Katrina Damage
- Thread starter BillyBob
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wickwoman
New member
No, Purex, if looting and violence becomes rampant, Katrina will be nothing compared to the damage the life that will be done. There is a gang mentality that may begin here, and it has to be stopped early on before more damage to life is done. Nobody cares about water logged stereos. We are talking about a city in the U.S. of A. that is getting out of control. It has to be managed before something even more awful happens.
Sniper fire halts hospital evacuation
Gunmen fire at medical workers and patients at Charity Hospital
Thursday, September 1, 2005; Posted: 5:36 p.m. EDT (21:36 GMT)
NEW ORLEANS, Louisiana (CNN) -- The evacuation of patients from Charity Hospital was halted Thursday after the facility came under sniper fire twice.
A physician at the hospital said that despite the incidents staff members and patients were eager to get out after three days with no water and electricity and sparse food rations.
"A single sniper or two snipers shouldn't have to shut down a hospital evacuation for two hours now," Dr. Ruth Berggren told CNN. "I look outside, I'm not seeing any military." (See a video report on the sniper's attack -- 1:06 )
Berggren's husband, Dr. Tyler Curiel, witnessed both incidents.
"We were coming in from a parking deck at Tulane Medical Center, and a guy in a white shirt started firing at us," Curiel said. "The National Guard [troops], wearing flak jackets, tried to get a bead on this guy. "
The first incident happened around 11:30 a.m. (12:30 p.m. ET) as Curiel and his National Guard escorts headed back to the hospital after dropping off several patients at nearby Tulane Medical Center to be evacuated by helicopter.
Charity shares a helipad with Tulane Medical Center, which is across the street.
They were traveling in a convoy of amphibious vehicles, and Curiel said the vehicle behind him was targeted.
About an hour later, another gunman opened fire at the back of Charity Hospital.
"We got back to Charity Hospital with with food from Tulane and we said, 'OK the snipers are behind us, let's move on,' " Curiel said. "We started loading patients [for transport] and 20 minutes later, shots rang out."
The National Guard soldiers told staff to get away from the windows, and evacuations were halted.
Berggren, an infectious disease specialist at Charity Hospital, said that since then she had heard nothing about resuming evacuations.
She said about 200 patients still need to be evacuated. All of the patients in intensive care have been evacuated.
Charity Hospital has no electricity and no water, and the only food available is a couple of cans of vegetables and graham crackers.
Evacuations by boat were halted after armed looters threatened medics and overturned one of their boats.
Widespread looting and random gunfire have been reported across New Orleans. Police told CNN that groups of armed men roamed the streets overnight. (Full story)
Officers told CNN they lacked manpower and steady communications to properly do their jobs -- and that they needed help to prevent the widespread looting and violence now prevalent in the city.
http://www.cnn.com/2005/WEATHER/09/01/katrina.hospital.sniper/index.html
Gunmen fire at medical workers and patients at Charity Hospital
Thursday, September 1, 2005; Posted: 5:36 p.m. EDT (21:36 GMT)
NEW ORLEANS, Louisiana (CNN) -- The evacuation of patients from Charity Hospital was halted Thursday after the facility came under sniper fire twice.
A physician at the hospital said that despite the incidents staff members and patients were eager to get out after three days with no water and electricity and sparse food rations.
"A single sniper or two snipers shouldn't have to shut down a hospital evacuation for two hours now," Dr. Ruth Berggren told CNN. "I look outside, I'm not seeing any military." (See a video report on the sniper's attack -- 1:06 )
Berggren's husband, Dr. Tyler Curiel, witnessed both incidents.
"We were coming in from a parking deck at Tulane Medical Center, and a guy in a white shirt started firing at us," Curiel said. "The National Guard [troops], wearing flak jackets, tried to get a bead on this guy. "
The first incident happened around 11:30 a.m. (12:30 p.m. ET) as Curiel and his National Guard escorts headed back to the hospital after dropping off several patients at nearby Tulane Medical Center to be evacuated by helicopter.
Charity shares a helipad with Tulane Medical Center, which is across the street.
They were traveling in a convoy of amphibious vehicles, and Curiel said the vehicle behind him was targeted.
