Should we pay tithes to be bless and free?

c.moore

New member
Originally posted by Zakath

Benny's not a nutcase, he's a con man. Two very different animals. :think:

"Crazy like a fox." as my mother in law used to say.

Again it not about a con man but I think he is reaping his harvest in all his giving and tithes his fruits are looking very rich to him and his ministry.

I really don`t think he has people at the door with base ball bats knocking people out to steal their money.

He ask the people to be a cheerful giver in his ministry and that his ministry is good ground to plant your money seed that will grow in faith and a good giving heart for whosoever.
 

elected4ever

New member
c.moore. I don't think that tithing per say is what got God to bless you. God blesses because we are his children.

Usually it is a self fulling prophecy. If a person thinks he can't then he wont and if a person thinks he can he will. We act on what we believe. By having a principle and acting on it, your conduct changed your circumstance. It is not that tithing opened a window of heaven but you had a catalyst for acting responsibly. Not believing the negative but believing the positive. It may interest you to know that this principle works wither you are a Christian or not. As a man thinketh in his heart,so is he.
 

Sozo

New member
Originally posted by c.moore

I heard benny Hinn didn`t pay his tithes at one time for a couple of years and he latter payed by the past tithes and caught up all the tithes payment and that why he has a multi million dollar ministry with signs and wonders, and millians getting saved world wide, even in nation no other ministry is allowed.

Maybe Benny Hinn is proof of Malichi that he prove God and the fruits works.

Here is an oldie, but goodie...




"FEED ME c.moore... FEEEED ME!!"
 

Zakath

Resident Atheist
Originally posted by c.moore

Again it not about a con man but I think he is reaping his harvest in all his giving and tithes his fruits are looking very rich to him and his ministry.
Why isn't it about a con man? That's what he is. He lies to the public and people like you apparently can't seem to get enough...

Or how about the time Hinn went into a Catholic hospital in Sault Ste. Marie, Ontario, and healed everyone there? The way Hinn tells it is that he, three other Pentecostal preachers, and seven Catholic priests held a service together in the hospital chapel, where everyone went to work with "anointing bottles" and patients were healed instantly. They were then asked to lay hands on all the patients in the hospital's rooms, so Hinn and his "Miracle Invasion" team went down the hall healing people, knocking them down with God's power, until "the hospital looked like it had been hit by an earthquake."

The reality – easily confirmed by speaking to officials at Sault Ste. Marie General Hospital and the Gray Sisters of the Immaculate Conception who work there – is that no patients were released the day Hinn held a small service in the chapel and that, furthermore, "Mr. Hinn's claims are outlandish and unwarranted."

...He claims to have cured three people of AIDS, even though the Centers for Disease Control have never seen the HIV virus leave a body once it's infected.

He healed a case of brain cancer on stage, even though Inside Edition followed up with tests that showed the tumor was still present.

He pronounced a woman cured of heart disease, and she was so convinced that she threw away her heart medicine. Questioned about it, Hinn said, "It's not my job to call their doctor."

The "cure" of a deaf woman turned out to be a woman who, according to her doctor, was not deaf in the first place.

The cure of three deaf boys turned out to be bogus. A Houston woman who thought she was cured of lung cancer ("It will never come back!" Hinn told her) rejected her doctors' advice and care – and died two months later.

The heavyweight boxer Evander Holyfield, banned from boxing because of a heart condition, went to a Benny Hinn crusade in Philadelphia, had Hinn lay hands on him, and gave Hinn a check for $265,000 after he was told he was healed. In fact, he passed his next examination by the boxing commission, but later his doctors said he never had a heart condition in the first place – he had been misdiagnosed.

Hinn claimed that God ripped the pacemaker out of a woman's body because she didn't need it anymore.

Hinn claims that a man in Ghana was raised from the dead on the platform. "We have it on video!" he says – although he's never produced the video.

I could go on, but you get the idea. Even sadder than the people who think they're healed are the ones so sick that Hinn's employees never allow them to be seen on stage. People suffering from paralysis, brain damage, dementia and the like – people who couldn't possibly make any "demonstration" on stage – are rejected at a screening session held backstage.

In two cases journalists have tried to verify all the healings at a particular crusade. For an HBO documentary called A Question of Miracles, researchers attended a Portland, Oregon, crusade at which 76 miracles were claimed. Even though Hinn had agreed to provide medical verification of each one, he stonewalled requests for the data, then eventually responded 13 weeks later – with only five names. HBO followed up the five cases and determined that a woman "cured" of lung cancer had died nine months later, an old woman's broken vertebra wasn't healed after all, a man with a logging injury deteriorated as he refused medication and a needed operation, a woman claiming to be healed of deafness had never been deaf (according to her husband), and a woman complaining of "breathlessness" had stopped going to the doctor on instructions of her mother.

