God's Truth
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We have to admit we are sinners and repent of those sins to be saved.
What does God's Holy Law Demand?
- Thread starter Robert Pate
- Start date
We have to admit we are sinners and repent of those sins to be saved.
Nang
TOL Subscriber
No, we WILL admit we are sinners and repent, after we are resurrected (regenerated) to new life by the Holy Spirit.
A horse cannot run free until after the barn door is opened . . .
Regeneration precedes faith.
Ben Masada
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In that case, Jesus was under the Law because he did try to produce "Christ likeness" in the life of his listeners, when he said to listen to "Moses" aka the Law." (Luke 16:29-31) As you can see, not so bad to be under the Law. If you are not as you pride yourself not to be, too bad because you surely don't have "Christ likeness" in your life.
Yes, the sons of God are complete in Christ and are expected to become complete in themselves with Christ.
Ben Masada
New member
Thanks Jacob for identifying the text about the avenger of the blood, I always carry the Tanach with me when I am discussing the matter in forums. This time though, I was out.
The Book of the Law was placed beside the ark, but not in the ark.
What was in the ark of the covenant? Might it have been the covenant? (Deuteronomy 9:11)
Oxymoron. Does not compute.
Christ in us saves us from sin, not so we can keep on sinning. (Galatians 2:17)
Spoken like a great Jew.
Do you want to answer my question or speak in riddles?
I asked you a really simple question, might the covenant have been placed in the ark of the covenant?
Here's the answer to the question:
So I made an ark of acacia wood, hewed two tablets of stone like the first, and went up the mountain having the two tablets in my hand. And He wrote on the tablets according to the first writing, the Ten Commandments, which the Lord had spoken to you in the mountain from the midst of the fire in the day of the assembly and the Lord gave them to me. Then I turned and came down from the mountain and put the tablets in the ark which I had made and there they are, just as the Lord commanded me. (Deuteronomy 10:3-5)
On the two stone tablets God wrote his everlasting covenant and the tablets were placed in the ark, which was called the ark of the covenant.
The Book of the Law was temporarily added to the covenant because of transgressions. (Galatians 3:19)
The everlasting covenant was carried into the NT as the Law of Liberty.
That's exactly what the Catholics believe. Maybe your a Catholic and you don't know it.
They believe that the Holy Spirit makes them holy.
Justification by faith allows the Christian to remain a sinner and still be saved, Romans 4:5.
I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God that you present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable to God, which is your reasonable service. (Romans 12:1)
If anyone defiles the temple of God, God will destroy him. For the temple of God is holy, which temple you are. (1 Corinthians 3:17)
that He might present her to Himself a glorious church, not having spot or wrinkle or any such thing, but that she should be holy and without blemish.
(Ephesians 5:27)
If anyone defiles the temple of God, God will destroy him. For the temple of God is holy, which temple you are. (1 Corinthians 3:17)
that He might present her to Himself a glorious church, not having spot or wrinkle or any such thing, but that she should be holy and without blemish.
(Ephesians 5:27)
There are many more scriptures.
God's Truth
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Jesus is the Word of God.
God's Truth
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Epoisses
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The everlasting covenant is not the ministry of death written in stone that has been done away. Every aspect of the old covenant was a shadow of the new covenant. The law written in stone prefigured the law of the Spirit written in the heart. God doesn't crack open our rib cage and implant two tablets of stone at conversion.
God's Truth
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Don't you know how God's commands are written on our hearts?
Neither is true. I don't know if this is intentional or not, but you are asking about what if God would do something He would never do.
I believe these verses about the avenger of blood talk about someone having been killed unintentionally. There was no premeditation. Is this different from murder? I also don't know what a manslayer is.
Here are some other verses that speak of the avenger of blood, but as the blood avenger.
Numbers 35:19 NASB - 'The blood avenger himself shall put the murderer to death; he shall put him to death when he meets him.
Numbers 35:21 NASB - or if he struck him down with his hand in enmity, and as a result he died, the one who struck him shall surely be put to death, he is a murderer; the blood avenger shall put the murderer to death when he meets him.
Numbers 35:24 NASB - then the congregation shall judge between the slayer and the blood avenger according to these ordinances.
Numbers 35:25 NASB - 'The congregation shall deliver the manslayer from the hand of the blood avenger, and the congregation shall restore him to his city of refuge to which he fled; and he shall live in it until the death of the high priest who was anointed with the holy oil.
Numbers 35:27 NASB - and the blood avenger finds him outside the border of his city of refuge, and the blood avenger kills the manslayer, he will not be guilty of blood
I can see that the definition of homicide is the deliberate and unlawful killing of one person by another; murder. The synonyms are: murder, killing, slaughter, butchery, massacre.
