ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
socialists never want to point the finger at themselves
Silicon Valley Leaders’ Plea to Democrats: Anyone but Sanders
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socialists never want to point the finger at themselves
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
You are the means of production
Open your own co-operatively owned pizza parlor and run it so well that all the capitalist pizza parlors are driven out of business. Let your workers draw from the pot what they think they are worth. Let your customers pay you what they think your pizzas are worth.
Nobody is stopping you from putting your beliefs into action. Go for it!
The capitalists don't care about morals. They also don't care about your interests.
If acting immorally and working against your interests means that they maximize their profits, they're fine with it.
It depriving you of your rights means that they maximize their profits, they're fine with it.
If depriving you of your privacy means that they maximize their profits, they're fine with it.
You know what I call buying politicians to get cut social security benefits to people who have paid into social security for decades?
Stealing.
But the capitalists buy politicians to do precisely that.
I'm only saying that we should have the same attitude with respect to the capitalists that they have towards us.
We should be as ruthless as they are in pursuing our own interests.
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
you can't justify immoral behavior by pointing at the other guy's transgressions
stealing is wrong, regardless of whether you think you're stealing from a thief
Is it in the interest of the people with lots of wealth to be deprived of their money?
Because you're envious of their wealth?
Envy is a sin, Trad.
Are you green with envy?
What did the people who own the means of production do to deserve having their property away?
Considering that I would rather have everyone taxed an equal rate, and only 5% at most of only their income...
And I'm a capitalist.
Considering your argument for a moment, isn't it in their interest to do so?
I mean, let's stay consistent in your reasoning here.
You realize that hashtags don't work on here, right?
This isn't twitter.
So why is it a bad thing for them to do?
Your personal interests?
So where's the issue then?
What you're saying basically amounts to this:
Everyone else has their opinions, but mine should be followed.
Your interest is to steal from the rich to line your own pockets.
No?
My interests?
"Is it not lawful to do what I want with my own things? Or is your eye evil because I am good?"
"Thou shall not steal."
"For you, brethren, have been called to liberty; only do not use liberty as an opportunity for the flesh, but through love serve one another.For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this: 'You shall love your neighbor as yourself.'But if you bite and devour one another, beware lest you be consumed by one another!"
Those are my interests.
This coming from someone who wants to steal from the rich to line his own pockets.
I also want to point out.
Does anybody remember what happened that one time when there was massive wealth and income inequality and the owner class told the starving peasants to go eat cake?
I do.
:angrymob:
:execute:
All I'm demanding is imprisonment and confiscation.
That seems pretty moderate and reasonable in comparison, no?
And at that point, a vote for Bernie is just twisting my arm.
Does anybody remember what happened that one time when there was massive wealth and income inequality and the owner class told the starving peasants to go eat cake?
I do.
:angrymob:
:execute:
All I'm demanding is imprisonment and confiscation.
That seems pretty moderate and reasonable in comparison, no?
And at that point, a vote for Bernie is just twisting my arm.
Neither do you, apparently.
If I, as a capitalist, can make money off you by serving you, what issue do you have with that?
Neither do you care about others' interests, apparently.
Would it bother you if someone took your money from you because they thought they deserved it more than you did?
No one here is condoning immorality but you, Trad.
If you, Trad, go apply for a job, and they tell you that in order to hire you, you have to agree to their pay rate, are you being forced to work for that person? Let's assume you choose to work for them. Would it not be better to start out making a lower wage, and then show them that your hard work is deserving of a raise?
:think:
When was the last time you got a pay raise?
Would it not be in their interests to maximize their profits?
Or is it just not in YOUR interests?
What rights are being deprived by a company hiring someone and paying them a certain wage?
Wouldn't it be better to be working for a low wage than to not be working at all?
Again, wouldn't that be in their interests?
Privacy? What's that got to do with anything?
Social Security was already theft the moment it was conceived.
Stealing from the rich, middle class, poor, old, middle aged, young, and future generations.
Tell me, where do you think all the money is supposed to come from to pay out those who have put into it?
Sorry, but that doesn't give you carte blanche the right to steal from others.
You're more than welcome to start your own business and run it how you see fit (so long as you don't break the law).
And what do we call killing someone to take their wealth?
Murder.
Punishing an innocent person for no crime committed is just as wicked as not punishing someone who did.
Your greed and lust for your neighbor's wealth has clouded your mind so much that you can't even see that what your advocating is wrong.
I asked Trad the following:
If the government took all your money to line their pockets, would you be ok with it?
His answer:
So Trad, why would you not be ok with it?
I mean, it's ceasar's coin, no?
So if you would not be ok with it, then maybe, just maybe, those who have more wealth than you would ALSO not be ok with the government taking their wealth, which is what your advocating.
I also asked you this, prior to asking the above question:
So if the government took your money from you to line their pockets, it wouldn't be theft?
My question now is this:
Where do you draw the line between "theft" and "not theft"?
If I'm unemployed, and take your money from you at gunpoint while out on the street, it's theft, but if I work for the government, and take your money at gunpoint out on the street, it's not theft? Or is that incorrect?
If the government took all your money to line their pockets, would you be ok with it?
His answer:
So Trad, why would you not be ok with it?
I mean, it's ceasar's coin, no?
So if you would not be ok with it, then maybe, just maybe, those who have more wealth than you would ALSO not be ok with the government taking their wealth, which is what your advocating.
I also asked you this, prior to asking the above question:
So if the government took your money from you to line their pockets, it wouldn't be theft?
My question now is this:
Where do you draw the line between "theft" and "not theft"?
If I'm unemployed, and take your money from you at gunpoint while out on the street, it's theft, but if I work for the government, and take your money at gunpoint out on the street, it's not theft? Or is that incorrect?
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
Social security, Medicare and Medicaid are also theft, according to JR... :chuckle:
Your point?
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
he's right :idunno:
Then why do you accept and benefit from stolen money?
I wonder how many "Medicare thieves" there are on this forum. Maybe start a poll thread on that?
Because it's not wrong to recover money stolen from me that I was forced to pay into such programs under threat of imprisonment.
That's one way to rationalize theft. You're just taking back what's yours.
I'm trying to find Pastor Enyart's answer to this question.
His answer is FAR better than mine is, but I think I got the gist of it.
Sorry, but taking money from someone is theft.
That person taking back said money is not.
The government is the one committing theft, and theft by receiving by those who take more than they've been forced to put in, by implementing such programs.
If it's not your money, you don't have the right to take it and give it to someone else, nor does the third party have the right to take it.
Recovering what is rightfully mine is not theft. The line is drawn at what I've put in, and taking anything more than that is where it becomes theft.