Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
When a Christian sins he isn't exactly personally surrendering his life to the Lord, is he? Have you ever sinned since you personally surrendered your life to Him?
ECT What is the Will of God . . .
- Thread starter Cross Reference
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When a Christian sins he isn't exactly personally surrendering his life to the Lord, is he? Have you ever sinned since you personally surrendered your life to Him?
I think it's because you don't have a right understanding of how to apply Faith ( pisteuo ) that you would ask such a question .
Your asking if " a called out one " ( not yet been accepted by Christ yet ) can be in his sinful state and faithe towards God , or answer the call , at the same time ? I think you know the answer to that , right ?
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
The primary meaning of the word is "to believe."
But you think you know more than all the Greek experts.
Nice try Jerry , if that's all you got , were done .
From here on out , I'd just be heaping hot coals on your head .
Reading some of your other posts , I got a sense that you demonstrated some intelligence . Then you challenge my understandings , find your experiencing something you never thought of , and play dumb . Just not buying it Jerry .
Cross Reference
New member
What "Jon the faither" can't explain is the difference between being simply saved and being born again; getting a free ticket out of Hell and being made a disciple of Jesus Christ. His way to salvation is generalized and received by a method reserved for only those who want to know God by relationship and reducing the whole thing to bring glory to himself without a familial relationship with God which, if he had one, would cause him to see his error. He doesn't understand what being born again carries with it.. So insidious carnalities way of deception.
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Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
So I should just ignore what the Greek experts say about the meaning of the word translated " believe"?
And what is it the Greek experts say about the word translated "believe " ?
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
Do you deny that one of the meanings which they give for pisteuō is "to believe"?
" Believe " is ( a part ) of pisteuo or they wouldn't have used the word . The problem is, taken on its own " it's not pisteuo or NT Faith and faithing . That is why they also state , " pisteuo means not just to believe ."
Pisteuo is a verb , an act , BASED UPON A BELIEF , sustained by confidence . So the believing part is about one third of the entire act of pisteuo .
What is the entire act of pisteuo , that according to the Greek dictionary writers should produce a ful acknowledgement of God ?
It's a continual personal surrender to Him , and a life inspired by such surrender . More specifically , a specific act of a genuine surrendered life , with a specific belief that God will accept the surrendered life , and sustained by a specific kind of confidence that we make our daily decisions as if our life is not our own anymore but His .
Any lights going on ?
Also , when " believe " the mistranslated word is taken as the whole truth , it turns everything backwards . Instead of God accepting us or our surrendered life ( pisteuo ) , we think that we accept Him by believing in His Word . I think this is so popular because then , by just believing , one mistakenly thinks they can be in Christ , and still retain their unsurrendered life and continue to serve themselves . Have their cake and eat it to so to speak .
Cross Reference
New member
What they say is why the English translaters have it as "believing". Perhaps you should study what "believing" means.
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Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
Do you deny that one of the meanings is "to believe"?
life
I thought that was quite clear .
Again , Strongs Greek dictionary : " pisteuo means not just to believe ."
It doesn't mean believe sometimes and not believe other times . It never means believe !
glorydaz
Well-known member
The Light came on when Jesus came. Are you thinking we don't know that the word "believe" also means "trust"?
You call it "surrender", but TRUST includes more than just surrender. It includes something that surrender doesn't. I can surrender, and just give up because I have no hope. Or I can believe/trust in God which includes hope.
Believing/Trust isn't something new to most of us here. Yet you seem to think it's a new kind of special. :think:
Why are you stamping the Greek definitions back onto me as if I'm pushing my opinion . The Strongs Greek dictionary states ," pisteuo means not just to believe ! The Vines states " a personal surrender to Him and a life inspired by such surrender. "
It's a specific act , based upon a specific belief , sustained by a specific kind of confidence .
What is the specific act that just starts the Salvation process after the Father has called us ? A personal surrender to Him and a life inspired by such surrender . The specific belief , that the genuine surrendered life will be acceptable . The specific sustained confidence , making all of our daily decisions like our life is not our own anymore , but His .
This is just the start glorydaz. . until you can at least accept the true meaning and definition of pisteuo , the word the Greek authors used to communicate how Faith in Christ is applied , we are stuck at that point . This is about 2% of the complete message I have to potentially share with you.
Believing in God's word alone is not pisteuo , believing and trusting in Gods word alone is not pisteuo .
Cross Reference
New member
Yes? And? Acting upon the written word of God for salvation is enough according to scriptures, wouldn't you agree?
Surrendering one's life unto discipleship requires the new birth from above as it is the gateway to the beginning of the journey home.
.. Get it now?
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
You are right. When a person believes the gospel at the same time he trusts that it is true.
Rosenritter
New member
The devils believe the account of the cross also, don't they?
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
Here is the primary meaning for the word given by a recognized Greek expert:
"to believe i.e. 1. intrans. to think to be true; to be persuaded of; to place confidence in" (Joseph Henry Thayer, A Greek English Lexicon of the New Testament [Grand Rapids: Baker Book House, 1977], 511).
Rosenritter
New member
Luk 8:13 KJV
(13) They on the rock are they, which, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, which for a while believe, and in time of temptation fall away.