The Eternal Purpose of creation !

aikido7

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Here is a simplistic yet profound way to test the power of the greatest commandments, possibly to an ultimate truth. If you choose to read further then search for something greater than I have written.

What purpose can be so great, that it would compel God to create the universe and life, knowing in advance the suffering of mankind and that his son would die? Would it be to forgive the sins of mankind, or can there be something greater?

Challenge your mind to find a greatest good purpose for creation; by searching for answers to three questions.

What greatest thing can God create?
God could create all the stars and planets of the universe; he then becomes God the builder.
God could create a whole variety of life with almost no intelligence like plants; he now becomes God the gardener' God could create life with more intelligence like the animal kingdom. He now becomes God the farmer. God could create life in his own image, a life that could understand him. He now become God the Father. Can God create anything greater than children in his own image, Does the greatest thing that God creates, depend on the relationship that he can have with them?

What greatest purpose can God have to create children in his own image?
Could the ultimate God be a God who loves in the greatest way? God the Father willingly loves all of mankind as he loves HIMSELF.
Can there be any greater reason to create children, even for God; can God love us more than he loves himself? In a way, God loves us more than he loves himself, because he sent his Son to die for us. In a contradicting way, God loves himself more than us, because he is the greatest being in the universe and retains the power of heaven or hell over us. We can never have the wisdom to understand the fullness of God’s love during our lifetime, but to dare to think that God loves each and every one of us as he loves himself is indeed a profound thought.

To find a greatest purpose for all God's children.
What greatest purpose could God set for humanity? Would it be for everyone to turn to His kind of religion and pray the way that he stipulates, or would it be to banish poverty, gain intellectual superiority, conquer sickness and death, and subdue the universe or is there more?
If the greatest reason God could have to create mankind, is to love us, as he loves himself, then God could create mankind, with the freedom to return God's love
All of mankind to be created with the freedom to love God the creator unconditionally, are we given the greatest commandment as a guide for this very purpose?
God willingly loves everyone as he loves himself; do we also need this same freedom to love everyone in the same way, so that the truth can be complete for God and mankind.
All of mankind, to be created with the freedom to love their neighbour; as they love themselves unconditionally; are we given the second greatest commandment as a guide?
Is this how God wants his children to be one? He wants us to love each other as we love ourselves, despite our differences.
Could the greatest commandments be a Greatest and Ultimate Truth?

John 15 – As the Father has loved me, so have I loved you.

Just some rambling thoughts to challenge the mind to think.
It is interesting to think there are still some people around who can divine God's purpose and be arrogant enough to be secure in the notion that they can proclaim it to others in some pure, divine and untouchable form. I guess I am still often surprised to still hear it from posters such as yourself.

I just don't think that makes any common sense at all. How can we actually think "we" have the answer? I look within and see a struggling sinner, trying to do the right thing by picking up my cross and moving forward, always forward.

So sorry, to be blunt--I do not share your theological formulations.
 

Eric h

Well-known member
It is interesting to think there are still some people around who can divine God's purpose and be arrogant enough to be secure in the notion that they can proclaim it to others in some pure, divine and untouchable form. I guess I am still often surprised to still hear it from posters such as yourself.

I just don't think that makes any common sense at all. How can we actually think "we" have the answer? I look within and see a struggling sinner, trying to do the right thing by picking up my cross and moving forward, always forward.

So sorry, to be blunt--I do not share your theological formulations.

Fair enough, as I said, they are just some rambling thoughts to challenge the mind to think.

Jesus said two commandments are greatest, so if you were searching for an ultimate answer, these commandments seem a logical place to start.

And just a thought, when Jesus spent his time on Earth, would these commandments have had a greatest meaning for him too?

I cannot comprehend the greatness of God. But in challenging the greatest commandments in this way, I am starting to have some small understanding of their importance for ourselves. They seem to lead towards justice for the poor and oppressed. We struggle to do the will of our Lord.

Blessings

Eric
 

beloved57

Well-known member
It was a Heavenly Kingdom

It was a Heavenly Kingdom

Matt 25:34

34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:

Its the Kingdom the Apostle to the Gentiles writes of here 2 Tim 4:18

And the Lord shall deliver me from every evil work, and will preserve me unto his heavenly kingdom: to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.

