toldailytopic: What are your thoughts on Planned Parenthood?

[Rusha]

Hi Rusha. I'm not sure where the disconnect is.

Because PP kills children, I want to see them go out of business.

If they stopped killing children, no need for them to go out of business.

Hopefully this solves whatever confusion you have.

There is no confusion. I stated quite clearly that I was opposed to the part of their operation that provides abortion.

I don't know what part of "We need women to have the kind of women's services that PP and other clinics supply MINUS the abortion" that you do not understand.

I have always stated that I wanted all clinics such as PP and others revamped and not providing abortion.

Most hospitals ALSO provide abortion. My wish is that they also no longer offer abortion but continue to take care of other medical needs.

 

[ideogenous_mover]

I tend to have a slightly more complicated view of this, rarely do I seem to have a very broad view once I start thinking about it.

First of all, my central concern with all this is the overpopulation of the earth. The more people there are, the more resources get stretched. Now, that is the broad end of it.

As for abortion, I do frown on late term abortions. I think the parents or parent should hopefully know a lot earlier whether or not they want a child. Abortion overall I think is a tragedy, and I view it more as something where a lesson ought to be learned by the participants in it.

As for PP then, well I don't exactly agree with it's portrayal in Knight's video if that is the truth. I ultimately think that sex is just for having kids. What actually needs to be eventually taught somehow or another, is just that. And what also needs to be taught is that the world may suffer overpopulation, people need to be educated more in a strong helping of Philosophy and thought in order to really know this.

Now, regardless of what you think of my thinking, what is the religionists take on all this?

Well, they do certainly believe the world shall end in firey despair, therefore theologically it follows that the human race ought to pump as many people into this world as possible, no matter how this philosophy affects the world situation. Ask yourselves if you do truly believe this? If you do, then you truly have no fear of overpopulation. However, if I believe in a God who advocates common sense, perhaps I could bypass it.

Also it occurs to me that a religionist would not even wish to take embryonic stem cells, why is this? It refers back to the conception of Mary, the thinking is that Jesus did become the very instant he was joined with the egg. Therefore this does illustrate for all of us that an embryonic stem cell has a soul and is then a human. You would not murder Jesus at any stage in the womb, therefore you shall consider it murder to stop anyone at any stage in any womb.

Well, that is a hard argument to refute for you. However, the destiny of Jesus is not fully commensurate to our more lowly human condition. Perhaps Jesus was so holy that he trumps us in forms of existence and development. I see Jesus as preaching common sense, it is not common sense to overpopulate this world. Then again I also see Jesus as preaching the vanity of it all, declaring that this hopeless world shall end.

 

[Bean Counter]

There is no confusion. I stated quite clearly that I was opposed to the part of their operation that provides abortion.

Actually, what you said was "my only issue with them is they perform abortions". To say that they are "great" for other purposes, you just have an issue with them killing babies, makes it seem like child killing is just a consideration.

But at this point I think we're just talking past one another, so for the sake of not wasting time I digress.

 

[Ps82]

Largest murder for cash clinic in the USA working under cover as a women's help center ... have only harsh words - so will sum it up with - Yuk ... Yuk!

For those who use it to get their meds and exams cheaper ... do you ever wonder whether they are able to give you cheaper rates because of all the tax money that our government extorts from unwilling pro-life payers to support it as an abortion service.

Your great deals depend on government subsidies for murdering unborn babies.

 

[ideogenous_mover]

How do you feel about the medical advancements that have been made in part by the horrible experiments that were done on Jews in concentration camps? Do those medical advancements give us just cause to publicly affirm the Nazi concentration camps?

No sir. A world where humans experiment on eachother does not produce a happy world. Therefore any experiments or progress they made is totally invalid.

Why not have slaves because that allows us to sit around more? Again, this is invalid, it does not produce a happier world.

Human progress can never mean cutting down on the welfare of other humans. If say there was a button I could push that would instantly vaporize china in exchange magically for knowledge of how to cure every disease, I would not push that button.

 

[Breathe]

Largest murder for cash clinic in the USA working under cover as a women's help center ... have only harsh words - so will sum it up with - Yuk ... Yuk!

For those who use it to get their meds and exams cheaper ... do you ever wonder whether they are able to give you cheaper rates because of all the tax money that our government extorts from unwilling pro-life payers to support it as an abortion service.

