"OSAS" people are not answering this question.

[Shasta]

The four Gospels: Matthew through John were written to the
Hebrews. The Hebrews were under the law at the time. Until
Paul, the Gentiles weren't included. Christ was speaking, only
to the House of Israel. Again, do you believe in OSAS?

The Gospels were read throughout the world by all Christians - not just by small enclaves of Messianic Jews. That is a fact. Let's look at Luke. It is not addressed to Jews. You find lots of Jewish material in his book but how are you supposed to avoid that when it is about a Jewish Man in a Jewish culture?

Where in Luke do you find direct evidence that it was written with a specifically Jewish audience in mind. In fact Luke was written by a Greek to another Greek. Luke said that though many accounts had been published he wanted to give an "orderly" account of Jesus life. A lot of people had heard about Jesus and wanted to know the whole story.

I have already said I do not believe in OSAS

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

elo, the sin question was taken care of 2,000 years ago. Try to keep up?

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

The Gospels were read throughout the world by all Christians - not just by small enclaves of Messianic Jews. That is a fact. Let's look at Luke. It is not addressed to Jews. You find lots of Jewish material in his book but how are you supposed to avoid that when it is about a Jewish Man in a Jewish culture?

Where in Luke do you find direct evidence that it was written with a specifically Jewish audience in mind. In fact Luke was written by a Greek to another Greek. Luke said that though many accounts had been published he wanted to give an "orderly" account of Jesus life. A lot of people had heard about Jesus and wanted to know the whole story.

I have already said I do not believe in OSAS

Do you consider yourself a member of the Body of Christ?

 

[glorydaz]

elo was asking me over and over again, "which sins are you involved in?" Nosy
little guy, isn't he?

He wants others to be under the same yoke of bondage that he is. We would be foolish were we to heed his "advice". The enemy detests the liberty we have IN CHRIST JESUS and he will do everything in his power to incapacitate those who fall for the lie that their own self efforts will avail them anything. The only thing self effort accomplishes is putting one's focus on SELF. :nono:

Gal. 3:1-3
O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you? This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?​

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Shasta, where will you go when you leave this, "mortal coil?"

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

He wants others to be under the same yoke of bondage that he is. We would be foolish were we to heed his "advice". The enemy detests the liberty we have IN CHRIST JESUS and he will do everything in his power to incapacitate those who fall for the lie that their own self efforts will avail them anything. The only thing self effort accomplishes is putting one's focus on SELF. :nono:

Gal. 3:1-3
O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you? This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?​

Amen.

 

[Shasta]

You personally knew these Gentlemen?
Or, did you hear it second hand?

There is a way to know what people in the past believed. It is by READING. The writings of the Church fathers still exist and are readily available to anyone who wants to study them. You could read them too if you were not so adverse to reading.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Those who don't believe in OSAS, don't have a lot of faith in God's Word.

 

[Shasta]

Do you consider yourself a member of the Body of Christ?

Since I am joined to Christ who is the head I am a member.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

There is a way to know what people in the past believed. It is by READING. The writings of the Church fathers still exist and are readily available to anyone who wants to study them. You could read them too if you were not so adverse to reading.

I'd rather stick with the "Written word of God, the Bible."

 

[glorydaz]

The Gospels were read throughout the world by all Christians - not just by small enclaves of Messianic Jews. That is a fact. Let's look at Luke. It is not addressed to Jews. You find lots of Jewish material in his book but how are you supposed to avoid that when it is about a Jewish Man in a Jewish culture?

Where in Luke do you find direct evidence that it was written with a specifically Jewish audience in mind. In fact Luke was written by a Greek to another Greek. Luke said that though many accounts had been published he wanted to give an "orderly" account of Jesus life. A lot of people had heard about Jesus and wanted to know the whole story.

I have already said I do not believe in OSAS

I love the gospel of Luke, and I read all the gospels. Like the OT, it is an important part of history. You just don't seem to get the concept that scripture can be written for us but not to us. Look at the sacrifices......those are all spelled out in great detail for us, but they were not given to us to follow. It's a very simple thing if you put off your stubbornness and admit that to be true.

If you don't believe in OSAS, then you are trusting in yourself....plain and simple. That's so sad.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Since I am joined to Christ who is the head I am a member.

However, you don't trust your standing. Because, you don't believe
in OSAS.

 

[Shasta]

Those who don't believe in OSAS, don't have a lot of faith in God's Word.

These pronouncements do nothing to prove your case. Why not try presenting a case from scripture and engaging in a reasoned defense of you point of view?