About an hour later, another gunman opened fire at the back of Charity Hospital.
"We got back to Charity Hospital with with food from Tulane and we said, 'OK the snipers are behind us, let's move on,' " Curiel said. "We started loading patients [for transport] and 20 minutes later, shots rang out."
The National Guard soldiers told staff to get away from the windows, and evacuations were halted.
Berggren, an infectious disease specialist at Charity Hospital, said that since then she had heard nothing about resuming evacuations.
She said about 200 patients still need to be evacuated. All of the patients in intensive care have been evacuated.
Charity Hospital has no electricity and no water, and the only food available is a couple of cans of vegetables and graham crackers.
Evacuations by boat were halted after armed looters threatened medics and overturned one of their boats.
Widespread looting and random gunfire have been reported across New Orleans. Police told CNN that groups of armed men roamed the streets overnight. (Full story)
Officers told CNN they lacked manpower and steady communications to properly do their jobs -- and that they needed help to prevent the widespread looting and violence now prevalent in the city.
http://www.cnn.com/2005/WEATHER/09/01/katrina.hospital.sniper/index.html
HisLight
New member
PureX said:
I think if you had heard the mayor's sound clips from a radio interview last night you may reconsider this. Clearly he was frustrated to near the breaking point.
Mr Nagin has had much of his force abandon their posts. To say that he has limited resources is an enormous understatement. This morning there were police officers working to "defend" a police station.
There are outside agencies there working to rescue people. The word is getting out to people that the evacuation process is underway and they are coming out to leave. I realize that there are some that are not abulatory, trapped and unable to get to help, but it isn't any more likely that the police will find them before the coast guard will.
On the other hand, there have been no reinforcements sent in to maintain/restore law and order. With the limited manpower he has, he is choosing to have police focus on law and order and let the other agencies push the search and rescue efforts.
It isn't property over lives, it's order over anarchy.
Here are about 30 Katrina stories consolidated for your convenience.
http://www.glennbeck.com/page2/index.shtml
http://www.glennbeck.com/page2/index.shtml
PureX
Well-known member
What I'm seeing in new Orleans is what I believe to be an endemic problem being brought to light by extraordinary circumstances. As long as all these poor people were tucked away in their run-down neighborhoods, mostly praying on each other, and willing to accept the pittance we give them in leu of a real job (that we will not give them) then we could pretty much pretend that they don't exist, and that they don't resent our laws and our police and our white faces and our whole social structure for what we've been doing to them. We can spew platitudes about pulling ourselves up by the bootstraps and all that and we can ignore the fact that we wouldn't even let them have the boots. We ignore the fact that our whole government and social system in this country is intent on helping the "right people" get rich, and stay rich, while just placating and exploiting everyone else.wickwoman said:
Then something like this disaster comes, and strips away our pretty facade of freedom and justice and fairness, and we're forced to see what our system has really been doing to people, and what they have become as a result. And we REALLY don't want to be seeing this. We really don't want to see that the reason we have so much is because so many others have so little. And we really don't want to see that we're no more deserving of what we have then they are. So we do what we've always done. We hate them. We hate them for representing the fruits of our own greed. And we blame their suffering on them, so we can pretend it's not our fault. We even tell ourselves that it's good that they suffer, that it will teach them to be stonger and to become aggressive and greedy (we call it "hard-working") like us. But even when they do, we still don't like 'em. We still don't want them around. They still remind us of our own selfishness. This is especially true of people of color. Just their physical appearance reminds us of what an unfair advantage we've had, and how we don't really deserve to have so much more just because we're white.
The more we try to hide from what we've done to other people in this country and around the world through our greed, the more we want to eliminate them as the evidence against us. We hate the poor because we cause them. We hate the poor because they shove our greed and our guilt back in our faces just by their existing, and moreso by their suffering.
We hate those looters in New Orleans because we know that we helped create them. We know that they're stealing that stuff because they can't get any other way. And we hate them because we know that we're no better than they are. The only difference is that we get our loot by writing the laws and using them to our advantage, and to the disadvantage of the poor. And we hate them because we know that they know it.
