ECT The Grace of God. Is it merited or unmerited?
- Thread starter Cross Reference
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Jamie Gigliotti
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That is correct, but our love is in response to His, He loved us first.
"We love because He first loved us." 1 John 4:19
God's Truth
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We love because He first loved us is 'us' in general. God loved His creation. However, God does not know you personally if you do not love Him by obeying Him.
1 Corinthians 8:3 But whoever loves God is known by God
Glad that you see we do not love Him until we obey Him.
The Bible says that God loves those who love Him.
John 14:21 The person who has my commandments and obeys them is the one who loves me. The one who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I will love him and will reveal myself to him."
Proverbs 8:17 I love those who love me, and those who seek me find me.
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Thanks be to us all that God is not double-minded. When He imputes the condignly meritorious righteousness of the active and passive obedience of Our Lord's works to those who call upon His name it is clear justification is a punctiliar declaration of God.
Would that Romanists and others aligned with them reject any notion that we have either congruent or condign merit. Christ’s obedience is perfect. His merit, His obedience, is active and suffering righteousness (i.e., His whole obedience) is imputed to us. The ground of our acceptance with God as righteousness is wholly outside of us.
Give praise that God rejects congruent merit and any notion that would imply God grades on a curve. Rather rejoice that it is our consolation that we may be assured that our righteousness does not depend upon our works, for if this were the case we should lose it thousands of times, but upon the sacrifice and merit of Christ alone.
AMR
Would that Romanists and others aligned with them reject any notion that we have either congruent or condign merit. Christ’s obedience is perfect. His merit, His obedience, is active and suffering righteousness (i.e., His whole obedience) is imputed to us. The ground of our acceptance with God as righteousness is wholly outside of us.
Give praise that God rejects congruent merit and any notion that would imply God grades on a curve. Rather rejoice that it is our consolation that we may be assured that our righteousness does not depend upon our works, for if this were the case we should lose it thousands of times, but upon the sacrifice and merit of Christ alone.
AMR
God's Truth
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11 “This is the meaning of the parable: The seed is the word of God. 12 Those along the path are the ones who hear, and then the devil comes and takes away the word from their hearts, so that they may not believe and be saved. 13 Those on the rocky ground are the ones who receive the word with joy when they hear it, but they have no root. They believe for a while, but in the time of testing they fall away. 14 The seed that fell among thorns stands for those who hear, but as they go on their way they are choked by life’s worries, riches and pleasures, and they do not mature. 15 But the seed on good soil stands for those with a noble and good heart, who hear the word, retain it, and by persevering produce a crop.
Those scriptures prove that anyone can hear and believe, and people can stop believing.
andyc
New member
I think a lot of people from many schools of thought are repulsed by the idea that fallen man has within himself the ability to behave in certain situations in a ways that please God.
Ahab is a fantastic example of a moron of man, but with the odd moments where he showed some character. When Elijah delivered a message from God to Ahab, basically explaining that it was all over for him, in the nastiest possible way, Ahab decides to humble himself before God.
So here we have one of the evil kings with some degree of conscience, responding in a way that diverts instant judgement.
Another time with Ahab, is when he was agreeing to the terms of surrender given to him by Ben-Hadad. He appears to be a pathetic defeated man about to be stripped of his kingdom, and has no sense of self respect, but when Ben-Hadad was going to take his wives and children, he showed some fighting spirit in the face of an impossible situation. The man responded with some character, and God got involved.
People are not born totally depraved.
Ahab is a fantastic example of a moron of man, but with the odd moments where he showed some character. When Elijah delivered a message from God to Ahab, basically explaining that it was all over for him, in the nastiest possible way, Ahab decides to humble himself before God.
So here we have one of the evil kings with some degree of conscience, responding in a way that diverts instant judgement.
Another time with Ahab, is when he was agreeing to the terms of surrender given to him by Ben-Hadad. He appears to be a pathetic defeated man about to be stripped of his kingdom, and has no sense of self respect, but when Ben-Hadad was going to take his wives and children, he showed some fighting spirit in the face of an impossible situation. The man responded with some character, and God got involved.
