The Late Great Urantia Revelation

[Puppet]

An Infinate mind doesn't make mistakes like the authors of the Bible books. Neither did an Infinate mind write the Urantia Book.

I have carefully read both books.

You can read it all you want. You denying makes you an nonbeliever that God can write through men. You don't believe He exist at all but that's natural with mankind. Most here put God in Box expecially you. Most wants God to be here and not over there or have God in their hearts and not want God to be in anyones else's heart. Even though each writer writes a totally different style, taste, culture, or whatever personality they have, God wrote through them. Each writer doesn't have to give the same style coming from one source, God. You want each writer to hold responsibility to have the same style of God . That means you do put Him in a box. God works with each writer individually. BUT, the numbers, in every letters, are all the same through all the writers. No possible way all the writers got together and split the total complete sum of the numbers. Imposible! That's the amazing part. While the writers writes differently theres great harmony through all of them as if it was written by one source, God. It's impossible for men to write like that, least not yet or ever. You're like everyone else here, either put God in box or place Him elsewhere. If urantia tells you the 66 book bible is in error then you ought to let it collect dust or sell it to the next dumb sucker for one cent. It would make great fire logs

 

[freelight]

Numbers do not necessarily prove the authenticity of anything,...they are 'relative'

Numbers do not necessarily prove the authenticity of anything,...they are 'relative'

Dr Ivan Panin challenged nine noted rationalists and Bible critics through the medium of the "New York Sun" newspaper to publicly refute or give explanation for a few of his presented facts other than the obvious; that the Word of God was the product of a Divine Mastermind above all possibility of human construction, carrying within itself a self-checking and protecting factor to ensure against additions and subtractions to its text in the original languages. Four made lame excuses; the rest were silent. He issued a challenge throughout leading newspapers of the world to offer a natural explanation or refute the facts; not a single person has ever been able to do so.


The fact remains; only an Infinite mind could have devised this Book of books. Will you carefully consider His personal message to you and be willing to do something about it?

See: A Critique of Bible Numerics :readthis:

Remember,....You cant confine the Infinite to a limited set of books written by men. Some books have more value or truth in them than others, so it remains for the honest truth-seeker to do his own homework



pj

 

[freelight]

freedom from dogma.............

freedom from dogma.............

You can read it all you want. You denying makes you an nonbeliever that God can write through men. You don't believe He exist at all but that's natural with mankind. Most here put God in Box expecially you. Most wants God to be here and not over there or have God in their hearts and not want God to be in anyones else's heart. Even though each writer writes a totally different style, taste, culture, or whatever personality they have, God wrote through them. Each writer doesn't have to give the same style coming from one source, God. You want each writer to hold responsibility to have the same style of God . That means you do put Him in a box. God works with each writer individually. BUT, the numbers, in every letters, are all the same through all the writers. No possible way all the writers got together and split the total complete sum of the numbers. Imposible! That's the amazing part. While the writers writes differently theres great harmony through all of them as if it was written by one source, God. It's impossible for men to write like that, least not yet or ever. You're like everyone else here, either put God in box or place Him elsewhere. If urantia tells you the 66 book bible is in error then you ought to let it collect dust or sell it to the next dumb sucker for one cent. It would make great fire logs

'Numbers' do not necessarily prove a book is divinely 'inspired', since they are relative measures, points, segways of information, which reveal certain patterns, that can be found in any book if you look long enough to gather the probabilities and numerical arrangements. Neither is there anywhere prophesied that only '66' books were to make up a 'sealed' holy book, that are to be a 'final' and 'only' revelation of 'God'. You cant put 'God' in a box.

See: The UB on Science




pj

 

[freelight]

God unboxed.........

God unboxed.........

That means you do put Him in a box.

Prove your claim.

Also prove that the UB teaches your assumption above. It does not,..but does expand one's knowledge, capacity and vision of comprehending the Universe of universes and the unlimited potential and possibilities of the soul, in union with God and his divine plan for his eternal progress and immortality. God and Man are engaged in an eternal adventure, a co-operation, a partnership.

When man is ready for more information, knowledge, revelation...it appears in due time to those ready to receive.



pj

 

[journey]

See the ub for spoiled baloney.

 

[Puppet]

Prove your claim.

