ECT Water or No Water?

[turbosixx]

Turbosixx,

I am going to post again what I already told you, because it is worth repeating, for you are teaching that baptism of the Holy Spirit is not the same thing as receiving the Holy Spirit.

Please study these scriptures harder.

Baptism of the Holy Spirit happens at the time Jesus saves a person and gives them the Holy Spirit that is when they receive the Holy Spirit.

We can see this in the scriptures about Cornelius and his household. Jesus saved them when they heard the message that saves, see Acts 11:14. That is when the Holy Spirit “came on them”, see Acts 10:44. This is when they “received” the Holy Spirit, see Acts 10:47. This is “baptism of the Holy Spirit” see Acts 11:16.

Acts 11:16 Then I remembered what the Lord had said: 'John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.'

Yes, they received the Holy Spirit, but notice what Peter says about it. Peter does not see it as the same as all the thousands of people he has seen converted up to this point.

11:15 And as I began to speak, the Holy Spirit fell upon them just as He did upon us at the beginning. 16 And I remembered the word of the Lord, how He used to say, 'John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.'

If people have been "baptized with the Holy Spirit all along, why would he say "upon us at the beginning"? At the beginning and here are the only two times the bible says "baptism of the Holy Spirit"

This is a special situation just as Pentecost. There is a complete (long) chapter devoted to this conversion and it is mentioned in two other chapters.

 

[God's Truth]

Yes, they received the Holy Spirit, but notice what Peter says about it. Peter does not see it as the same as all the thousands of people he has seen converted up to this point.

11:15 And as I began to speak, the Holy Spirit fell upon them just as He did upon us at the beginning. 16 And I remembered the word of the Lord, how He used to say, 'John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.'

If people have been "baptized with the Holy Spirit all along, why would he say "upon us at the beginning"? At the beginning and here are the only two times the bible says "baptism of the Holy Spirit"

This is a special situation just as Pentecost. There is a complete (long) chapter devoted to this conversion and it is mentioned in two other chapters.

What are you talking about, for the Holy Spirit had not yet been given to all believers until that time.

You seem very confused. I hope you give it much more consideration than you have been. Jesus says with the measure you use it will be measured to you. See Mark 4:24.

 

[God's Truth]

You are going against what the scriptures plainly say. You do not want to give up your false teachings, most closely resembling that of the teachings of the Church of Christ.

Baptism of the Holy Spirit happens at the time Jesus saves a person and gives them the Holy Spirit that is when they receive the Holy Spirit.

We can see this in the scriptures about Cornelius and his household. Jesus saved them when they heard the message that saves, see Acts 11:14. That is when the Holy Spirit “came on them”, see Acts 10:44. This is when they “received” the Holy Spirit, see Acts 10:47. This is “baptism of the Holy Spirit” see Acts 11:16.

Acts 11:16 Then I remembered what the Lord had said: 'John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.'

 

[turbosixx]

You are going against what the scriptures plainly say. You do not want to give up your false teachings, most closely resembling that of the teachings of the Church of Christ.

Baptism of the Holy Spirit happens at the time Jesus saves a person and gives them the Holy Spirit that is when they receive the Holy Spirit.

We can see this in the scriptures about Cornelius and his household. Jesus saved them when they heard the message that saves, see Acts 11:14. That is when the Holy Spirit “came on them”, see Acts 10:44. This is when they “received” the Holy Spirit, see Acts 10:47. This is “baptism of the Holy Spirit” see Acts 11:16.

Acts 11:16 Then I remembered what the Lord had said: 'John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.'

I don't care what any group says, all I care about is what does the bible tell us.

Do you disagree that Cornelius is a special conversion?

A complete chapter 48 verses in Ch. 10, 18 in Ch. 11 and 5 in Ch. 15.

 

[turbosixx]

There are other scriptures that tell us that people were baptized with the Holy Spirit

Show me

God does not testify to His gospel anymore as He did during the laying of the foundation, the testimony has already been given and the foundation has already been laid; not only that, not everyone who was baptized with the Holy Spirit SPOKE IN TONGUES.