Again this Kingdom is an Heavenly Kingdom, and Adam, man in Adam in their first beginning in the Garden before the fall, while yet having not sinned, even then was not fit for the Heavenly Kingdom, because Adam was naturally in his best estate but flesh and blood, whereas God had determined from the foundation this Grand Truth 1 Cor 15:50

Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

That Kingdom that those on Christ Right Hand Inherit Matt 25:34

34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:

Its the same Kingdom Paul says this about in 1 Cor 15:50

50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

Man in Adam was also Made subject to corruption and mortality, which disqualified Adam and his Seed to inherit the Kingdom that was prepared for some from the foundation !

Only those who were to be Born Again from incorruptible Seed, were to inherit the Kingdom prepared from the foundation Matt 25:34 !
 

Nanja

Well-known member
Matt 25:34

34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:

Its the Kingdom the Apostle to the Gentiles writes of here 2 Tim 4:18

And the Lord shall deliver me from every evil work, and will preserve me unto his heavenly kingdom: [/B]to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.

Again this Kingdom is an Heavenly Kingdom, and Adam, man in Adam in their first beginning in the Garden before the fall, while yet having not sinned, even then was not fit for the Heavenly Kingdom, because Adam was naturally in his best estate but flesh and blood, whereas God had determined from the foundation this Grand Truth 1 Cor 15:50

Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

That Kingdom that those on Christ Right Hand Inherit Matt 25:34

34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:

Its the same Kingdom Paul says this about in 1 Cor 15:50

50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

Man in Adam was also Made subject to corruption and mortality, which disqualified Adam and his Seed to inherit the Kingdom that was prepared for some from the foundation !

Only those who were to be Born Again from incorruptible Seed, were to inherit the Kingdom prepared from the foundation Matt 25:34 !



Amen! It was God's Redemptive Purpose in Christ, in His Suretyship Heb. 7:22; Rev. 13:8,
for Adam, and the Elect Seed in him, to sin so they could be made Spiritual, Born Again John 3:3,
and Inherit the Kingdom that He prepared for them, His Adopted Sons Eph. 1:4-5, before the foundation Mat. 25:34.

Praise Him! ☺

~~~~~
 

beloved57

Well-known member
Amen! It was God's Redemptive Purpose in Christ, in His Suretyship Heb. 7:22; Rev. 13:8,
for Adam, and the Elect Seed in him, to sin so they could be made Spiritual, Born Again John 3:3,
and Inherit the Kingdom that He prepared for them, His Adopted Sons Eph. 1:4-5, before the foundation Mat. 25:34.

Praise Him! ☺

~~~~~

Very Good!
 

beloved57

Well-known member
It was a Heavenly Kingdom 2

It was a Heavenly Kingdom 2

Now because it was an Heavenly Kingdom, the Elect of God, the Heirs of God, in their natural head Adam, had not yet been made meet for the Eternal Kingdom of God, which God had prepared for them from the foundation Matt 25:34

34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:

But in Adam they were only made flesh and blood, as stated in Heb 2:14

14 Forasmuch then as the children[heirs Rom 8:16-17] are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;

Now being in Adam, and in him only natural flesh and blood, they were not yet prepared or made meet for that Glorious Inheritance they were to Inherit. No they would only be made prepared for it through Union with Christ, the Adam from Heaven 1 Cor 15:47

The first man is of the earth, earthy; the second man is the Lord from heaven.

Their Heirship to the Heavenly Kingdom came not because of their natural union with adam at creation, but because of a Eternal Union in Christ before the foundation of Creation. They were in Christ before being in adam, and by their Election in Christ prior, they were Heirs of God and Joint Heirs with Christ Rom 8:17

17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

It was always a necessity for the Heirs to be redeemed by Christ to fit them for their Heavenly Heirship !
 

beloved57

Well-known member
Because Predestinated to the Adoption of Sons !

Because Predestinated to the Adoption of Sons !

We know this World was Created for a Redemptive Purpose in Christ because of the end of Predestination. God before the foundation of the World had chosen a People in Christ unto the Adoption of Children/Sons [in time] Eph 1:3-5

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:

4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

BTW, only those who in Time receive the Adoption of Sons by the Spirit coming into them Rom 8:15-16

15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:

Then they were not Chosen in Christ before the foundation as in Eph 1:4, .

