yeah, he wanted that, which is why he wrote a warning, instead of issuing a ticket, which would have made anyone more upset - doubtful.
This Black WAS abused by cops.. Sandra Bland
- Thread starter republicanchick
- Start date
yeah, he wanted that, which is why he wrote a warning, instead of issuing a ticket, which would have made anyone more upset - doubtful.
Well said, if they did something wrong, sue them later.
False, she was arrested for resisting. She refused to get out the car. Its already been shown in the thread that a police officer has the right to ask you to step out of the car at anytime when a law has been broken - upheld by the supreme court.
The law she broke was failure to signal. Which in texas can in itself get you arrested.
I think cops have been given far too much deference for self-defense. I don't buy that this cop had any reason to worry about his safety in this stop, and you're just offering it as a default catch-all defense.
Sure. And if only people were just nice and polite to each other, the world would be a friendlier place. But the fact that she didn't doesn't constitute a crime.
I don't necessarily disagree that requesting her put out the cigarette was reasonable. But it isn't illegal to refuse a request, and it certainly isn't grounds for an arrest. He could have handed over the warning and let her go on her way, but because his ego was bruised, he didn't do that. He escalated the situation, when he was in the position of power, and while her actions were potentially rude, his actions were unprofessional, likely illegal, and irresponsible for someone who is employed to keep the peace, not fight a personal battle.
No, not necessarily. Certainly, that wasn't the conclusion of that case. The court held that the order to get out of the car was reasonable as part of the officer's investigation of a crime and to protect the safety of the officer. It certainly isn't carte blanche for any officer to order a person out of any car. The officer in this case had already completed his investigation, and written a warning. His business with Sandra Bland was done, and all he had to do was hand the warning over. Instead, he allowed his ego to dominate and escalated the situation. This certainly isn't in the interests of good order, it made everyone, including him less safe, not more, and it seems to me likely to have been a violation of her rights.
https://supreme.justia.com/cases/federal/us/434/106/case.html
False. Because she broke the law, he had the right to ask her to step out and she did not have the right to refuse.
She could only refuse, if no law had been violated first.
And again, which you fail to recognize, even a minor traffic offense in the state of texas, can get you arrested.
If he just wanted to bully her, he could have arrested her the moment he pulled her over.
Arthur Brain
Well-known member
Even if the person hasn't committed an offence?
Without grounds for suspicion it shouldn't be, else cops could just cuff and frisk for no reason at all. With me there were grounds as I fit the profile of someone who had stolen. If I'd ignored the cop and ran off/acted aggressively then I could hardly complain if he chased me, arrested me and slapped the cuffs on etc but as I was innocent and was completely co-operative then there was no need which is as it should be frankly.
At 2AM?! Are you insane? We had a coffee thank you so very much...
With reasonable grounds that's fine. I agree that arguing with cops on the street isn't the way to go.
He had that right, as part of his investigation. But he didn't ask for that during the investigation, which is the basis for his authority to give her any sort of order. Once the investigation is over, his authority to order her around also ends.
The authority of a cop to detain a subject after a traffic stop is limited, and requires that there be some valid suspicion of a further crime to investigate. Nothing that appears to be on the video rises to the level of a crime, so I'm not sure what would give him the right.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...-crimes-absent-suspicion-supreme-court-rules/
And, as I already noted, if she had been arrested for the traffic offense, that would probably have been legally valid. But that wasn't why she was arrested. The cop's ego was bruised, and so he escalated the situation.
And ironically, he probably would have been in less trouble if he had. Though, he might have had to explain to someone why he arrested someone for a traffic violation, it likely wouldn't have been a violation of her civil rights.
It would have been over, when she took her warning, it never got to that point.
He never gave it to her. Seems to me like he had the choice to hand over the citation, or to continue pushing. He chose to push, which escalated the confrontation, all the way to him drawing his gun and threatening to "light her up". I think this is constitutionally suspect, but even beyond that, I would hope that the people running around with guns and badges would have cooler heads such that their egos can take a hit without the need to escalate a situation.
Exactly, it wasn't over. It would have been over the moment she received the warning.
You dont have to like what happened, but he had the right to ask her to step out and she didnt have the right to refuse.
annabenedetti
like marbles on glass
Yes, I think he did. Whether it was a warning or a ticket isn't the issue. His escalation of the situation after that point is the issue.
Not in my opinion. This happened in texas, where you can be arrested for a minor traffic violation.
If he just wanted to escalate the whole thing, he could have simply arrested her on the spot the moment she violated the law by failure to signal.
She could have just complied with what he asked and received her warning and been on her way.
annabenedetti
like marbles on glass
In my opinion, he didn't feel the need to escalate until he decided he didn't like her uppity attitude.
That would be after he told her that she seemed upset and after he told her to put out her cigarette.
And thats your opinion, but hopefully you would advise people just to comply, then if they feel there is a problem, to complain to the department afterward and or sue.
These things always seem to stem from non compliance.
GFR7
New member
I think she felt he was abusing his power, and she wanted to show him that she knew her rights. He should have just let the cigarette thing go. How horribly this petty incident turned out.
I think she felt he was abusing his power, and she wanted to show him that she knew her rights. He should have just let the cigarette thing go. How horribly this petty incident turned out.
A little petty in my opinion that she couldnt just put out the cigarette.
annabenedetti
like marbles on glass
More than petty that he told her to put it out. In my opinion, it was calculated.