ECT The Gospel Preached at Pentecost

D

Danoh

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Jerry Shugart said:
So then we see the disciples proclaiming the message of John the Baptist that the kingdom was at hand. But how did JB know that the Lamb of God was going to take away the sins of the world?

Why don't you think about it this way Jerry my son, JB was a prophet. He had received direct revelation from God. The 12 disciples were not prophets they were mere students.

"The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world" (Jn.1:29).​

Sir Robert Anderson writes that "This is not translation merely, it savours of exegesis. 'Who beareth the sin of the world' is what the Baptist said. His words were not a prophecy of what Christ would accomplish by His death, but a statement of what He was in His life. Mark the present tense, 'Who is bearing'. And while the word used in 1 Peter 2:24, and in kindred passages, is a sacrificial term, we have here an ordinary word for lifting and carrying burdens. When the Lord sighed in healing the deaf mute by the Sea of Galilee Mark 7:34, and when He groaned and wept at the grave of Lazarus, He took upon Himself, as it were, the infirmities and sorrows which He relieved, and made them His own" (Anderson, Types in Hebrews, [Kregel Publications, 1978], p.52).

I am still waiting to hear your idea in regard to what "gospel" the Twelve were preaching at Luke 9:6 since at that time they didn't even know that the Lord Jesus was to die.
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Yep :thumb:

Matthew 11:28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. 11:29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls. 11:30 For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.
 
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Jerry Shugart said:
intojoy said:
So then we see the disciples proclaiming the message of John the Baptist that the kingdom was at hand. But how did JB know that the Lamb of God was going to take away the sins of the world?

Why don't you think about it this way Jerry my son, JB was a prophet. He had received direct revelation from God. The 12 disciples were not prophets they were mere students.

"The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world" (Jn.1:29).​

Sir Robert Anderson writes that "This is not translation merely, it savours of exegesis. 'Who beareth the sin of the world' is what the Baptist said. His words were not a prophecy of what Christ would accomplish by His death, but a statement of what He was in His life. Mark the present tense, 'Who is bearing'. And while the word used in 1 Peter 2:24, and in kindred passages, is a sacrificial term, we have here an ordinary word for lifting and carrying burdens. When the Lord sighed in healing the deaf mute by the Sea of Galilee Mark 7:34, and when He groaned and wept at the grave of Lazarus, He took upon Himself, as it were, the infirmities and sorrows which He relieved, and made them His own" (Anderson, Types in Hebrews, [Kregel Publications, 1978], p.52).

I am still waiting to hear your idea in regard to what "gospel" the Twelve were preaching at Luke 9:6 since at that time they didn't even know that the Lord Jesus was to die.
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Answered that: wine roses equals the kingdom.
Anderson has a lot of errors.


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Danoh said:
Yep :thumb:

Matthew 11:28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. 11:29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls. 11:30 For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.
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"Go, thy sins are forgiven thee"


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dodge

dodge

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Jerry Shugart said:
He didn't make an error in regard to the tense of the Greek word translated "taketh away" at John 1:29 because it is in the "present" tense. John was not speaking about the Cross.
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Of course John was talking about the cross ,and it is absolutely amazing and speaks volumes that you cannot receive that !
 
D

Danoh

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intojoy said:
"Go, thy sins are forgiven thee"


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2 Chronicles 6:28 If there be dearth in the land, if there be pestilence, if there be blasting, or mildew, locusts, or caterpillers; if their enemies besiege them in the cities of their land; whatsoever sore or whatsoever sickness there be: 6:29 Then what prayer or what supplication soever shall be made of any man, or of all thy people Israel, when every one shall know his own sore and his own grief, and shall spread forth his hands in this house: 6:30 Then hear thou from heaven thy dwelling place, and forgive, and render unto every man according unto all his ways, whose heart thou knowest; (for thou only knowest the hearts of the children of men: ) 6:31 That they may fear thee, to walk in thy ways, so long as they live in the land which thou gavest unto our fathers.

Matthew 9:2 And, behold, they brought to him a man sick of the palsy, lying on a bed: and Jesus seeing their faith said unto the sick of the palsy; Son, be of good cheer; thy sins be forgiven thee. 9:3 And, behold, certain of the scribes said within themselves, This man blasphemeth. 9:4 And Jesus knowing their thoughts said, Wherefore think ye evil in your hearts? 9:5 For whether is easier, to say, Thy sins be forgiven thee; or to say, Arise, and walk? 9:6 But that ye may know that the Son of man hath power on earth to forgive sins, (then saith he to the sick of the palsy,) Arise, take up thy bed, and go unto thine house. 9:7 And he arose, and departed to his house. 9:8 But when the multitudes saw it, they marvelled, and glorified God, which had given such power unto men.

Kingdom context under the Law.

Under the Law; their sicknesses were due to their nation's collective violations of the Law.

And now how marvelous this - HE - the very Lord of THEIR God-given Sabbath (rest) Himself - He Who had the authority to forgive THEIR sin, upon THEIR EXPRESSED belief that He was the One THEIR Law and the Prophets did say, should come - was in THEIR midst...AT LAST.

Result?

Thy sins having been forgiven thee for thy faith in Me - that I Am YOUR Prophesied Christ - I have made you whole.

He healed the guy; o clueless one.

He restored him WHOLE.

Symbolic that He now considered the guy back in Covenant once more with His Father: the God of THEIR fathers, and His Covenant with THEM.

Duh-uh.