Pay attention to Eph 1:5 for its in accordance to having been Chosen in Christ before the foundation in Vs 4, and only some were Predestinated to the Adoption of Children by Jesus Christ.

The word Children here are the greek words huiothesia one word is huios and primarily means a Son, and the other word is tithēmi and means to place, to set,

Its the Divine act in Time whereby God sends the Spirit of God into our hearts that we become the Manifested Sons of Adam Gal 4:6

6 And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father.

They were always secretly Sons of God because of their Election Union in Christ, but its veiled by their natural connection with Earthy Adam.

This is also connected with their being being predestinated to be conformed to the Image of their Elder Brother, Gods Son, Jesus Christ Rom 8:29

29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

This also means they were predestinated to be born again ! And the Adoption of Sons comes through Christ and His Redemptive Death Gal 3:13-14;Eph 1:7, So Redemption by His Blood was Predestinated before the foundation Eph 1:4 and Adam was Created under that Eternal Redemptive Purpose !
 

beloved57

Well-known member
All things were made for Jesus Christ the Saviour !

All things were made for Jesus Christ the Saviour !

Theres no doubt that the Word of God teaches that all things created were so for Jesus Christ Col 1:15-16

15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for/unto him:

This would include the Creation of Adam and Eve, man in Adam in the beginning , when God said Gen 1:26

26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

It was for /unto Redemptive Glory in and through Jesus Christ. Now Col 1:14 is connected to Col 1:16-17, and so Man in Adam was Created for Redemption, Forgiveness of sins through Christ's Blood, for it was only through this means that Man would fulfill the God ordained purpose for his Creation, in being made in the Image and Likeness of God; For that could not have been accomplished or fulfilled in Adam in his flesh, seeing that at his best estate he was only natural, carnal, and mutable, none of which can constitute the True Image and Likeness of God, for it was always to be achieved through the Redemption in and through Christ Process.

So when God gave Adam the Command not to eat of that particular tree Gen 2:16-17

16 And the Lord God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:

17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

The Command was given in connection and subordinate to the Redemptive Purpose in Christ where Forgiveness of sins is appropriate Col 1:14

14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:

Lets not forget that All things were Created for The Saviour/Redeemer Jesus Christ Col 1:16 in how He was to Glorify His Father upon the Earth Jn 17:4-5 , a Work given Him to do before the World began, and it had to do with Redemption through His Blood !
 

Nanja

Well-known member
We know this World was Created for a Redemptive Purpose in Christ because of the end of Predestination. God before the foundation of the World had chosen a People in Christ unto the Adoption of Children/Sons [in time] Eph 1:3-5

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:

4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

BTW, only those who in Time receive the Adoption of Sons by the Spirit coming into them Rom 8:15-16

15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:

Then they were not Chosen in Christ before the foundation as in Eph 1:4, .

Pay attention to Eph 1:5 for its in accordance to having been Chosen in Christ before the foundation in Vs 4, and only some were Predestinated to the Adoption of Children by Jesus Christ.

The word Children here are the greek words huiothesia one word is huios and primarily means a Son, and the other word is tithēmi and means to place, to set,

Its the Divine act in Time whereby God sends the Spirit of God into our hearts that we become the Manifested Sons of Adam Gal 4:6

6 And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father.

They were always secretly Sons of God because of their Election Union in Christ, but its veiled by their natural connection with Earthy Adam.

This is also connected with their being being predestinated to be conformed to the Image of their Elder Brother, Gods Son, Jesus Christ Rom 8:29

29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

This also means they were predestinated to be born again ! And the Adoption of Sons comes through Christ and His Redemptive Death Gal 3:13-14;Eph 1:7, So Redemption by His Blood was Predestinated before the foundation Eph 1:4 and Adam was Created under that Eternal Redemptive Purpose !


Praise the Lord!

