Real Science Friday: A Leading Telescope Designer in Studio

Arthur Brain

Well-known member
AB,

For one to attack a position, one must first exist. Do you agree?

What God? Do you believe in creation? Why are you hiding your belief?

Tom

Your position has been attacked from all sides Tom, with good reason. Before I entertain you any further I want a proper response to my latter thereupon I'll happily answer your inquiries. I've done the same with yourself so you've no reason not to. Debate is a two way street Tom. You don't get to call the shots or deflect as and when you see fit. Once you've answered my points in regards to Paul, Lazarus being a "smelly creature" etc then I'll reciprocate.

Or, if you want to hide behind your own deflection as regards myself then that's your perogative also. I've been blunt and honest with you though so hopefully you'll afford me the same.

:e4e:
 

some other dude

New member
Your position has been attacked from all sides Tom, with good reason. Before I entertain you any further I want a proper response to my latter thereupon I'll happily answer your inquiries. I've done the same with yourself so you've no reason not to. Debate is a two way street Tom. You don't get to call the shots or deflect as and when you see fit. Once you've answered my points in regards to Paul, Lazarus being a "smelly creature" etc then I'll reciprocate.

Or, if you want to hide behind your own deflection as regards myself then that's your perogative also. I've been blunt and honest with you though so hopefully you'll afford me the same.

:e4e:



artie - do you have this as a cut and paste? I see you use viurtually the same childish nonsense on a nightly basis.

Why not just stop being such a pansy and tell Tom what your beliefs are? Are you that ashamed of sharing them?
 

Arthur Brain

Well-known member
artie - do you have this as a cut and paste? I see you use viurtually the same childish nonsense on a nightly basis.

Why not just stop being such a pansy and tell Tom what your beliefs are? Are you that ashamed of sharing them?

I'm not ashamed at all dude, and if Tom has the decency to answer relevantly to the points then I'll share, not that my personal beliefs are even remotely salient to the discussion at hand. You didn't even have the guts to answer that which tom has already so just jog on....else admonish me for giving food to someone in need.

No?

Thought not.

:e4e:
 

Arthur Brain

Well-known member
oh artie, you just don't seem to get it do you?

Not very sharp today, are you?

Dude, this is just so booooooring! Insult me by all means if that's what ya gotta do but change the record to something interesting! Where's the wit dude? Finesse? Originality? This is just the same hackneyed tripe that would embarrass a four year old dude. Do better....
 

some other dude

New member
Silly artie - what a wuss, afraid to share his beliefs.

And too stupid to understand why I set up that other thread for him. :sigh:
 

Arthur Brain

Well-known member
Silly artie - what a wuss, afraid to share his beliefs.

And too stupid to understand why I set up that other thread for him. :sigh:

And your rapier wit never ceases to begin dude. Geez, at least there's been trolls on here who had some sorta ability in that department. You are such a snorefest where it comes to repartee man....

Oh, and I know why you set up the thread as I reckon everyone else does too, even though you'd supposedly 'had it with me' regardless...

In case it's escaped your notice I'm at liberty to respond to any thread I see fit, even yours!

:roses:

:yawn:
 

Arthur Brain

Well-known member
Yes, I reckon it is about time for you to go for a nap dude. Hopefully you'll be more revitalized tomorrow

:e4e:
 

TeeJay

New member
=PyramidHead;2775827]So, the only reason you don't steal, lie, and be a hypocrite is because you're afraid of your God? If you didn't believe in God, would you do these things? I don't believe, but I don't do the sort of things you mentioned, because they're jerk things to do, and I try not to be a jerk.

PH,

So your standard is "because they're jerk things to do." But what if someone else thinks "they're fun things to do"? What puzzles me is that atheists are so quick to become morally indignant over some injustice or behavior without asking themselves why they know in their heart of hearts that the behavior is wrong.

Most atheists adher to a code of behavior. Like the Biblical creationists, they do believe in the concepts of right and wrong. But the problem is that evolutionists have no logical reason to believe in any sort of moral imperative within their worldview.

In the evolution worldview, right and wrong can be nothing more then electro-chemical reactions in the brain--the result of time and chance. If the concepts of right and wrong are to be meaningful, evolution can't be true.