I can see that the definition of manslayer is one who was guilty of accidental homicide, and was entitled to flee to a city of refuge (Num. 35:6, 12, 22, 23), his compulsory residence in which terminated with the death of the high priest.
Here are the verses in the Bible that have the word manslayer in them.
Numbers 35:6 NASB - "The cities which you shall give to the Levites shall be the six cities of refuge, which you shall give for the manslayer to flee to; and in addition to them you shall give forty-two cities.
Numbers 35:11 NASB - then you shall select for yourselves cities to be your cities of refuge, that the manslayer who has killed any person unintentionally may flee there.
Numbers 35:12 NASB - 'The cities shall be to you as a refuge from the avenger, so that the manslayer will not die until he stands before the congregation for trial.
Numbers 35:25 NASB - 'The congregation shall deliver the manslayer from the hand of the blood avenger, and the congregation shall restore him to his city of refuge to which he fled; and he shall live in it until the death of the high priest who was anointed with the holy oil.
Numbers 35:26 NASB - 'But if the manslayer at any time goes beyond the border of his city of refuge to which he may flee,
Numbers 35:27 NASB - and the blood avenger finds him outside the border of his city of refuge, and the blood avenger kills the manslayer, he will not be guilty of blood
Numbers 35:28 NASB - because he should have remained in his city of refuge until the death of the high priest. But after the death of the high priest the manslayer shall return to the land of his possession.
Deuteronomy 4:42 NASB - that a manslayer might flee there, who unintentionally slew his neighbor without having enmity toward him in time past; and by fleeing to one of these cities he might live:
Deuteronomy 19:3 NASB - "You shall prepare the roads for yourself, and divide into three parts the territory of your land which the LORD your God will give you as a possession, so that any manslayer may flee there.
Deuteronomy 19:4 NASB - "Now this is the case of the manslayer who may flee there and live: when he kills his friend unintentionally, not hating him previously--
Deuteronomy 19:6 NASB - otherwise the avenger of blood might pursue the manslayer in the heat of his anger, and overtake him, because the way is long, and take his life, though he was not deserving of death, since he had not hated him previously.
Joshua 20:3 NASB - that the manslayer who kills any person unintentionally, without premeditation, may flee there, and they shall become your refuge from the avenger of blood.
Joshua 20:5 NASB - 'Now if the avenger of blood pursues him, then they shall not deliver the manslayer into his hand, because he struck his neighbor without premeditation and did not hate him beforehand.
Joshua 20:6 NASB - 'He shall dwell in that city until he stands before the congregation for judgment, until the death of the one who is high priest in those days. Then the manslayer shall return to his own city and to his own house, to the city from which he fled.'"
Joshua 21:13 NASB - So to the sons of Aaron the priest they gave Hebron, the city of refuge for the manslayer, with its pasture lands, and Libnah with its pasture lands,
Joshua 21:21 NASB - They gave them Shechem, the city of refuge for the manslayer, with its pasture lands, in the hill country of Ephraim, and Gezer with its pasture lands,
Joshua 21:27 NASB - To the sons of Gershon, one of the families of the Levites, from the half-tribe of Manasseh, they gave Golan in Bashan, the city of refuge for the manslayer, with its pasture lands, and Be-eshterah with its pasture lands; two cities.
Joshua 21:32 NASB - From the tribe of Naphtali, they gave Kedesh in Galilee, the city of refuge for the manslayer, with its pasture lands and Hammoth-dor with its pasture lands and Kartan with its pasture lands; three cities.
Joshua 21:38 NASB - From the tribe of Gad, they gave Ramoth in Gilead, the city of refuge for the manslayer, with its pasture lands and Mahanaim with its pasture lands,
Of course He would never actually say it! It's called a hypothetical question! Such questions are not asked to impugn God's character but to test your own! How can you possibly know whether what you believe is the actual truth if you're afraid to answer even the simplest of questions that are designed to it's veracity? You should understand that you fear of asking such simple questions is evidence (not proof) that there are serious flaws in your doctrine. You would be wise to sit yourself down and do some real thinking and praying about why, if your doctrine is true, does it not give you the courage of conviction and why are you are not convinced in your own mind that what you've been taught is the truth.
If God were to say that its just fine to murder your neighbor so long and he has made you really, really mad then that would not make murder right, it would mean that God is evil, Jacob.
That's because right and wrong are not determined by fiat. God is NOT arbitrary. God is not good because He says so but because He does rightly. Right and wrong are not so because God said it, God said it because it is so.
Now, I've given you the right answer, (which I could have done days ago but answering one's own questions in what aught to be a two way conversation is really rather boring). Will you go as far as stating plainly that you agree with it (or not) or is that too much to ask?
Resting in Him,
Clete
Thank you, Captain Obvious!