Your great deals depend on government subsidies for murdering unborn babies.

Personally, I have insurance, but PP was where I went in my youth.
But to answer you, I seriously doubt that a woman with a lump in her breast, whose only option for a mammogram was PP, would be overly concerned with their abortion policies.

When you aren't poor enough for the local health department clinic, yet you can't afford insurance, PP may mean the difference between life and death for a woman.

A drowning man doesn't worry about the ethics of the man who jumps in the water to save his life, and refuse to be saved because that man is a murderer, does he? No. He grabs the hand of someone who will help him live another day.

 

[The Horn]

You anti-choicers just don't get it. Abortions don't happen because of Planned Parenthood. They happen because there are so many poor women in America who cannot provide for children.
Anti-choicers could take bulldozers and bombs and destroy every PP facility, but this would do ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to stop abortion in America.
If Planned Parenthood doesn't do it, others will. There will always be some one to perform abortions whether they are legal or not. You claim that fetuses don't "choose" to be aborted.
Well, children who are born into abject poverty,malnutrition and misery don't coose to be born into it either.
You have to realize this basic and simple fact - the more poverty there is in a country, the more abortions. The less poverty there is, the fewer abortions. This is why aboprtion is so rare in the prosperous countries of Europe, Germany, Austria, the Netherlands, Belgium, Switzerland, and Scandinavia. Abortion rates are much higher in the poorer countries of Eastern Europe which were in the Soviet Block.
We will never be able to reduce, let alone eliminate abortion in America until we do more to help the poor ,and poor pregnant women. Those who say there is plenty of help already and bring up the straw man of adoption are deluding themselves.
Anti-choicers are horrified about abortion but don't have enough sense to realize that if you make abortion illegal, you only INCREASE it, and endanger the lives and health of poor women .
If a Republican wins the White House this November, he or she will without a doubt greatly reduce help for the poor in this nation. This will only INCREASE the abortion rate.
Government-ordered compulsory childbearing for pregnant women does not work. It never has and never will. It is disastrously counterproductive and a death sentence for poor women . Every nation where abortion is illegal has more of them every year than those where it is legal. This is a fact.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

If the government would make abortion illegal, all of those places wouldn't be able to perform them. Until then, however, they will be providing a plethora of health services to women.

Here's a question you need to ask yourself....

When abortion was illegal in this country, were there more, less, or roughly the same amount of abortions being performed?

 

[Breathe]

Here's a question you need to ask yourself....

When abortion was illegal in this country, were there more, less, or roughly the same amount of abortions being performed?

Well, there is really no way to calculate that, since the successful ones with no complications were kept secret.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

I seriously doubt that a woman with a lump in her breast, whose only option for a mammogram was PP, would be overly concerned with their abortion policies.

First off, PP is NOT the only options for low income women to get mammograms.

But more importantly....

Planned Parenthood DOES NOT provide mammograms

 

[Nathon Detroit]

Well, there is really no way to calculate that, since the successful ones with no complications were kept secret.

There's no sugar coating it, you are a complete and utter fool.

 

[Breathe]

There's no sugar coating it, you are a complete and utter fool.

In other words, you hadn't thought of that.

 

[Breathe]

First off, PP is NOT the only options for low income women to get mammograms.

But more importantly....

Planned Parenthood DOES NOT provide mammograms

Sure, but not in lots of towns. PP has a lot of branches, in a lot of cities across the country.

What makes you think that your link is more accurate than mine? It's very possible that not all PPs have mammogram facilities, but that doesn't mean that all of them are lacking them:

http://www.plannedparenthood.org/ppwaco/BCCS Komen-28753.htm

And why would the Susan G. Komen foundation donate money for just that reason? They are a pretty above board charity.

 

[Rusha]

You anti-choicers just don't get it. Abortions don't happen because of Planned Parenthood. They happen because there are so many poor women in America who cannot provide for children.

Which is why there is adoption as well as other services offered for those of low income who have children.

Anti-choicers could take bulldozers and bombs and destroy every PP facility, but this would do ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to stop abortion in America.

Actually making abortion illegal would also ban facilities such as PP and others from legally performing abortions.

