ECT why don't you say the Our Father?

[Danoh]

I agree with all of that.

Where they are mistaken, is that Paul was speaking about a specific set of works. That's why he says "works of the law", it's not works in general. If people will honesty look at the context it's clear Paul is talking about works of the Mosaical law which did not have a provision to save.

I know she is; I don't know if you are, but she is asserting the need to obey in order to stay saved, in contrast to obeying because one has been saved and thus, enabled to obey.

She is asserting Galatians 3's being made perfect by the flesh despite the fact of Paul's assertion that we have already been perfected in our inward man by the Spirit.

She is adding works to the finished work of Christ. That is not the same as obeying because one is saved as well as because, once saved, one is then enabled to obey.

Hers is the flesh's notion of obedience. Hers is religion, not faith.

 

[Danoh]

The Jews used to have to make themselves clean on their own.

They would make themselves clean by doing a list of works.

These are the works that the Jews had to do to make themselves clean, righteous, and justified before God:


The Burnt Offering; The Grain Offering; The Fellowship Offering; The Sin Offering; The Guilt Offering; Dietary Laws; Purification After Childbirth; Cleansing From Infectious Skin Diseases; Cleansing From Mildew; Discharges Causing Uncleanness; The Day of Atonement; Rules for Priests; The Sabbath; Firstfruits; The Passover and Unleavened Bread; Feast of Weeks; Feast of Trumpets; Feast of Tabernacles; Oil and Bread Set Before The LORD; the Sabbath Year; The Year of Jubilee; Circumcision.


No one has to do those works to clean themselves anymore...all we have to do is have faith, believe that Jesus' blood cleans us.

As always, we still have to obey God.




Right; for obeying God is what saves, even when God says get circumcised, and sacrifice animals.

Obeying God saves us, and God tells us we no longer have to work at cleaning ourselves because Jesus now does that for us.

So, you are confused after all.

 

[God's Truth]

People are not obeying Jesus and they do not teach obedience to Christ because they think they can stay exactly as they are and that what they do has nothing to with being saved. They think the more they believe in their faith the more sure of their salvation. It is a tricky and strange place to be. I believe that misunderstanding goes way back even to the time of the Apostles that is why James explains that faith without obedience is dead, and Peter says people misunderstand Paul, and then Peter warns us to obey. See James 2:14, 17, and 22; and, 2 Peter 3:16, and 17.


We have to obey Jesus to be saved, and to stay saved.

Jesus is the Way. If you do not do what the Way says then you have deceived yourself.

When we obey Jesus, we surrender to Jesus and completely trust him that what he tells us to do we will do, even when we do not yet understand why.

We live through Jesus and Jesus lives through us when we obey.

It is how we eat Jesus flesh.

It is how we clothe ourselves with Christ.

It is how we KNOWN and UNDERSTAND God.

 

[Danoh]

People are not obeying Jesus and they do not teach obedience to Christ because they think they can stay exactly as they are and that what they do has nothing to with being saved. They think the more they believe in their faith the more sure of their salvation. It is a tricky and strange place to be. I believe that misunderstanding goes way back even to the time of the Apostles that is why James explains that faith without obedience is dead, and Peter says people misunderstand Paul, and then Peter warns us to obey. See James 2:14, 17, and 22; and, 2 Peter 3:16, and 17.


We have to obey Jesus to be saved, and to stay saved.

Jesus is the Way. If you do not do what the Way says then you have deceived yourself.

When we obey Jesus, we surrender to Jesus and completely trust him that what he tells us to do we will do, even when we do not yet understand why.

We live through Jesus and Jesus lives through us when we obey.

It is how we eat Jesus flesh.

It is how we clothe ourselves with Christ.

It is how we KNOWN and UNDERSTAND God.

All you do is keep proving you don't know what we are talking about as to the obediance issue. Your every response is from ignorance on the difference I have posted just before this post here.

 

[God's Truth]

People misunderstand Jesus and have made Jesus' words hard, heavy, and burdensome.

They say what Jesus says is impossible to obey, so they preach against it.

People misunderstand Jesus and think Jesus tells everyone to sell their homes and possessions and give it to the poor.

I guess then the poor would be more sinners now because they have a home and possessions? Think about that and how illogical it is to believe Jesus was telling everyone it is what he wants for everyone to sell their home and give everything away.

When Jesus was on earth, he had an earthly ministry. Jesus traveled and did not live at his own home. Jesus coming to earth was the most important thing that could ever happen. Those who preached with Jesus were doing something important too, and they had give up everything to become traveling ministers. Jesus does not command all of us to be traveling ministers...not then and not now.