Receiving the Spirit of Adoption is proof and evidence that a person was
predestinated from Eternity Eph. 1:4-5 to be one of God's Adopted Children.
For each one of them shall come to experience this Great Miracle in Time!

~~~~~
 

beloved57

Well-known member
Praise the Lord!

Receiving the Spirit of Adoption is proof and evidence that a person was
predestinated from Eternity Eph. 1:4-5 to be one of God's Adopted Children.
For each one of them shall come to experience this Great Miracle in Time!

~~~~~

Amen.
 

beloved57

Well-known member
In the day you eat, ye shall surely die !

In the day you eat, ye shall surely die !

Gen 2:17

17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

This surely dying God speaks of here is something already predetermined by the purpose of God to happen, its a sure thing. By this God had already determined that sin and death should enter the world for man Rom 5:12

12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

The above wasn't by chance, mishap, accident, but deliberately purposed by God, it was according to the Eternal Purpose in Christ Jesus Eph 3:11

11 According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:

See, what God stated to Adam in Gen 2:17, "for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die. it was based upon and according to His Eternal Purpose He purposed in Christ Jesus. The name Jesus:

IēsoúsJesus, the transliteration of the Hebrew term, 3091 /Lṓt ("Yehoshua"/Jehoshua, contracted to "Joshua") which means "Yahweh saves" (or "Yahweh is salvation").

His Name Jesus is related to Salvation, hence this world was Created, and Man for the Eternal Purpose of being Saved through Christ, from Sin and Death, caused by the sin of Adam.

Eph 3:9

9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:

This is also the Mystery of Creation ! Created for an salvific Purpose in Christ Jesus !
 

Nanja

Well-known member
Gen 2:17

17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

This surely dying God speaks of here is something already predetermined by the purpose of God to happen, its a sure thing. By this God had already determined that sin and death should enter the world for man Rom 5:12

12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

The above wasn't by chance, mishap, accident, but deliberately purposed by God, it was according to the Eternal Purpose in Christ Jesus Eph 3:11

11 According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:

See, what God stated to Adam in Gen 2:17, "for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die. it was based upon and according to His Eternal Purpose He purposed in Christ Jesus. The name Jesus:

IēsoúsJesus, the transliteration of the Hebrew term, 3091 /Lṓt ("Yehoshua"/Jehoshua, contracted to "Joshua") which means "Yahweh saves" (or "Yahweh is salvation").

His Name Jesus is related to Salvation, hence this world was Created, and Man for the Eternal Purpose of being Saved through Christ, from Sin and Death, caused by the sin of Adam.

Eph 3:9

9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:

This is also the Mystery of Creation ! Created for an salvific Purpose in Christ Jesus !


Amen! Before anything was Created, God in His Eternal Purpose, determined that Christ was the Lamb slain from the foundation Rev. 13:8 for all God's elect Chosen in Christ Eph. 1:4. He was their designated Surety, to take their sins upon Himself instead of them, thus satisfying God's Law and Justice on their behalf, before they would ever be born in time. For it was God's Purpose to never punish them for their sins, but to have mercy on His Chosen People, His Sons Rom. 9:23 instead of condemning them with the rest of the world 1 Cor. 11:32.

Consequently, it was God's Purpose that Adam, and all the Elect of God he was Federal Head of, would disobey and sin against God, and all for His Glory in Christ Jesus!
 

beloved57

Well-known member
Amen! Before anything was Created, God in His Eternal Purpose, determined that Christ was the Lamb slain from the foundation Rev. 13:8 for all God's elect Chosen in Christ Eph. 1:4. He was their designated Surety, to take their sins upon Himself instead of them, thus satisfying God's Law and Justice on their behalf, before they would ever be born in time. For it was God's Purpose to never punish them for their sins, but to have mercy on His Chosen People, His Sons Rom. 9:23 instead of condemning them with the rest of the world 1 Cor. 11:32.

Consequently, it was God's Purpose that Adam, and all the Elect of God he was Federal Head of, would disobey and sin against God, and all for His Glory in Christ Jesus!
Amen Sister!

Sent from my 5054N using TheologyOnline mobile app
 

beloved57

Well-known member
Christ was foreordained before the foundation of the world !

Christ was foreordained before the foundation of the world !