Just last December NBC's Dateline tried to duplicate the HBO study. At a crusade in Las Vegas they counted 56 miracles. Of those, Hinn eventually provided data "proving" five of them. Four of those people refused to share their medical records with NBC. The remaining one, a woman supposedly cured of Lou Gehrig's Disease, had been misdiagnosed, according to her doctor.


Source

I really don`t think he has people at the door with base ball bats knocking people out to steal their money.
Actually they use large white plastic buckets...

He ask the people to be a cheerful giver in his ministry and that his ministry is good ground to plant your money seed that will grow in faith and a good giving heart for whosoever.
So you would recommend giving money to a demonstrated con man and claim that is "good ground"?

You're either implying that your deity doesn't care one whit about the ethics of his representatives or that this whole seed planting in "God's work" thing is basically "magic" that works independent of the morality or even the faith of the giver...

If Hinn is a con man, he's not doing God's work, according to most Christians I have spoken with.


If he's not a con man, how come there is no financial accountability in his ministry? :think:

Hinn runs the largest evangelistic organization in the world that is NOT a member of the Evangelical Council for Financial Responsibility. That means his finances are private, his salary is secret, and his income is anybody's guess. Royalties from his books alone are estimated at $500,000 per year, but he essentially has carte blanche to take anything out of the till he wants. "He lives the lifestyle of a billionaire," says Ole Anthony, "all on the backs of false promises and selling false hope."

As Hinn put it himself, in a moment of rare revelatory candor, "I don't need gold in heaven, I gotta have it now."

During 1993, his one year of "reform," he talked about being stung by being portrayed as a millionaire and how he wanted to be "more Christ-like." His solution: "The Lord said sell the Benz and the watch."

He got rid of his Rolex and his Mercedes. Notice he didn't give them away. He sold them – and then replaced the Mercedes with a $65,000 BMW. This is what God told him to do. And who better to know what God wants, because Hinn, after all, is only the third person in the history of the universe to have actually seen God and lived to tell about it. God, he says, is 6-2 or 6-3, with long hair of a light brown color, and eyes that can look right through you.

But hey, its your money, c.moore and you're the one who'll allegedly have to answer to the creator of your universe for every penny of it...
;)
 

c.moore

New member
Zakath



But hey, its your money, c.moore and you're the one who'll allegedly have to answer to the creator of your universe for every penny of it...

I`ll take the blessing and the trust in Benny Ministry, it is good harvest ground to me which worked, many times.
 

Zakath

Resident Atheist
Selling "snake oil" and other frauds to old people desparate to recover their health makes some people wealthy too. But even an atheist like me wouldn't be involved with ripping off sick people like Hinn does.

:vomit:

If you're so unconcerned about the morals and ethics involved with making money, why not just sell narcotics to children? I'm told that makes some people very wealthy... :sozo2:
 

Sozo

New member
Originally posted by Zakath

If you're so unconcerned about the morals and ethics involved with making money, why not just sell narcotics to children? I'm told that makes some people very wealthy...

Especially psychiatrists!
 

Zakath

Resident Atheist
Originally posted by Sozo

Especially psychiatrists!
Jealousy will get you nowhere... at least this psychologist doesn't wrap himself in the Bible claiming divine sanction for his therapy... :nono:
 

godrulz

Well-known member
Hall of Fame
Exactly. Psychiatry is famous for its fads and foolish ideas that have little basis in truth, morals, or reality. There are so many conflicting schools that sometimes do more harm than good (relativism). Godly psychiatry that uses the Word of God, prayer, and insights of science is superior (absolutes based on the Creator's knowledge).

There is a book called "The Jesus Factor". Psychiatry had virtually no success with drug addicts in the ?70s. I think it was Teen Challenge and the preaching of the Gospel that had ?86% success rate with heroin addicts. Professionals/government called this the "Jesus Factor". This is not anecdotal, but based on evidence.
 

SOTK

New member
Originally posted by godrulz

Exactly. Psychiatry is famous for its fads and foolish ideas that have little basis in truth, morals, or reality. There are so many conflicting schools that sometimes do more harm than good (relativism). Godly psychiatry that uses the Word of God, prayer, and insights of science is superior (absolutes based on the Creator's knowledge).

There is a book called "The Jesus Factor". Psychiatry had virtually no success with drug addicts in the ?70s. I think it was Teen Challenge and the preaching of the Gospel that had ?86% success rate with heroin addicts. Professionals/government called this the "Jesus Factor". This is not anecdotal, but based on evidence.

Also of note is the fact the both the Medical Community and Psychiatry had little to virtually no effect in helping alcoholics recover from alcoholism until Alcoholics Anonymous came around and introduced 12 spiritual steps where the roots of these can be found in the Bible.
 

godrulz

Well-known member
Hall of Fame
Christianity is mentally healthy because it has high standards and the power to live up to it.