 

[Danoh]

GT, which is it o confused one - this "We have to obey Jesus to be saved..."

Or this "...all we have to do is have faith, believe that Jesus' blood cleans us."

 

[God's Truth]

I know she is; I don't know if you are, but she is asserting the need to obey in order to stay saved, in contrast to obeying because one has been saved and thus, enabled to obey.

There are many here who say we do not have to obey, ever.

She is asserting Galatians 3's being made perfect by the flesh despite the fact of Paul's assertion that we have already been perfected in our inward man by the Spirit.

Paul was not telling them they did not have to obey...that would be ludicrous. Paul was saying they no longer had to be made clean by getting circumcised and observing special days. Those things USED to make the people clean.

She is adding works to the finished work of Christ. That is not the same as obeying because one is saved as well as because, once saved, one is then enabled to obey.

You are believing the false teachings of Luther and Calvin. We can believe before we are saved, and we can obey before we are saved.

After we do what Jesus says to be chosen for salvation, he gives us the Holy Spirit to help us obey.

Hers is the flesh's notion of obedience. Hers is religion, not faith.

You are in a very bad way.

 

[Danoh]

People misunderstand Jesus and have made Jesus' words hard, heavy, and burdensome.

They say what Jesus says is impossible to obey, so they preach against it.

People misunderstand Jesus and think Jesus tells everyone to sell their homes and possessions and give it to the poor.

I guess then the poor would be more sinners now because they have a home and possessions? Think about that and how illogical it is to believe Jesus was telling everyone it is what he wants for everyone to sell their home and give everything away.

When Jesus was on earth, he had an earthly ministry. Jesus traveled and did not live at his own home. Jesus coming to earth was the most important thing that could ever happen. Those who preached with Jesus were doing something important too, and they had give up everything to become traveling ministers. Jesus does not command all of us to be traveling ministers...not then and not now.

You completely misunderstood Aikido 7's words to you about that.

He was making a point that went right passed you, but that you then interpreted as you just have anyway.

You have no business talking about these things - you consistently take some one's point as being some other point.

You are blind to this disability of yours because you are proud.

You have no business talking about these issues - none - you twist everything to your own destruction.

Fortunately, anyone friendly with you soon sees this disability of yours along with your pride. Next thing you know; you have been added to one more person's list of "people who haven't a clue."

Be ashamed of yourself already - get some help with this disability of yours. Or go spend your time talking to your fifteen cats or something, already. Quit making yourself such a ridicule.

Bad enough you mock the FINISHED "work" of the Cross with your "obey to be saved."

 

[Danoh]

No fool, GT, the Law was more than ceremonial works - it was not ceremonial works that Paul jumped down Peter's throat about in Galatians two.

The Law has all sorts of "ordinances and statutes."

http://www.jewfaq.org/613.htm

Those are "thou shalt nots" and or "thou shalts" - one was "a debtor do do the whole Law," but where it differed as to male, female, various roles, and so on."

You do NOT know what you are talking about. Yours in this is straight RCC, Mormon, Pentecostal, 7th Day Adventist error.

 

[God's Truth]

GT, which is it o confused one - this "We have to obey Jesus to be saved..."

Or this "...all we have to do is have faith, believe that Jesus' blood cleans us."

Jesus saves us all on his own, and he tells us whom he chooses for salvation.

We do not have to clean ourselves by doing works that were once commanded. Jesus' blood cleans us now and it is done by just believing.

Those who want to be saved have to do what Jesus says. Jesus says to humble ourselves as little children or you will never enter the kingdom of God.

What happens when we do that? What happens when we obey Jesus and humble ourselves as a little child? When we humble ourselves as little children, we are ready to do everything that Jesus says.

Jesus says we must admit we are sinners and repent of our sins.

We also must forgive others if we want to be forgiven.

We must prepare our hearts for Jesus to live there.

Jesus is not going to make his home with just anyone.

Our faith will even be tempted.

 

[God's Truth]

No fool, GT, the Law was more than ceremonial works - it was not ceremonial works that Paul jumped down Peter's throat about in Galatians two.

You are in danger of Hell fire.

The Law has all sorts of "ordinances and statutes."

Those are "thou shalt nots" and or "thou shalts" - one was "a debtor do do the whole Law," but where it differed as to male, female, various roles, and so on."

You do NOT know what you are talking about. Yours in this is straight RCC, Mormon, Pentecostal, 7th Day Adventist error.

No one anywhere in the Bible ever rebukes anyone ever for obeying Jesus too much. Nowhere anywhere in the Bible are we warned not to think our obedience means anything. That is beyond ludicrous.