We know this World was Created for a Redemptive purpose in Christ because He was foreordained before the world began 1 Pet 1:18-20

18 Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;


19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:


20Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,


Now John Gill comments on Vs 20

Who verily was foreordained,.... Or "foreknown"; that is, by God; and which intends, not barely his prescience of Christ, of what he should be, do, and suffer; but such a previous knowledge of him, which is joined with love and affection to him; not merely as his own Son, and the express image of his person, but as Mediator; and whom he loved before the world was, and with a love of complacency and delight, and which will last for ever. It includes the choice of him as the head of the election, and the pre-ordination of his human nature, to the grace of union to his divine Person, and the pre-appointment of him to various things. The Syriac version adds, "to this"; that is, to be the lamb for a sacrifice, to be a propitiation for the sins of his people, to be the Saviour and Redeemer of them by his precious blood. The allusion is to the taking of the passover lamb from the sheep, or from the goats, and keeping it separate, from the tenth to the fourteenth day of the month, before it was slain; so Christ, as man, was chosen out from among the people; and as Joseph's antitype was separated from his brethren, and that before the foundation of the world; for all God's decrees and appointments, relating either to Christ, or his people, are eternal; no new thoughts, counsels, and resolutions, are taken up by him in time. The affair of redemption by Christ is no new thing; the scheme of it was drawn in eternity; the persons to be redeemed were fixed on; the Redeemer was appointed in the council and covenant of peace; and even the very Gospel which proclaims it was ordained before the world, for our glory. A Saviour was provided before sin was committed, and the method of man's recovery was settled before his ruin took place; and which was done without any regard to the works and merits of men, but is wholly owing to the free and sovereign grace of God, and to his everlasting love, both to the Redeemer and the redeemed. The Jews (h) reckon the name of the Messiah among the seven things that were created before the world was; in proof of which they mention, Psalm 72:17 but was manifest in these last times for you; he was before, he existed from everlasting; he lay in the bosom of his Father from all eternity: and was veiled and hid under the shadows of the ceremonial law, during the legal dispensation; but in the fulness of time was manifest in the flesh, and more clearly revealed in the Gospel, and to the souls of men; his manifestation in human nature is principally intended, and which was in the last times of the legal dispensation, at the end of the Jewish world or state, when a new world, or the world to come, took place. It is a rule with the Jews (i), that whenever the last days or times are mentioned, the times of the Messiah are designed: and this manifestation of Christ was for the sake of some particular persons, even for all God's elect, whether among Jews or Gentiles, and who are described in the following verse. The Alexandrian copy reads, "for us"; and the Ethiopic version, "for him",

So Adam must sin in accordance with this redemptive purpose !
 

Nanja

Well-known member
We know this World was Created for a Redemptive purpose in Christ because He was foreordained before the world began 1 Pet 1:18-20

18 Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;


19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:


20Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,


Now John Gill comments on Vs 20



So Adam must sin in accordance with this redemptive purpose !


Amen, Adam must sin!

God Created moral evil and sin [a dominion Rom. 6:14] Col. 1:16 for His Eternal Purpose in Christ, the Lamb slain before the foundation Rev. 13:8.

Christ died a Covenant Death for a Covenant People, as their Covenant Head and Surety Heb. 7:22 from Everlasting. He took upon Himself their sins and His Righteousness was imputed to them, according to God's Purpose and Grace given them before the World began 2 Tim. 1:9.
 

KingdomRose

New member
Eph 3:7-11

7Whereof I was made a minister, according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me by the effectual working of his power.

8Unto me, who am less than the least of all saints, is this grace given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ;

9And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:

10To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God,

11 According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:

Col 1:14-16

14In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:

15Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

The creation of the world was Soterilogical and Redemptive for all intents and purposes..

Gen 1:1

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

This is where God begins to manifest a Divine Eternal Purpose, which He eons afore time, purposed in Himself, the Triune God..

This Eternal Purpose was predicated upon God manifesting His redemptive [from sin] wisdom of His Chosen People, the Vessels of Mercy Rom 9:23..

Hence from all eternity God, That the world He created through Jesus Christ Eph 3:9 would be for the display of His manifold wisdom and grace in the redemption of Chosen lost sinners. Eph 3:10

10 To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God,

For the execution and accomplishment of this Eternal Purpose, God has sovereignly controlled the world from its beginning, and will continue until its consummation, and time will be no more.