Right and wrong are Christian concepts that go back to Genesis. By attempting to be moral, therefore, the evolutionist is being irrational for he must borrow Biblical concepts from the God he denies.

Tom
 

TeeJay

New member
=Dr.Watson;2775824]I'm not. I'm pointing out the inconsistency of belonging to a religious group that is supposed to live by a certain set of standards based on the life of a supposed man-god and yet behaving in ways completely opposite to that standard.

Dr. Watson,

Why would it be wrong for me not to live up to any atandard in an atheist worldview? And for you to judge be inconsistent, you have to use laws of logic. In your world, only matter and energy exist--only the physical. So why are you using the immaterial laws of logic to argue that only the material exists? Aren't you being inconsistent and illogical?

Frankly I don't care what you're like or what you do. I'm just pointing out that you are not like the character Jesus of Nazareth. That's all.

If you don't care, then why did you post it at all?

A fictional character loosely based on a (probable) real person who lived approximately 2000 years ago.

Jesus can't possibly be a fictional character and a real person in the same way at the same time. If you are going to use God's logic, at least be logical. But you do know tht when you use logic you are being inconsistent with your worldview. Don't you?

Says you. Thankfully, science doesn't depend on your twisted idea's of reality.

Dr. Watson, I'll post this again:

"If morality evolves by accident, then my morality and your morality and Barb's morality and Granite's morality can't possibly be the same. If not the same, then subjective. None of us could condemn another's morality; we are all accidents of chemicals.

"Morality is noncontradictory and some particular behavior can't be both moral and immoral at the same time in the same way. Do you agree?"

Your answer to my first paragraph was "Says you." And then you made an undocumented appeal to science. Science is an abstract concept that really does not tell us anything.

But my second paragraph you omitted and ignored. I would like an answer to it. Do you agree?

And sometimes they are not. But because we all evolved from the same ancestors, they generally are the same.

If evolved, then nothing can be right or wrong in your worldview.

Non sequitur.

A non sequitur is an inference or conclusion that does not follow logically from a premise. My argument is that if morality comes from evolved matter, then morality can only be subjective by definition. For any morality to be objective or absolute, there must be a Moral Standard above man-not below.

Again, you use logic, which are not physical and come from the rational mind of God, to argue that God does not exist. Laws of logic and rational thought can't come from reasonless chemicals. They can't give you what they do not have to give.



Yeah. I've heard you spout this garbage before. No one is buying it. It's a joke.

The reason you are not "buying it" is that you can't refute it. "Not buying it" is an excuse not to admit that you can't justify laws of logic and morality in your worldview.

Tom
 

TeeJay

New member
=PyramidHead;2775827]So, the only reason you don't steal, lie, and be a hypocrite is because you're afraid of your God? If you didn't believe in God, would you do these things? I don't believe, but I don't do the sort of things you mentioned, because they're jerk things to do, and I try not to be a jerk.

PH,

If I did not believe in God and I "suppressed the truth of Him in unrighteousness," I would still not steal and I would try not to lie. Why? Because like you, God wrote His law on my heart and yours too. So I would be like you. I would deny God exists yet be righteously indignant over any injustice or evil I see in the world. Like any other atheist, I would be inconsistent, irrational, and arbitrary--arbitrary in that I would have no rational reason to believe that there can be any right or wrong in my atheist worldview. If you have no rational reason to believe something, then that belief is arbitrary and can only be true by accident.

Tom
 
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TeeJay

New member
=Arthur Brain;2775831]Your position has been attacked from all sides Tom, with good reason. Before I entertain you any further I want a proper response to my latter thereupon I'll happily answer your inquiries. I've done the same with yourself so you've no reason not to. Debate is a two way street Tom. You don't get to call the shots or deflect as and when you see fit. Once you've answered my points in regards to Paul, Lazarus being a "smelly creature" etc then I'll reciprocate.

Or, if you want to hide behind your own deflection as regards myself then that's your perogative also. I've been blunt and honest with you though so hopefully you'll afford me the same. My Standard warned me to be careful when casting my pearls.

:e4e:

AB,

Answer me first. Before I will let you use Jesus as a Standard, I want you to tell me He is your Sandard.

Tom
 
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