People are not born totally depraved.
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Cross Reference
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"In Christ", by His perfection, not ours, is His righteousness "imputed" to the one who calls on His Name.
"In the Lord", His righteousness is "imparted" to the one who obeys in His Name unto sonship in the Father..See John 1:12 KJV and that only to the life that has been abandoned to Him; no compromised one can not expect anything. By it, he seals himself away from God's provision. . . "in Christ"
Question: What is the "provision" that can only be manifested, "in the Lord" but, John 17:3?
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It is pure bible my sister
The natural man recieveth not the things of the Spirit of God for they are foolishness to him, neither can he for they are spiritually discerned. The mind of the flesh is at enmity with God.
But Paul is speaking about Christians, not the unsaved....so when the word of God comes to the unrenewed mind it re-acts like Jon did and says "that is the biggest load of hogwash he ever heard"
What I had said was that to suppose that God gives grace with a view to future works is as false as to believe that we earn salvation or grace to be saved by works we have done.
This is what YOU also believe
In order for grace to be truly grace it must be TOTALLY free of any condition whatsoever
This is shown in the healing of the lepers....I said God spects that we would return and give thanks....but He does not snatch back what He has given freely, the lepers kept their healing.
And my original point was that obeying commands is a bargaining position whereby we having obeyed the letter of the law now come to God and demand that He fulfils His part of the deal. That is the OT way.
But what they found was that they never could keep their side of the bargain.
So God scrapped it hook line and sinker for us who will only believe.
See Abraham believed God and was counted righteous 400 years before any laws.
The reprobation and the saved are two different people....but the saved can remain unrenewed in their minds and so they still think along fleshly lines...and that fleshly mind is at enmity with God still. Even though we saved.
The very first step towards praying for grace is to recognise the dire need for grace
...only God can reveal that
Quite so....it is paid for, but not by us. Indeed we could not pay for it. It is the sheer impossibleness of our being able to afford to pay for it that causes God to make it free
God DEMANDS that we accept it free, He has made trying to earn it a point of disobedience
If the greatest, most wisest man who ever lived could not earn salvation, if the richest man could not afford, what about the poor uneducated beggar?
For the sake of the beggar God made it free. Yes and He made it simple too...only believe
1Mind1Spirit
Literal lunatic
Hebrews 5:8
Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered;
You have not abandoned your life to Him, you do not know what abandoning your life to Him means...YOU are very much in control. You are what Paul calls a will worshipper. Your whole life is spent trying to make yourself obey your will by means of denials of fleshly comforts and by obedience to rigourous devotion...prayers and fastings etc
You are going the way of the Galatians, you have forgotten the joy, the satisfaction you had at first of being saved, you have forgotten that He who works miracles among us works miracles not by obeying commands but by hearing with faith.
Corinth proves you wrong, they were in receipt of magnificent gifts and blessings but they were unruly and ill disciplined not to say disobedient in areas.
Long, long before I was born....when Pentecost was sweeping the western world like a fire, conquering all before it through amazing evangelistic movements
They made a critical mistake
They made a decision to no longer focus on evangelism but to refocus Pentecostalism on "growth in grace" holiness
What happened is they have grown grumpy
Cross Reference
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You mean like, Abel, given as our example? Indeed, man was not made depraved in any way as is supposed by Adam's transgressions. What he was given to do was
"overcome" the law of his flesh now bound to per(Rom 8:20 KJV).
In fact, many of the same people you mention are repulsed by the thought Adam could even think on his own BEFORE he transgressed.
Cross Reference
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You know little and presume much to your destruction, especially about me.
Cross Reference
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"Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward." 1 Corinthians 3:13-14 (KJV)
'nough said about what God will do with "congruent" righteousness! In this is the man Jesus also our example. "How shall we escape, if we neglect so great salvation; . . . . " Hebrews 2:3 (KJV)
You sayin' this is not graceless and grumpy?
sneaky
verse 15 says if any man's work is burned up he will suffer loss although he himself WILL BE SAVED
Cross Reference
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First correct/overcome that which you are bound to before accusing others of their 'lack'.