 

[Danoh]

Jesus saves us all on his own, and he tells us whom he chooses for salvation.

We do not have to clean ourselves by doing works that were once commanded. Jesus' blood cleans us now and it is done by just believing.

Those who want to be saved have to do what Jesus says. Jesus says to humble ourselves as little children or you will never enter the kingdom of God.

What happens when we do that? What happens when we obey Jesus and humble ourselves as a little child? When we humble ourselves as little children, we are ready to do everything that Jesus says.

Jesus says we must admit we are sinners and repent of our sins.

We also must forgive others if we want to be forgiven.

We must prepare our hearts for Jesus to live there.

Jesus is not going to make his home with just anyone.

Our faith will even be tempted.

Nonsense! That is you taking His words to mean something other then what He is talking about - within their setting - just like you continually misunderstand other's points on here to mean something other then what they meant their point to be.

You do this all the time.

Read this list, fool - see how many were not this ceremonial nonsense of yours.

http://www.jewfaq.org/613.htm

 

[Danoh]

You are in danger of Hell fire.

No one anywhere in the Bible ever rebukes anyone ever for obeying Jesus too much. Nowhere anywhere in the Bible are we warned not to think our obedience means anything. That is beyond ludicrous.

It is your adding your works to the Cross that is the danger of hellfire in these discussion - yours.

Fool, this has nothing to do with obeying Him too much.

Rather, with your fool idea od what that obedience is - your "good" intentions ever paving your road to hell.

Go play with your cats. Its the same effect - none of any good on here.

 

[God's Truth]

Jesus taught the NEW COVENANT guidelines and commands.

If you do not obey what Jesus says in the New Testament, then you will not be given understanding.

If you want to be saved, then you have to do what the Way says to get saved.

You must agree to the terms of the Covenant.

You must follow the Covenant rules exactly.

 

[Danoh]

Jesus taught the NEW COVENANT guidelines and commands.

If you do not obey what Jesus says in the New Testament, then you will not be given understanding.

If you want to be saved, then you have to do what the Way says to get saved.

You must agree to the terms of the Covenant.

You must follow the Covenant rules exactly.

Read - woman!

http://www.jewfaq.org/613.htm

 

[turbosixx]

she is asserting the need to obey in order to stay saved, in contrast to obeying because one has been saved and thus, enabled to obey.

I agree with her on this point.

Col. 1:22 yet He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach- 23 if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel that you have heard,

Our continuing to obey physically is how we worship him spiritually.

Rom. 12:1 Therefore I urge you, brethren, by the mercies of God, to present your bodies a living and holy sacrifice, acceptable to God, which is your spiritual service of worship.

 

[WonderfulLordJesus]

Just curious. What is it with you people who are so invasive and concerned over other peoples' exercise of faith? Wouldn't it be wiser to tend to your own salvation? What is this need to critique somebody else's prayer life? Are you God's gift to sanctimony or something? The Great Dictators? Just what if, try to consider it for a moment, the remote possibility, just what if I, for one, don't need your advice how to conduct my personal relationship with the Lord? I know it seems inconceivable, but give the thought a shot.

 

[chrysostom]

Just curious. What is it with you people who are so invasive and concerned over other peoples' exercise of faith? Wouldn't it be wiser to tend to your own salvation? What is this need to critique somebody else's prayer life? Are you God's gift to sanctimony or something? The Great Dictators? Just what if, try to consider it for a moment, the remote possibility, just what if I, for one, don't need your advice how to conduct my personal relationship with the Lord? I know it seems inconceivable, but give the thought a shot.

what are you doing here
if
you don't want to discuss each others' beliefs???????????

 

[turbosixx]

Just curious. What is it with you people who are so invasive and concerned over other peoples' exercise of faith? Wouldn't it be wiser to tend to your own salvation? What is this need to critique somebody else's prayer life? Are you God's gift to sanctimony or something? The Great Dictators? Just what if, try to consider it for a moment, the remote possibility, just what if I, for one, don't need your advice how to conduct my personal relationship with the Lord? I know it seems inconceivable, but give the thought a shot.

For one, he asked. Two, those who say it are serving man and not God.

1 Tim. 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator also between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,

 

[WonderfulLordJesus]

what are you doing here
if
you don't want to discuss each others' beliefs???????????

I hear you, not discussing your papist cult beliefs, anyway. Whatever the case, it's Friday. Shouldn't you be out snapping some mackerel? That's what I'd be doing, if I believed I were a cheeseburger removed from purgatory.