Also prove that the UB teaches your assumption above. It does not,..but does expand one's knowledge, capacity and vision of comprehending the Universe of universes and the unlimited potential and possibilities of the soul, in union with God and his divine plan for his eternal progress and immortality. God and Man are engaged in an eternal adventure, a co-operation, a partnership.

When man is ready for more information, knowledge, revelation...it appears in due time to those ready to receive.



pj

I don't care to do all that for the urantians. Internet has all those information. The neat thing about those numbers are the waves, the crests and the dips. To make a wave, you'll need those remainders or left overs: +2, +1, +0, 0, -1, -2 then back up to -1, 0, +1, +2. In other words those numbers creates waves. It goes up and down, over and over. Anyone can google 'debunk theomatics' and find numbers that don't match. Every sum of numbers that don't match or don't sound complete has remainders. In mathematics, the remainder is the amount "left over" after performing some computation. God wrote through the writers with tons of remaiders making you think its debunkable but you forgot another set of patterns, "the waves". Those waves are saved for the future when someone figures it out. Those are perfect waves threaded through the entire 66 book. Imposible for all the writers to get together and work those numbers out at once. Only God can do that. You say God cant do anything. We got our Bible and you got your urantia. We win , you lose. You're getting seasick with all those doctrines going back,forth, up, down and going down a whirlpool in a bad storm. Unratia is that bad storm. 9 truths to tell you one lie and you don't know which one is the lie. Thats why we use the bible to smack the lies. We have knocked you out. You're deepoy sleeping and no where ready for the return. To be ready you'll need to use the Bible to test urantia. You have already failed the tests and blame it on God and His words by saying His Words are full of crap. Shame on you!

 

[Caino]

You can read it all you want. You denying makes you an nonbeliever that God can write through men. You don't believe He exist at all but that's natural with mankind. Most here put God in Box expecially you. Most wants God to be here and not over there or have God in their hearts and not want God to be in anyones else's heart. Even though each writer writes a totally different style, taste, culture, or whatever personality they have, God wrote through them. Each writer doesn't have to give the same style coming from one source, God. You want each writer to hold responsibility to have the same style of God . That means you do put Him in a box. God works with each writer individually. BUT, the numbers, in every letters, are all the same through all the writers. No possible way all the writers got together and split the total complete sum of the numbers. Imposible! That's the amazing part. While the writers writes differently theres great harmony through all of them as if it was written by one source, God. It's impossible for men to write like that, least not yet or ever. You're like everyone else here, either put God in box or place Him elsewhere. If urantia tells you the 66 book bible is in error then you ought to let it collect dust or sell it to the next dumb sucker for one cent. It would make great fire logs

You say untrue things out of ignorance like the enemies of Jesus who also used their scripture to deny him.

88:2.6 "Words eventually became fetishes, more especially those which were regarded as God's words; in this way the sacred books of many religions have become fetishistic prisons incarcerating the spiritual imagination of man. Moses' very effort against fetishes became a supreme fetish; his commandment was later used to stultify art and to retard the enjoyment and adoration of the beautiful.

88:2.7 In olden times the fetish word of authority was a fear-inspiring doctrine, the most terrible of all tyrants which enslave men. A doctrinal fetish will lead mortal man to betray himself into the clutches of bigotry, fanaticism, superstition, intolerance, and the most atrocious of barbarous cruelties. Modern respect for wisdom and truth is but the recent escape from the fetish-making tendency up to the higher levels of thinking and reasoning. Concerning the accumulated fetish writings which various religionists hold as sacred books, it is not only believed that what is in the book is true, but also that every truth is contained in the book. If one of these sacred books happens to speak of the earth as being flat, then, for long generations, otherwise sane men and women will refuse to accept positive evidence that the planet is round."​

 

[Puppet]

You say untrue things out of ignorance like the enemies of Jesus who also used their scripture to deny him.

88:2.6 "Words eventually became fetishes, more especially those which were regarded as God's words; in this way the sacred books of many religions have become fetishistic prisons incarcerating the spiritual imagination of man. Moses' very effort against fetishes became a supreme fetish; his commandment was later used to stultify art and to retard the enjoyment and adoration of the beautiful.