I think it's good that America is finally getting to see it's own citizens wallowing in filth and greed and lawlessness. We usually keep this sort of thing pleasantly hidden behind corporate facades and locked away in "the projects". Thanks to a disasterous hurricane, our pretty facades have been stripped away, and we're seeing the reality of America. We're seeing the reality of our racism, and our greed, and love of violence.
Take a good look. I'm sure we'll be sweeping it under the rug just as soon as we can.
PureX
Well-known member
He should be. He was happily ignoring all these poor people and now the whole world is seeing what his city is really made of. Yeah, I bet he's frustrated. New Orleans has been projecting it's disneyland/marti-gras image to the tourists for years, and hiding all those poor people out of sight and out of the downtown and away from the mansions on St. Charles Ave. Now the jigs up, the facade's in ruins, and we're seeing the other side of a big american city.HisLight said:
I live in Chicago. You can't even imagine what would happen in this city if it's infrastructure were to collapse.
HisLight
New member
PureX said:
The mayor of New Orleans has done no more or less than any mayor of an urban city to deal with the poor. New Orleans was not prepared for this catastrophe. No city in America is.
I live in the area that was affected by the three day power outage here in the midwest. Due to some unusual circumstances I knew within moments of the outage that we had a major problem and not a local outage. People behaved like animals over gasoline. People panicked over water. That was a minor inconvenience compared to what the people from New Orleans to Mobile are dealing with. I truly cannot imagine, nor do I want to.
PureX
Well-known member
I'm not claiming that the mayor of New Orleans is any different from any other mayor in America. And if such a disaster struck any other cities or towns, here, the result would be much the same. That's my point. This is what America is. And I think it's good that we get a good look at it, because we're usually hiding this stuff behind the BS facade of freedom and justice and commerce and fair play and the illusion that we're so much better than this.HisLight said:
Gaviidae
New member
PureX said:
The looting does have to do with the snipers. And it isn't just the snipers but regular shooters as well that caused the problems.
1) The looters are stealing guns. Racks full of guns are being taken. That's how the police became overgunned.
2) The looters are creating a sense of lawlessness that incites riots and snipers.
3) The looters are doing actual shooting. Did you not hear about the cop that was shot in the head by looters?
The "looters" are not most people.
The police said that they are dealing with the same amount of criminals as they would be without the storm. However, in the first stages, the criminals that they usually dealt with took advantage of the situation. But as the flood waters poured in, they said people were taking food, not TVs.
They interviewed one policewoman. They asked about the looting, and she said, "What do you expect people to do? There are no people in the stores. They are no ATMS. There is no electricity. People are just taking what they can to live. People are taking food, not TVS. You call it looting. I call it survival."
They also pointed out that many stores had to give away food once they lost electricity, and that most stores were wiped out in terms of supplies.
The police said that they are dealing with the same amount of criminals as they would be without the storm. However, in the first stages, the criminals that they usually dealt with took advantage of the situation. But as the flood waters poured in, they said people were taking food, not TVs.
They interviewed one policewoman. They asked about the looting, and she said, "What do you expect people to do? There are no people in the stores. They are no ATMS. There is no electricity. People are just taking what they can to live. People are taking food, not TVS. You call it looting. I call it survival."
They also pointed out that many stores had to give away food once they lost electricity, and that most stores were wiped out in terms of supplies.
PureX
Well-known member
As of last night, there was no cop shot in the head. There was one cop with a self-inflicted accidental gunshot wound. I haven't seen the news today.Gaviidae said:
The situation has devolved into total anarchy, and looting is a minor aspect of the whole scenario. It will now take a massive show of force to restore order, I agree, and more people will die as a result. But it's all part of a whole. Everyone wants to single out looting, or the fact that the looters are mostly black, etc. But what you're seeing is the result of a whole set of causes that have been there all along. And you can even see these causes in the responses here on TOL, and in the responses of the mayor and the police.
I think we're so focussed on the looting and sniping because we really want to ignore all the other shocking realities that this situation is shoving in front of our faces.
servent101
New member
PureX
Your welcome to expand here a little - enlighten us please, if you will.
With Christ's Love
Servent101
Your welcome to expand here a little - enlighten us please, if you will.
With Christ's Love
Servent101