1 Corinthians 14:51 I would like every one of you to speak in tongues, but I would rather have you prophesy. The one who prophesies is greater than the one who speaks in tongues, unless someone interprets, so that the church may be edified.

That's the way I see it.

 

[turbosixx]

What are you talking about, for the Holy Spirit had not yet been given to all believers until that time.

You seem very confused. I hope you give it much more consideration than you have been. Jesus says with the measure you use it will be measured to you. See Mark 4:24.

From Pentecost to Cornelius there were thousands added to Christ, yet Peter did not see it as Holy Spirit baptism as he did the apostles and Cornelius. The only two places the bible says people were baptized with the Holy Spirit.

 

[DAN P]

From Pentecost to Cornelius there were thousands added to Christ, yet Peter did not see it as Holy Spirit baptism as he did the apostles and Cornelius. The only two places the bible says people were baptized with the Holy Spirit.

Hi , and what many and all Acts 2 escapes them is that The BAPTISM of the Holy Spirit was a PROMISE from the Father in Luke 24:49 and in Acts 1:4 and was only given to Israel !!

Anyone that reads Acts 10 and the Cornelius we see that The Promise to Cornelius is coupled with WATER BAPTISM , in Acts 10:47 !!

Is this how we are saved ??

Is this the Body of Christ , most CERTAINLY NO !!:hammer::hammer:

DAN P

 

[God's Truth]

I don't care what any group says, all I care about is what does the bible tell us.

Do you disagree that Cornelius is a special conversion?

A complete chapter 48 verses in Ch. 10, 18 in Ch. 11 and 5 in Ch. 15.

If you care about what the Bible says then you would believe what the Bible says.

Cornelius is not a special conversion.

Do you really think you can nullify God's truth by saying something was special or out of the ordinary?

 

[God's Truth]

Show me

I gave you scriptures that say Jesus will baptize with the Holy Spirit and that when we are saved, we are baptized with the Holy Spirit and that is receiving the Holy Spirit.

It is a sad position that you are in, like so many, when they read for themselves what God clearly says, but you still do not believe.

 

[God's Truth]

From Pentecost to Cornelius there were thousands added to Christ, yet Peter did not see it as Holy Spirit baptism as he did the apostles and Cornelius. The only two places the bible says people were baptized with the Holy Spirit.

What does that have to do with anything? Peter is explaining his actions. Peter is explaining why he went into the house of Cornelius the Gentile.

Peter explains that Cornelius and his household received the Holy Spirit just like they did.

Everyone who received the Holy Spirit are baptized with the Holy Spirit. I have already explained that to you with scripture. It is what the scriptures say.

 

[turbosixx]

I gave you scriptures that say Jesus will baptize with the Holy Spirit

This is where you are wrong. Those scriptures do not say "baptized with the Holy Spirit"

 

[turbosixx]

It is a sad position that you are in, like so many, when they read for themselves what God clearly says, but you still do not believe.

I'm fighting for water baptism that the bible clearly says:
"and this water symbolizes baptism that now saves you".

Satan is using confusion of "Holy Spirit baptism" to do away with water baptism. That is what's sad.

You are calling things Holy Spirit baptism that the bible is not because that is what the world is saying.

If there is one baptism, what is it? Water or Holy Spirit?

 

[HisServant]

I'm fighting for water baptism that the bible clearly says:
"and this water symbolizes baptism that now saves you".

Satan is using confusion of "Holy Spirit baptism" to do away with water baptism. That is what's sad.

You are calling things Holy Spirit baptism that the bible is not because that is what the world is saying.

If there is one baptism, what is it? Water or Holy Spirit?

Read what it says here very carefully.

"and this water symbolizes baptism that now saves you".

the water symbolizes another baptism... and that baptism saves you.. not water baptism because it is only symbolic.

 

[turbosixx]

Read what it says here very carefully.

"and this water symbolizes baptism that now saves you".

the water symbolizes another baptism... and that baptism saves you.. not water baptism because it is only symbolic.

The water that symbolizes baptism he is referring to is the flood waters.