88:2.7 In olden times the fetish word of authority was a fear-inspiring doctrine, the most terrible of all tyrants which enslave men. A doctrinal fetish will lead mortal man to betray himself into the clutches of bigotry, fanaticism, superstition, intolerance, and the most atrocious of barbarous cruelties. Modern respect for wisdom and truth is but the recent escape from the fetish-making tendency up to the higher levels of thinking and reasoning. Concerning the accumulated fetish writings which various religionists hold as sacred books, it is not only believed that what is in the book is true, but also that every truth is contained in the book. If one of these sacred books happens to speak of the earth as being flat, then, for long generations, otherwise sane men and women will refuse to accept positive evidence that the planet is round."​

No I don't!
You say that, "the Bible has 9 truths and 1 lie".
We say that, "the urantia has 9 truths and one lie".

You say, "broad is the way."
We say, "narrow is the way"

The Bible corrects urantia.
You say, "cause we said so"
We say, "cause God said so"

BUT, for heavens sake, this is a Christian forum about the Bible.

We like Gods Words

 

[Caino]

No I don't!
You say that, "the Bible has 9 truths and 1 lie".
We say that, "the urantia has 9 truths and one lie".

You say, "broad is the way."
We say, "narrow is the way"

The Bible corrects urantia.
You say, "cause we said so"
We say, "cause God said so"

BUT, for heavens sake, this is a Christian forum about the Bible.

We like Gods Words

The UB is the basis for my beliefs, this is the "Religion" section of TOL.

As I said, the UB is not for you, it's best for you to stick with the Bible.

 

[Puppet]

The UB is the basis for my beliefs, this is the "Religion" section of TOL.

As I said, the UB is not for you, it's best for you to stick with the Bible.

You don't know whats best for me. Why should I trust you after you insulted our God? I confirm urantia and tons of occult theologies with the Bible. If it fails then I know exaclty where I'm at. Its nice to know where the lies are so I can duck ahead of time. You must be headless horseman of the sleepy hollow. You better wake up and put your head back on !

 

[Caino]

You don't know whats best for me. Why should I trust you after you insulted our God? I confirm urantia and tons of occult theologies with the Bible. If it fails then I know exaclty where I'm at. Its nice to know where the lies are so I can duck ahead of time. You must be headless horseman of the sleepy hollow. You better wake up and put your head back on !

The common excuse given by todays prideful Pharisee's is it's not that the obvious errors are errors in the Bible, there is something wrong with the audience. For the longest time we couldn't question the church lest we be branded heretics, blasphemers, locked up and even killed!

But what really happens in the faith brain that makes Gods Words out of mans words? It is because there is so much truth and wisdom in the heavily edited and redacted books, the faith brain just uncomfortably ignores the obvious while arrogantly chiding those who point it out. The problem with editing is they would leave parts of the original in the text and the original wasn't perfect either.

Saul kills himself:

1 Samuel 31:4King James Version (KJV)

4 Then said Saul unto his armourbearer, Draw thy sword, and thrust me through therewith; lest these uncircumcised come and thrust me through, and abuse me. But his armourbearer would not; for he was sore afraid. Therefore Saul took a sword, and fell upon it.

Saul kills himself:

1 Chronicles 10:4King James Version (KJV)

4 Then said Saul to his armourbearer, Draw thy sword, and thrust me through therewith; lest these uncircumcised come and abuse me. But his armourbearer would not; for he was sore afraid. So Saul took a sword, and fell upon it.

No, it was the Philistines who killed Saul:

2 Samuel 21:12King James Version (KJV)

12 And David went and took the bones of Saul and the bones of Jonathan his son from the men of Jabeshgilead, which had stolen them from the street of Bethshan, where the Philistines had hanged them, when the Philistines had slain Saul in Gilboa...

Or was it God?

1 Chronicles 10:13King James Version (KJV)

13 So Saul died for his transgression which he committed against the Lord, even against the word of the Lord, which he kept not, and also for asking counsel of one that had a familiar spirit, to enquire of it;​

 

[Puppet]

The common excuse given by todays prideful Pharisee's is it's not that the obvious errors are errors in the Bible, there is something wrong with the audience. For the longest time we couldn't question the church lest we be branded heretics, blasphemers, locked up and even killed!

But what really happens in the faith brain that makes Gods Words out of mans words? It is because there is so much truth and wisdom in the heavily edited and redacted books, the faith brain just uncomfortably ignores the obvious while arrogantly chiding those who point it out. The problem with editing is they would leave parts of the original in the text and the original wasn't perfect either.