If Planned Parenthood doesn't do it, others will. There will always be some one to perform abortions whether they are legal or not. You claim that fetuses don't "choose" to be aborted.

By making abortion illegal, it would make it much more difficult for women to kill their unborn babies on the altar of convenience.

Well, children who are born into abject poverty,malnutrition and misery don't coose to be born into it either.
You have to realize this basic and simple fact - the more poverty there is in a country, the more abortions. The less poverty there is, the fewer abortions. This is why aboprtion is so rare in the prosperous countries of Europe, Germany, Austria, the Netherlands, Belgium, Switzerland, and Scandinavia. Abortion rates are much higher in the poorer countries of Eastern Europe which were in the Soviet Block.
We will never be able to reduce, let alone eliminate abortion in America until we do more to help the poor ,and poor pregnant women. Those who say there is plenty of help already and bring up the straw man of adoption are deluding themselves.

Being poor is not an excuse for mothers to kill their unborn babies.

Anti-choicers are horrified about abortion but don't have enough sense to realize that if you make abortion illegal, you only INCREASE it, and endanger the lives and health of poor women .

WRONG. There would be significantly fewer abortions if women realized that by utilizing back alley abortion they would putting THEIR own life in jeopardy as well as that of their unborn child[/QUOTE]

If a Republican wins the WhiteHouse this November, he or she will without a doubt greatly reduce help for the poor in this nation. This will only INCREASE the abortion rate.

Help does not mean providing or allowing abortion.

Government-ordered compulsory childbearing for pregnant women does not work. It never has and never will. It is disastrously counterproductive and a death sentence for poor women . Every nation where abortion is illegal has more of them every year than those where it is legal. This is a fact.

No one, other than the man and woman involved, causes women to become pregnant. The only death sentence involved is that of an innocent unborn baby who though no fault of their own came into existence.

 

[Maximeee]

But to answer you, I seriously doubt that a woman with a lump in her breast, whose only option for a mammogram was PP, would be overly concerned with their abortion policies.

Well, I have no insurance and I'll tell you this: If I found a lump in my breast, I would never EVER go to PP. Why on earth would I trust an organization that kills thousands of babies to save my life?!

Also, I do care about their ethics. I'd rather go into debt than ever set foot in a PP. And again, I am speaking as somebody who doesn't have insurance.

 

[Maximeee]

This is an organization that not only kills children, but hides rape. How on earth does any woman trust them?!?!

 

[aCultureWarrior]

PP helped my wife and I get cheaper birth control (saved nearly $100) and get her regular gynecologist appointment for nearly $300 cheaper than the doctor she'd been seeing before was charging.

I don't really follow the national policies of the organization, but around here their agencies are lauded for helping married couples CHOOSE when to start procreating while still enjoying a healthy sex life, especially in the midst of hard economic times when birth control is becoming more and more expensive, and for helping teens take steps to avoid shattering their lives with ill-thought choices.

And most of the time that doesn't even involve abortion.

Same here ... I utilized PP back in my late teens and mid twenties for less expensive birth control. For that purpose, they are great ... my only issue with them is that they perform abortions.

The video told it all. If you continue to financially support Planned Parenthood, that would put you both in the evil category.

But then, that isn't news to me.

 

[Rusha]

The video told it all. If you continue to financially support Planned Parenthood, that would put you both in the evil category.

Ho hum. I have not utilized a PP since 1986 for the purpose of acquiring birth control pills. Paying $80 rather than meeting my $250 deductible + the price of contraception saved me money.

But then, that isn't news to me.

Good deal! It is comforting to be referred to as *evil* from someone as morally inferior as you ...

 

[Nathon Detroit]

Well, I have no insurance and I'll tell you this: If I found a lump in my breast, I would never EVER go to PP. Why on earth would I trust an organization that kills thousands of babies to save my life?!

Also, I do care about their ethics. I'd rather go into debt than ever set foot in a PP. And again, I am speaking as somebody who doesn't have insurance.

:first: POTD

 

[Nathon Detroit]

Ho hum. I have not utilized a PP since 1986 for the purpose of acquiring birth control pills. Paying $80 rather than meeting my $250 deductible + the price of contraception saved me money.

I'm guessing you would have been happy to buy a bushel of cotton from a slave owning plantation over a non-slave owning plantation as long as you could save a few bucks.