Trump: The Good, The Bad and The Ugly

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exminister

exminister

Well-known member
Some defenders, including himself, are saying since DJT JR didn't get any dirt on Hillary so it wasn't collusion. That would be like a guy who gets a call from his ex-girlfriend asking to meet for some romance and then gets caught and tells his wife "Look she didn't sleep with me, so I didn't cheat".

There was lust in Junior's heart for sure - "I love it". Remember what Jesus said when you have lust in your heart - it is just the same as doing the deed.

I really don't believe Trump was unaware but a Don is always careful not to be soiled. It was only days after this meeting Trump was calling for Russia to hack Hillary's emails. I am not so sure they didn't exchange details on Hillary.

There are those who discount collusion as a not a crime. I work in the business world and it is unethical to obtain proprietary knowledge of even a fellow competitor. The Trumps are in big business. Their legal teams know this as well as their HR department. Everything you needed to know you learned in kindergarten. Fairness in competition is moral. And two wrongs don't make a right.

And why did Junior hire yet another lawyer who has represented 4 prior cases for the Mafia?

It ain't going be nothing but ugly. Sad state of affairs.
 
ok doser

ok doser

lifeguard at the cement pond
rexlunae said:
2 USC § 441e:

§ 441e. Contributions and donations by foreign
nationals
(a) Prohibition
It shall be unlawful for—
(1) a foreign national, directly or indirectly,
to make—
(A) a contribution or donation of money or
other thing of value, or to make an express
or implied promise to make a contribution
or donation, in connection with a Federal,
State, or local election;
(B) a contribution or donation to a committee
of a political party; or
(C) an expenditure, independent expenditure,
or disbursement for an electioneering
communication (within the meaning of section
434(f)(3) of this title); or
§ 441f TITLE 2—THE CONGRESS Page 318
(2) a person to solicit, accept, or receive a
contribution or donation described in subparagraph
(A) or (B) of paragraph (1) from a foreign
national.
(b) ‘‘Foreign national’’ defined
As used in this section, the term ‘‘foreign national’’
means—
(1) a foreign principal, as such term is defined
by section 611(b) of title 22, except that
the term ‘‘foreign national’’ shall not include
any individual who is a citizen of the United
States; or
(2) an individual who is not a citizen of the
United States or a national of the United
States (as defined in section 1101(a)(22) of title
8) and who is not lawfully admitted for permanent
residence, as defined by section 1101(a)(20)
of title 8.
(Pub. L. 92–225, title III, §319, formerly §324, as
added Pub. L. 94–283, title I, §112(2), May 11, 1976,
90 Stat. 493; renumbered §319, Pub. L. 96–187,
title I, §105(5), Jan. 8, 1980, 93 Stat. 1354; amended
Pub. L. 107–155, title III, §§303, 317, Mar. 27,
2002, 116 Stat. 96, 109.)


https://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/USCODE-2011-title2/pdf/USCODE-2011-title2-chap14-subchapI-sec441e.pdf

There's also the potential for conspiracy law to apply.

Apparently this is now indexed as TITLE 52 / Subtitle III / CHAPTER 301:
http://uscode.house.gov/view.xhtml?path=/prelim@title52/subtitle3/chapter301&edition=prelim

And, by the way, "foreign nationals", in this context, includes foreign governments and organizations.
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What "thing of value" did donald trump jr get from the foreign nationals?


And why didn't anybody kick up a fuss about this? http://www.cbc.ca/radio/asithappens...-campaigning-for-clinton-in-florida-1.3831197
 
R

rexlunae

New member
exminister said:
Some defenders, including himself, are saying since DJT JR didn't get any dirt on Hillary so it wasn't collusion. That would be like a guy who gets a call from his ex-girlfriend asking to meet for some romance and then gets caught and tells his wife "Look she didn't sleep with me, so I didn't cheat".
Click to expand...

If he didn't actually get anything, it's still solicitation. Same statute, just as illegal. And the attempt to receive such information is conspiracy. He's screwed and glued three ways.

exminister said:
I really don't believe Trump was unaware but a Don is always careful not to be soiled. It was only days after this meeting Trump was calling for Russia to hack Hillary's emails. I am not so sure they didn't exchange details on Hillary.
Click to expand...