3:20to those who were disobedient long ago when God waited patiently in the days of Noah while the ark was being built. In it only a few people, eight in all, were saved through water, 21and this water symbolizes baptism that now saves you also—not the removal of dirt from the body but the pledge of a clear conscience toward God. It saves you by the resurrection of Jesus Christ,

 

[God's Truth]

This is where you are wrong. Those scriptures do not say "baptized with the Holy Spirit"

I said I gave you scripture that says Jesus will baptize with the Holy Spirit.

You are wrong and are trying to twist the scriptures, and not only that, you are denying scripture.

Mark 1:8 I baptize you with water, but he will baptize you with the Holy Spirit."

Matthew 3:11
"I baptize you with water for repentance. But after me comes one who is more powerful than I, whose sandals I am not worthy to carry. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.

John 1:33
And I myself did not know him, but the one who sent me to baptize with water told me, 'The man on whom you see the Spirit come down and remain is the one who will baptize with the Holy Spirit.'

Acts 1:5
For John baptized with water, but in a few days you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit."

 

[God's Truth]

Jesus still baptizes people today.

Being baptized with the Holy Spirit happens when you are saved, and that is when a person receives the Holy Spirit.

 

[God's Truth]

I'm fighting for water baptism that the bible clearly says:
"and this water symbolizes baptism that now saves you".

No, you are fighting against the Truth. What saves you is promising God that you will die to your sins and live for Jesus. Read the rest of the scripture you are quoting. Jesus saves those he chooses, and he chooses those who obey by repenting and proving their repentance.

Satan is using confusion of "Holy Spirit baptism" to do away with water baptism. That is what's sad.

...and you going against the powerful Truth is not going to help God's Truth. That is what you are doing. These people who are against water baptism MISUNDERSTAND OTHER SCRIPTURES TOO---just like Peter says! ..."as they do the other scriptures." See 2 Peter 3:16, and 17.

You are calling things Holy Spirit baptism that the bible is not because that is what the world is saying.

Water baptism does not give the Holy Spirit. Jesus Christ gives the Holy Spirit, and he gives it to those who have an obeying heart. We are supposed to get water baptized, but that does not mean Jesus gives us the Holy Spirit only at that time. I have shown you that from the scriptures that people were baptized and at that same time RECEIVED the Holy Spirit before water baptism, AND AFTER water baptism.

If there is one baptism, what is it? Water or Holy Spirit?

That scripture is about the baptism of the Holy Spirit. Water baptism is a promise to God.

 

[God's Truth]

Read what it says here very carefully.

"and this water symbolizes baptism that now saves you".

the water symbolizes another baptism... and that baptism saves you.. not water baptism because it is only symbolic.

What saves us is Jesus Christ, and he saves us after he who knows our hearts knows that we promise to stop living in sin and instead live to please him. Part of pleasing Jesus is getting water baptized,

See Acts 15:8, and Acts 5:32.

 

[HisServant]

What saves us is Jesus Christ, and he saves us after he who knows our hearts knows that we promise to stop living in sin and instead live to please him. Part of pleasing Jesus is getting water baptized,

See Acts 15:8, and Acts 5:32.

Gods UnTruth --

Nothing you said actually has to do with salvation as shown in scripture.

It seems you have invented your own god out of your preferred scriptures.

Does belief and repentance have any place in your religion?

 

[turbosixx]

I said I gave you scripture that says Jesus will baptize with the Holy Spirit.

You are wrong and are trying to twist the scriptures, and not only that, you are denying scripture.

Mark 1:8 I baptize you with water, but he will baptize you with the Holy Spirit."

Matthew 3:11
"I baptize you with water for repentance. But after me comes one who is more powerful than I, whose sandals I am not worthy to carry. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.

John 1:33
And I myself did not know him, but the one who sent me to baptize with water told me, 'The man on whom you see the Spirit come down and remain is the one who will baptize with the Holy Spirit.'

Acts 1:5
For John baptized with water, but in a few days you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit."

John is looking forward to God pouring out the Holy Spirit and using what he does as an illustration.

So looking at it's arrival, what does the bible say?