All that happens in this world, mysteriously has Soteriological and or Redemptive meaning, that which is both good and evil is included. All has been ordained by God and serves to operate into the displaying the manifold Wisdom of God in the Salvation or Redemption of the Church and His Glorification Through Jesus Christ !

You'd best check your facts before making such misleading statements. God is NOT "triune." That pagan belief has no place in the true faith.

Also, "the world" that saw the beginning of God's plan of salvation was not the planet but was the same "world" as is spoken about in I John 2:15-17. It was the world of mankind alienated from God. The creation of Earth and mankind was not so that mankind could be saved. God created the earth so that humans could live on it forever in paradise conditions. There was originally NO NEED of salvation. That need came when the first man disobeyed and took something that wasn't his, showing his contempt for God's rulership.

Jesus died so that humans could, in effect, take up where Adam left off (plunging his offspring into sin and death), that is, taking care of the earth and being God's friend. (Genesis 1:28; 2:15)

There is no "mystery" any more. The only mystery that there ever was was who the Messiah would be, and who his co-rulers would be.

Everything is simple. God is one Person---Jehovah. His Son is the only-begotten Jesus, the first of creation, the only person or thing created by Jehovah himself. (Colossians 1:15) Jesus has bought us back from sin and death so that we can live in perfect physical bodies on the beautiful planet Earth forever.
 

beloved57

Well-known member
You'd best check your facts before making such misleading statements. God is NOT "triune." That pagan belief has no place in the true faith.

Also, "the world" that saw the beginning of God's plan of salvation was not the planet but was the same "world" as is spoken about in I John 2:15-17. It was the world of mankind alienated from God. The creation of Earth and mankind was not so that mankind could be saved. God created the earth so that humans could live on it forever in paradise conditions. There was originally NO NEED of salvation. That need came when the first man disobeyed and took something that wasn't his, showing his contempt for God's rulership.

Jesus died so that humans could, in effect, take up where Adam left off (plunging his offspring into sin and death), that is, taking care of the earth and being God's friend. (Genesis 1:28; 2:15)

There is no "mystery" any more. The only mystery that there ever was was who the Messiah would be, and who his co-rulers would be.

Everything is simple. God is one Person---Jehovah. His Son is the only-begotten Jesus, the first of creation, the only person or thing created by Jehovah himself. (Colossians 1:15) Jesus has bought us back from sin and death so that we can live in perfect physical bodies on the beautiful planet Earth forever.

Wild rabbit trail !
 

KingdomRose

New member
we already are discussing that..though its possible, its not certain, all those could have been non elect as well, and consequently would go to hell for their sin in the their head, which would be satan..all the non elect, wether fetus or 100 yr old person, sinned initially in the devil their Father..

Then some could have been elect..we dont know..

Oh tut tut tut! No, it's NOT possible! beloved57 will lead you right down a dead-end path. There isn't even a literal hell-fire!

Children, babies, aborted fetuses, miscarriages will NOT be in heaven ruling with Christ. Jesus said it would be people who had "stuck with him in his trials." (Luke 22:28) Adult Christians.

If Adam had not rebelled he would still be here, and there would have been no need for mankind to be saved.

Only a small number will go to heaven. They will be co-rulers with Christ, helping to guide billions of people here on the earth, to restore it to its perfect condition, to welcome back the dead, to build beautiful homes, and generally make the earth a wonderful place to live.
 

beloved57

Well-known member
Oh tut tut tut! No, it's NOT possible! beloved57 will lead you right down a dead-end path. There isn't even a literal hell-fire!

Children, babies, aborted fetuses, miscarriages will NOT be in heaven ruling with Christ. Jesus said it would be people who had "stuck with him in his trials." (Luke 22:28) Adult Christians.

If Adam had not rebelled he would still be here, and there would have been no need for mankind to be saved.

Only a small number will go to heaven. They will be co-rulers with Christ, helping to guide billions of people here on the earth, to restore it to its perfect condition, to welcome back the dead, to build beautiful homes, and generally make the earth a wonderful place to live.

Please get lost, don't have time for your foolishness !
 
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