It was just after this meeting that he started talking about how he was going to release a bunch of information about Clinton, which never materialized. It could implicate him.

exminister said:
There are those who discount collusion as a not a crime.
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It's not a great word, as it isn't very specific, but it describes an important distinction. The Russians are entitled to release information, and even if they commit crimes, it's unlikely that we'll be able to do much to punish them. Even if those crimes benefited Trump, he wouldn't be guilty. Unless he participated. That's why people have been talking about collusion. It's really shorthand for the idea that the Trump campaign participated in the efforts by the Russians to subvert our election.

What we have here is really a criminal conspiracy and election fraud.
 
R

rexlunae

New member
ok doser said:
What "thing of value" did donald trump jr get from the foreign nationals?
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Opposition research. That thing about which DJTJ said "I love it."

ok doser said:
And why didn't anybody kick up a fuss about this? http://www.cbc.ca/radio/asithappens...-campaigning-for-clinton-in-florida-1.3831197
Click to expand...

Volunteering for a campaign is legal, even as a foreign national:

Does volunteering my personal services to a campaign count as a contribution to the campaign?

An individual may volunteer his or her personal services to a campaign without making a contribution as long as the individual is not compensated by anyone else. 11 CFR 100.74. For example, if an individual helps organize a voter drive or offers his or her particular skills to a campaign, neither of those activities will result in a contribution, as long as the individual is not compensated. If the individual is compensated for his or her services, the activity is no longer considered volunteer activity and the payments, if made by someone other than the campaign itself, result in an in-kind contribution from that person, which must be reported by the campaign. 11 CFR 100.54.


https://transition.fec.gov/pages/brochures/volact.shtml#services
 
ok doser

ok doser

lifeguard at the cement pond
rexlunae said:
Opposition research. That thing about which DJTJ said "I love it."



Volunteering for a campaign is legal, even as a foreign national:

Does volunteering my personal services to a campaign count as a contribution to the campaign?

An individual may volunteer his or her personal services to a campaign without making a contribution as long as the individual is not compensated by anyone else. 11 CFR 100.74. For example, if an individual helps organize a voter drive or offers his or her particular skills to a campaign, neither of those activities will result in a contribution, as long as the individual is not compensated. If the individual is compensated for his or her services, the activity is no longer considered volunteer activity and the payments, if made by someone other than the campaign itself, result in an in-kind contribution from that person, which must be reported by the campaign. 11 CFR 100.54.


https://transition.fec.gov/pages/brochures/volact.shtml#services
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Your cite seems to indicate that the use of "contribution" refers to monetary compensation


Has there been any indication that the exchange between trump jr and the rooskie involved monetary compensation?


Or were the rooskies merely volunteering their personal services??
 
Angel4Truth

Angel4Truth

New member
Hall of Fame
rexlunae said:
I think the biggest thing this thread has revealed so far is the depth of the conviction of certain members, such as Pat, and Angel, and their disinterest in the truth.
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You know i didn't vote for Trump right? Dont let that little fact stop you though - the Russia thing is a joke.

Putin said it best to megyn kelly, she spend the day with him, so she should be in jail the way you guys tell it :)
 
R

rexlunae

New member
Angel4Truth said:
I have no idea. Theres a whole lot of lying and conspiracy and mess happening all over the map, on all sides.
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That's how I know you're not paying attention. You look at the situation overall, it looks messy, and you conclude both sides are to blame. But you're wrong. There's one side making a mess, and one side uncovering it, and the mess is the row between these two inherently conflicted processes.

False balance is the last refuge of the lazy and disengaged. You can't be bothered to find the truth or to care about it, or maybe it feels too much like betraying your political polarity.
 
Angel4Truth

Angel4Truth

New member
Hall of Fame
rexlunae said:
That's how I know you're not paying attention. You look at the situation overall, it looks messy, and you conclude both sides are to blame. But you're wrong. There's one side making a mess, and one side uncovering it, and the mess is the row between these two inherently conflicted processes.

False balance is the last refuge of the lazy and disengaged. You can't be bothered to find the truth or to care about it, or maybe it feels too much like betraying your political polarity.
Click to expand...


Yeah im totally lazy by waiting for facts. :)
 
glorydaz

glorydaz

Well-known member
rexlunae said:
That's how I know you're not paying attention. You look at the situation overall, it looks messy, and you conclude both sides are to blame. But you're wrong. There's one side making a mess, and one side uncovering it, and the mess is the row between these two inherently conflicted processes.

False balance is the last refuge of the lazy and disengaged. You can't be bothered to find the truth or to care about it, or maybe it feels too much like betraying your political polarity.
Click to expand...

The dims dig up every rock in the desert hoping to find a nugget of gold. That takes a whole lot of energy and they call it being engaged. :chuckle:
 
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