Saul kills himself:

1 Samuel 31:4King James Version (KJV)

4 Then said Saul unto his armourbearer, Draw thy sword, and thrust me through therewith; lest these uncircumcised come and thrust me through, and abuse me. But his armourbearer would not; for he was sore afraid. Therefore Saul took a sword, and fell upon it.

Saul kills himself:

1 Chronicles 10:4King James Version (KJV)

4 Then said Saul to his armourbearer, Draw thy sword, and thrust me through therewith; lest these uncircumcised come and abuse me. But his armourbearer would not; for he was sore afraid. So Saul took a sword, and fell upon it.

No, it was the Philistines who killed Saul:

2 Samuel 21:12King James Version (KJV)

12 And David went and took the bones of Saul and the bones of Jonathan his son from the men of Jabeshgilead, which had stolen them from the street of Bethshan, where the Philistines had hanged them, when the Philistines had slain Saul in Gilboa...

Or was it God?

1 Chronicles 10:13King James Version (KJV)

13 So Saul died for his transgression which he committed against the Lord, even against the word of the Lord, which he kept not, and also for asking counsel of one that had a familiar spirit, to enquire of it;​

It is Caino who:

- is deceitful and desperately sick (Jer. 17:9).
- is full of evil (Mark 7:21-23).
- loves darkness rather than light (John 3:19).
- is unrighteous, does not understand, does not seek for God (Rom. 3:10-12).
- is helpless and ungodly (Rom. 5:6).
- is dead in his trespasses and sins (Eph. 2:1).
- is by nature a child of wrath (Eph. 2:3).
- cannot understand spiritual things (1 Cor. 2:14).
- is a slave of sin (Rom. 6:16-20).

No wonder you hate God and tell him He is in error.

The doctrine of the divine authority of the Scriptures has always been fully sustained by the proofs from fulfilled prophecy, from the inexhaustible depths of truth revealed, from its matchless power over the lives of men, from its indestructibility and from the testimony of Jesus Christ, the Son of God. However, some have been won to wave these lines of evidence aside as unscientific.

Does this mean that the critical scholars of the world and the atheists and infidels will now all be brought to bend the knee to Jesus Christ and to accept the Scriptures? NO, indeed! For scores of them who already have been confronted with these facts, push them aside, saying either they have no time to investigate or they are not interested in mathematics of the Bible. “The world by wisdom knows not God,” and “the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God,” no matter how strong may be evidences of divine inspiration presented. If the infinite Christ Himself could not convince the scholars of His day, no numeric phenomena revealed in our day will convince those who do not want to be convinced.

 

[Caino]

It is Caino who:

- is deceitful and desperately sick (Jer. 17:9).
- is full of evil (Mark 7:21-23).
- loves darkness rather than light (John 3:19).
- is unrighteous, does not understand, does not seek for God (Rom. 3:10-12).
- is helpless and ungodly (Rom. 5:6).
- is dead in his trespasses and sins (Eph. 2:1).
- is by nature a child of wrath (Eph. 2:3).
- cannot understand spiritual things (1 Cor. 2:14).
- is a slave of sin (Rom. 6:16-20).

No wonder you hate God and tell him He is in error.

The doctrine of the divine authority of the Scriptures has always been fully sustained by the proofs from fulfilled prophecy, from the inexhaustible depths of truth revealed, from its matchless power over the lives of men, from its indestructibility and from the testimony of Jesus Christ, the Son of God. However, some have been won to wave these lines of evidence aside as unscientific.

Does this mean that the critical scholars of the world and the atheists and infidels will now all be brought to bend the knee to Jesus Christ and to accept the Scriptures? NO, indeed! For scores of them who already have been confronted with these facts, push them aside, saying either they have no time to investigate or they are not interested in mathematics of the Bible. “The world by wisdom knows not God,” and “the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God,” no matter how strong may be evidences of divine inspiration presented. If the infinite Christ Himself could not convince the scholars of His day, no numeric phenomena revealed in our day will convince those who do not want to be convinced.

Now you are getting angry and lying like Grosnick Morowbee because you can't defend the obvious evidence presented. But I understand, your pride will not allow you to be honest, neither will your idolatrous theology.

 

[God's Truth]

Now you are getting angry and lying like Grosnick Morowbee because you can't defend the obvious evidence presented. But I understand, your pride will not allow you to be honest, neither will your idolatrous theology.

You have done the same thing here yourself.

 

[Caino]

You have done the same thing here yourself.