 

[oatmeal]

I met a pastor who preached OSAS. He said after a person accepts christ as saviour then his entry to heaven (eternal life) is secured. I asked what if he commits adultery and not repent and not get forgiveness from God. He still said that he would go but God would discipline him (he might even kill him). So i put forth a question in the following way and he could not answer it. He said go and read John's Gospel and you will understand.

notation : M --> me, P ---> the pastor

M: Is God holy?
P: Yes.
M: Does sin dwell in God's place?
P:No.
M: So if a commits adultery he will be disciplined (God might
kill him) but he will go to heaven.
P: yes.
M: Then what happens to the sin he committed ?
P: it will still be there.
M: Who will be accountable for the sin he committed. He did not ask
for forgiveness .
P: the sin will be there.
M: if that sin is still there how will he go to heaven.?
P: why are you focusing on sin leave it.
M: its because that's the thing that separates man from God.
P: you are not a man of God or else you would have simply believed instead of asking these many questions.

and he left.. can anyone answer this question.." who will be held accountable for the unforgiven sin even when the believer has not repented and asked for forgiveness".

ps. i believe that OSAS is false... dont say a true believer will never sin......

So, what is your question?

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

People who don't trust in OSAS never know from one moment to
the next, if they're saved or not. Whereas, God wants us to have
assurance of our standing. 1 John 5:11 states: "And this is the
record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his
Son."

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

I love the gospel of Luke, and I read all the gospels. Like the OT, it is an important part of history. You just don't seem to get the concept that scripture can be written for us but not to us. Look at the sacrifices......those are all spelled out in great detail for us, but they were not given to us to follow. It's a very simple thing if you put off your stubbornness and admit that to be true.

If you don't believe in OSAS, then you are trusting in yourself....plain and simple. That's so sad.

Love this post.

 

[Shasta]

I love the gospel of Luke, and I read all the gospels. Like the OT, it is an important part of history. You just don't seem to get the concept that scripture can be written for us but not to us. Look at the sacrifices......those are all spelled out in great detail for us, but they were not given to us to follow. It's a very simple thing if you put off your stubbornness and admit that to be true.

If you don't believe in OSAS, then you are trusting in yourself....plain and simple. That's so sad.

You are under some misconceptions. I just abide in Christ. I do not think I am capable of accomplishing anything out of my own strength. I draw on His grace but I do not pursue the things of the world flesh and devil either. Again, since Christ is my life I do not focus on that at all.

I talk to people all the time of all denominations. What you see as a danger - legalism is a trap for some but mostly what I see is antinomians - people who insist that because they were once saved they can continue to live in adultery or commit fornication. I have seen more of this than anything. I have known people consumed by hatred yet they see nothing wrong with it because of OSAS. I live in the heart of OSAS country and see the error of it in people's practical everyday life. Anymore when you mention sin Christians will say you are trying to put condemnation on them. Paul would probably be accused of that if he were alive today.

I think you are too quick to stereotype what kind of experience those who do not believe in OSAS have. No one I know in my Church is living in fear of losing their salvation though we do not believe in OSAS.

Exegesis and History support the fact that freewill is the original doctrine of the Apostles and in that there is the possibility of turning away but who would want to. Like the disciples I say "to whom will I go only You have the words of Eternal Life"

 

[glorydaz]

These pronouncements do nothing to prove your case. Why not try presenting a case from scripture and engaging in a reasoned defense of you point of view?

Scripture is so clear on the matter already, and you still don't see it. Let's face it. You are NOT fully persuaded that God is able to save you to the uttermost. You are not convinced that He will perform what He began in you. You do not believe that He is faithful and will do it. You might want to examine yourself...whether you be in the faith.

Philippians 1:6
Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:


1 Thessalonians 5:23-24
And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. Faithful is he that calleth you, who also will do it.​

 

[Shasta]

People who don't trust in OSAS never know from one moment to
the next, if they're saved or not. Whereas, God wants us to have
assurance of our standing. 1 John 5:11 states: "And this is the
record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his
Son."

This is a straw man that you put together and stuffed. I believe if you fall into a lifestyle of sin or you deny the faith you are at risk. That does not happen if you sneeze and swear. You do not know what we believe and do not care to listen so you have to fabricate. This is the last refuge of someone who has denied the evidence of sound exegesis.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

This is a straw man that you put together and stuffed. I believe if you fall into a lifestyle of sin or you deny the faith you are at risk. That does not happen if you sneeze and swear. You do not know what we believe and do not care to listen so you have to fabricate. This is the last refuge of someone who has denied the evidence of sound exegesis.

I see you're a part time "Baloney Salesman" as well.