Christianity is not difficult to live, it is impossible (without God).

Religions also have high standards, but they are mentally unhealthy because they do not have the power of God to live up to the rules and regulations. JWs and Mormon women have an above average incidence of mental illness (stats), partially related to the teachings and practices of their false religions.

Unbelievers may or may not have standards. They do not have the power to live godly lives and cannot deal with their guilt problems (need the blood of Jesus).
 

Zakath

Resident Atheist
SOTK and godrulz,

Psychiatry and psychology make use of a specific set of tools to effect a cure on an individual. If the tools are not the correct one for the condition being treated, then we could reasonably expect poor results.

As the old saying goes, "When all you have is a hammer, all problems tend to look like nails..."
 

Zakath

Resident Atheist
Originally posted by godrulz

Christianity is mentally healthy because it has high standards and the power to live up to it.
But isn't this is a red herring because no one is capable of living up to the standards?

Christianity is not difficult to live, it is impossible (without God).
Since no Christian is freed sufficiently from their human nature after conversion to completely avoid sin, I'd say that Christianity is impossible, even with God.

Unbelievers may or may not have standards. They do not have the power to live godly lives and cannot deal with their guilt problems (need the blood of Jesus).
I know many unbelievers that live like gods (i.e. godly). They are venal, jealous, vindictive, seeking to punish their enemies and reward those who are good to them, and attempt to conform others to their wills.

Sounds like gods to me... :chuckle:
 

On Fire

New member
Originally posted by Zakath
Jealousy will get you nowhere... at least this psychologist doesn't wrap himself in the truth....

Right.....you peddle your OWN bathtub snake oil.
 

godrulz

Well-known member
Hall of Fame
Originally posted by Zakath

SOTK and godrulz,

Psychiatry and psychology make use of a specific set of tools to effect a cure on an individual. If the tools are not the correct one for the condition being treated, then we could reasonably expect poor results.

As the old saying goes, "When all you have is a hammer, all problems tend to look like nails..."

Some theories and practices were simply stupid and are now a joke in your circles. They made money for their gurus and those gullible enough to buy into it. Of course, this does not negate legitimate practices and research. Christianity is not the only thing that has weirdos and wackos.
 

godrulz

Well-known member
Hall of Fame
Originally posted by Zakath

But isn't this is a red herring because no one is capable of living up to the standards?

Since no Christian is freed sufficiently from their human nature after conversion to completely avoid sin, I'd say that Christianity is impossible, even with God.

I know many unbelievers that live like gods (i.e. godly). They are venal, jealous, vindictive, seeking to punish their enemies and reward those who are good to them, and attempt to conform others to their wills.

Sounds like gods to me... :chuckle:

One awesome, beautiful, perfect true God; many false gods (your caricatures/straw men).
 

Sozo

New member
Originally posted by Zakath

But isn't this is a red herring because no one is capable of living up to the standards?

Since no Christian is freed sufficiently from their human nature after conversion to completely avoid sin, I'd say that Christianity is impossible, even with God.

I know many unbelievers that live like gods (i.e. godly). They are venal, jealous, vindictive, seeking to punish their enemies and reward those who are good to them, and attempt to conform others to their wills.

Sounds like gods to me... :chuckle:

If only you had actually ever really been exposed to the gospel, and not the religious crap that you rejected.

:(
 

c.moore

New member
I have done my study on tithes and logically what many people have said make sense , but being able to ear God voice when I want , told me to stay faithful and pay my tithes no matter what.
So I will continue as a cheerful tither , and a greater giver, just because i love God.
I will seek God face more than most people seeking for God hans, give me back or give me give me like you name is Jimmy.

So I do think a realy loving christian needs to tithes, and please the Lord.
i told my wife today I will tithes myself even if she doesn`t I will stay faithful , and be not cursed with a curse as many and let the Lord continue to bless me and my family and churhes.

The Lord also told me are you going to be led by ignorance ,or by My Spirit.
I pick the Spirit praise the Lord.

AMEN!
 

Sozo

New member
Originally posted by c.moore

I have done my study on tithes and logically what many people have said make sense , but being able to ear God voice when I want , told me to stay faithful and pay my tithes no matter what.
So I will continue as a cheerful tither , and a greater giver, just because i love God.
I will seek God face more than most people seeking for God hans, give me back or give me give me like you name is Jimmy.

So I do think a realy loving christian needs to tithes, and please the Lord.
i told my wife today I will tithes myself even if she doesn`t I will stay faithful , and be not cursed with a curse as many and let the Lord continue to bless me and my family and churhes.


The Lord also told me are you going to be led by ignorance ,or by My Spirit.
I pick the Spirit praise the Lord.

AMEN!

Yes, c.moore, we can see by reading your post that you are not being led by ignorance. :chuckle:
 
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