Where? I presented the facts, the puppet didn't' even address them rather he insults me with false accusations. Typical. :grave:

 

[God's Truth]

Where? I presented the facts, the puppet didn't' even address them rather he insults me with false accusations. Typical. :grave:

You both merely insult others.

 

[Caino]

You both merely insult others.

That's an insult.

 

[freelight]

The brass tacks here..........

The brass tacks here..........

I don't care to do all that for the urantians. Internet has all those information. The neat thing about those numbers are the waves, the crests and the dips. To make a wave, you'll need those remainders or left overs: +2, +1, +0, 0, -1, -2 then back up to -1, 0, +1, +2. In other words those numbers creates waves. It goes up and down, over and over. Anyone can google 'debunk theomatics' and find numbers that don't match. Every sum of numbers that don't match or don't sound complete has remainders. In mathematics, the remainder is the amount "left over" after performing some computation. God wrote through the writers with tons of remaiders making you think its debunkable but you forgot another set of patterns, "the waves". Those waves are saved for the future when someone figures it out. Those are perfect waves threaded through the entire 66 book. Imposible for all the writers to get together and work those numbers out at once. Only God can do that.

Again,....I don't see the evidence yet for that,....just conjecturing that some numnerical variables somehow proves the Bible is true. Doesn't necessarily compute.

You say God cant do anything.

A circular assumption, since we can assume lots of things about 'God', what he can or cant do.

We got our Bible and you got your urantia. We win , you lose.

First of all, this is not some kindergarten contest or posing one 'team' against another, as if in some cosmic gridlock. One's notion therefore of 'winning' a debate is inconsequential in the greater context of reality, beyond one's own narrow point of view, which only looks thru a tiny microscope out into the world of infinity.

Truth is truth wherever it is found, described in various 'terms', 'meaning' and 'context'. That's what a truth seeker looks at, and continues to be open to research/test all things.

You're getting seasick with all those doctrines going back,forth, up, down and going down a whirlpool in a bad storm. Unratia is that bad storm. 9 truths to tell you one lie and you don't know which one is the lie. Thats why we use the bible to smack the lies. We have knocked you out. You're deepoy sleeping and no where ready for the return. To be ready you'll need to use the Bible to test urantia. You have already failed the tests and blame it on God and His words by saying His Words are full of crap. Shame on you!

Such is mere posturing and polemics.....ridicule in the guise of an apologetic. If you're not interested in reading other materials that have religious, philosophical and cosmological truth-perspectives,..then you're free to restrict yourself to your own choices, but in the end,...that's all you'll have. That's between you and 'God' (who is truth). I opt for the greater vision, frontier of unknown territory and being open to 'progressive revelation'. I'm a free spirit, giving that freedom by 'God' to enjoy, and be responsible for.






pj

 

[freelight]

The unfolding cosmos............

The unfolding cosmos............

You have done the same thing here yourself.

All persons have a 'point of view', 'philosophical disposition', 'cultural upbringing' and 'free will' which affects or conditions various aspects of their 'choosing' of their religious path-way....obviously.

So far in this thread,....the UB holds in its cosmological integrity as a whole, as far as a cosmological-religious-philosophical over-view of the great ascension plan of creation and the eternal progress of mortals along that path Godward is concerned. The papers in this work describe this marvelous undertaking and project of life-expansion, ever evolving in rhythm to the divine will and harmonies that orchestrate the glory of God in the cosmos. Those who read the papers discover such wonderful details, and share these with those also interested in them. Hence the discussion here.

Those offering scorn, ridicule, polemics, ad hominems do not enhance the discussion here, but only show their narrow dogmatism and rigid view of religion under the guise of their own prescribed lens. A greater vision affords a better life-overview, and being open to explore those potentials and possibilities of life. Hence our undertaking




pj

 

[freelight]

What really has value..........

What really has value..........

You both merely insult others.

A more noble path is humble,...it considers what truth is available and can be found in whatever text, tradition or school.....recognizes those, synthesizing, comparing, correlating those with the truth-insights of other chapters of religious truths, values and mythology...since all this 'information' is part of the data we use to 'interpret' and 'translate' religious ideals and values. That's what it comes down to. In the interest of pursuing goodness, truth and beauty,...there is no room for 'insults', but only honest investigation and appreciation of whats been given to us. That is our focus and context of learning.




pj