Mid-Acts, o clueless one, IS Genesis THROUGH Revelation IN LIGHT OF Romans THROUGH Philemon.

It is NOT a Replacement theology.

WE...ARE...EACH...TO KNOW...THE...BOOK.

ALL OF IT.

Isaiah 8:20; 2 Tim. 3:16-17.
 
dodge

dodge

New member
Jerry Shugart said:
If that was true then the Baptist would have used the "future" tense instead of the "present" tense.
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Got ya Jerry so Jesus' D.B.R. had nothing to do with paying the sin debt for all of us. What do you suppose J.B. was talking about when he said, "behold the Lamb of God which takes away the sin of the world" ?

What I have learned is that those in MAD act more and more like Roman Catholics they will destroy the context of any teaching of Jesus or any verse any where in scripture to force their false understandings on and into scripture.
 
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Jerry Shugart said:
He didn't make an error in regard to the tense of the Greek word translated "taketh away" at John 1:29 because it is in the "present" tense. John was not speaking about the Cross.
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I'm going to go out on a limb here and let you know that the good dr Anderson no longer believes that Jerry.


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Danoh said:
2 Chronicles 6:28 If there be dearth in the land, if there be pestilence, if there be blasting, or mildew, locusts, or caterpillers; if their enemies besiege them in the cities of their land; whatsoever sore or whatsoever sickness there be: 6:29 Then what prayer or what supplication soever shall be made of any man, or of all thy people Israel, when every one shall know his own sore and his own grief, and shall spread forth his hands in this house: 6:30 Then hear thou from heaven thy dwelling place, and forgive, and render unto every man according unto all his ways, whose heart thou knowest; (for thou only knowest the hearts of the children of men: ) 6:31 That they may fear thee, to walk in thy ways, so long as they live in the land which thou gavest unto our fathers.

Matthew 9:2 And, behold, they brought to him a man sick of the palsy, lying on a bed: and Jesus seeing their faith said unto the sick of the palsy; Son, be of good cheer; thy sins be forgiven thee. 9:3 And, behold, certain of the scribes said within themselves, This man blasphemeth. 9:4 And Jesus knowing their thoughts said, Wherefore think ye evil in your hearts? 9:5 For whether is easier, to say, Thy sins be forgiven thee; or to say, Arise, and walk? 9:6 But that ye may know that the Son of man hath power on earth to forgive sins, (then saith he to the sick of the palsy,) Arise, take up thy bed, and go unto thine house. 9:7 And he arose, and departed to his house. 9:8 But when the multitudes saw it, they marvelled, and glorified God, which had given such power unto men.

Kingdom context under the Law.

Under the Law; their sicknesses were due to their nation's collective violations of the Law.

And now how marvelous this - HE - the very Lord of THEIR God-given Sabbath (rest) Himself - He Who had the authority to forgive THEIR sin, upon THEIR EXPRESSED belief that He was the One THEIR Law and the Prophets did say, should come - was in THEIR midst...AT LAST.

Result?

Thy sins having been forgiven thee for thy faith in Me - that I Am YOUR Prophesied Christ - I have made you whole.

He healed the guy; o clueless one.

He restored him WHOLE.

Symbolic that He now considered the guy back in Covenant once more with His Father: the God of THEIR fathers, and His Covenant with THEM.

Duh-uh.

Mid-Acts, o clueless one, IS Genesis THROUGH Revelation IN LIGHT OF Romans THROUGH Philemon.

It is NOT a Replacement theology.

WE...ARE...EACH...TO KNOW...THE...BOOK.

ALL OF IT.

Isaiah 8:20; 2 Tim. 3:16-17.
Click to expand...

No confession and no spreading of the hand..no understanding of his own sores. No comparison


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intojoy

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Jerry Shugart said:
If that was true then the Baptist would have used the "future" tense instead of the "present" tense.
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Not true. JB had knowledge of the sacrificial work of Messiah because he was a prophet. He misunderstood the gap of time to come between the Messiah's work of salvation and the setting up of the Kingdom. I think that's reasonable to believe. At any rate you have his statement and you cannot change that little nugget of evidence. Selah


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intojoy

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Danny baby! You're really stretching it buddy. Nice try. What you fail to distinguish is that personal faith in the Messiah was not a requirement for healing until after the unpardonable sin of Matthew 12 (that u n Jerry miserably fail to understand is the turning point is all of scripture).


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D

Danoh

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intojoy said:
Danny baby! You're really stretching it buddy. Nice try. What you fail to distinguish is that personal faith in the Messiah was not a requirement for healing until after the unpardonable sin of Matthew 12 (that u n Jerry miserably fail to understand is the turning point is all of scripture).


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Nope - there said unpardonable sin is, in Acts 6 and 7 - the turning point concerning unbelieving Israel.
 
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Jerry still fails to recognize my answer. Since answering as IP does is his strongest argument. My answer is the same as jerry's. Leaves him no where to go with his eisegesis.


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I

Interplanner

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intojoy said:
No confession and no spreading of the hand..no understanding of his own sores. No comparison


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Jerry and Danoh have the same problem: just because the event of the cross is a couple years ahead it 'doesn't count' when Jesus is doing something, let's say, in the first month of his ministry, or if John the B says it.

That's how you get such wacko remarks about the future tense from Jerry.

Then you get these huge generalizations behind which all kinds of 2P2P is actually hiding, even though 2P2P is a total clunk. 'Gen to Rev in light of Rom to Phil' which can mean about 30 things, but they want it to mean '2P2P is true.'
 
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