help lead you down the path of righteousness (after all of those years of writing for homosexual publications and defending perverse behavior, you definitely need some mentoring).

But I in factdon't defend perverse behavior. Indeed, I admonish it. And I told you I did a brief stint for _________ magazine. I got fired, too. :chuckle: And everyone here (except for you) accuses me of bashing gays (which I try not to do)--everyone from Tracer to Rusha to DuckDuck. :AMR1:

 

[aCultureWarrior]

But I in factdon't defend perverse behavior. Indeed, I admonish it. And I told you I did a brief stint for _________ magazine. I got fired, too. :chuckle: And everyone here (except for you) accuses me of bashing gays (which I try not to do)--everyone from Tracer to Rusha to DuckDuck. :AMR1:

Wow GFR7/Scot, you've been able to pull one over on a couple of pagans and an atheist. Impressive!

 

[GFR7]

Wow GFR7/Scot, you've been able to pull one over on a couple of pagans and an atheist. Impressive!

Why would a post hundreds of anti-gay marriage threads to "pull one over" on some posters I don't know? :nono: lain:

 

[aCultureWarrior]

Wow GFR7/Scot, you've been able to pull one over on a couple of pagans and an atheist. Impressive!

Why would a post hundreds of anti-gay marriage threads to "pull one over" on some posters I don't know? :nono: lain:

To give the people on TOL and those on the www the false impression that you stand for decency.

Your posts throughout this thread show differently.

What's the old saying GFR7/Scot?

"You can fool some of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you can not fool all of the people all of the time."

Keep working on your con game GFR7, as it needs vast improvement....

OR

You could get down on your knees and BEG for God's forgiveness and show that you mean it by being obedient to His Word.

On that note: Onward I move...

 

[GFR7]

To give the people on TOL and those on the www the false impression that you stand for decency.

Your posts throughout this thread show differently.

What's the old saying GFR7/Scot?

"You can fool some of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you can not fool all of the people all of the time."

Keep working on your con game GFR7, as it needs vast improvement....

OR

You could get down on your knees and BEG for God's forgiveness and show that you mean it by being obedient to His Word.

On that note: Onward I move...

You don't know who you're speaking to.
You're ranting nonsense.
Christianity is a blessing, but as you are practicing it, friend -
You'd better look to it. And to your posting, as well. (Slander)

 

[Truths4yer]

You use a wikipedia article to smear Paul Cameron with? (and here I gave you credit for being a first rate homosexualist).
Review the testimonies from the Ex Gay Truth website and tell me that Cameron wasn't spot on in his article that I linked.

Wikipedia links to all the relevant sources in its criticism and isn't too verbose in that section, which is why I shared it, rather than linking to each of those. You don't care about the truth so aren't worth any more than that. Cameron has smeared himself, which is why he's been repudiated by about 3 major state and national social science institutions.

Ex-gay therapy generally involves looking for anything in a patient's past that could be considered bad (molestation & distant parents are firm favourites), then, assuming that it caused them to be homosexual or bisexual. Those who've got videos of themselves up at the time they believed the ex-gay delusion will likely refer to such things, just as Cameron will, as they've been taught that these things caused their homosexuality.

Obviously to really test such a hypothesis, you'd need control groups... but that would probably be getting a little complicated for you to follow.

*The Royal College of Psychiatrists:*
"Despite almost a century of psychoanalytic and psychological speculation, there is no substantive evidence to support the suggestion that the nature of parenting or early childhood experiences have any role in the formation of a person’s fundamental heterosexual or homosexual orientation".

 

[GFR7]

Wikipedia links to all the relevant sources in its criticism and isn't too verbose in that section, which is why I shared it, rather than linking to each of those. You don't care about the truth so aren't worth any more than that. Cameron has smeared himself, which is why he's been repudiated by about 3 major state and national social science institutions.

One thing to keep in mind when relating to aCW, if you're not to lose the entire thread of the thing altogether:

He's in a time warp:

He is about 25+ years behind on all the facts:

• Still thinks Wikipedia is a non-legitimate source (when in truth their editing is among the most stringent on the web).
• Still thinks gay men are covered with sores, emaciated, and dropping like flies from AIDs.
• Still thinks HIV + men have to take cocktails of 30 drugs per day.

So the rule of thumb is: Act like you're back in the period of 1987 - 1994.

 

[aCultureWarrior]

To give the people on TOL and those on the www the false impression that you stand for decency.

Your posts throughout this thread show differently.

What's the old saying GFR7/Scot?

"You can fool some of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you can not fool all of the people all of the time."

Keep working on your con game GFR7, as it needs vast improvement....

OR

You could get down on your knees and BEG for God's forgiveness and show that you mean it by being obedient to His Word.

On that note: Onward I move...

You don't know who you're speaking to.
You're ranting nonsense.
Christianity is a blessing, but as you are practicing it, friend -
You'd better look to it. And to your posting, as well. (Slander)

Oh but I do know who I'm speaking to: an active member of the homosexual movement:

One thing to keep in mind when relating to aCW, if you're not to lose the entire thread of the thing altogether:

He's in a time warp:

He is about 25+ years behind on all the facts:

• Still thinks Wikipedia is a non-legitimate source (when in truth their editing is among the most stringent on the web).
• Still thinks gay men are covered with sores, emaciated, and dropping like flies from AIDs.
• Still thinks HIV + men have to take cocktails of 30 drugs per day.

So the rule of thumb is: Act like you're back in the period of 1987 - 1994.

It doesn't take much for you to give yourself way GFR7/Scot.

First of all: with all of the fag studies done, I would think that your new flame (with Uberpod1 temporarily gone, you have to cling to some other homosexualist) would use something other than a wiki article to defame the studies of Dr. Paul Cameron.

#2: As shown in various CDC reports, homosexuals still are contracting AIDS and many of them are dying way before their time, either from AIDS or AIDS related diseases. (Refer to the Bay Area Reporter Homosexual Obituary website for confirmation of what I just said).

http://obit.glbthistory.org/olo/index.jsp

#3: I also acknowledged to one of your fellow homosexualists in earlier posts that HAART cocktails only consist of one or two very expensive pills.

What are you homosexuals going to do when the gubermint no longer subsidizes pills that extends your life for a few more years?