Jews And Gentiles Same Goal

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Then your search was incorrect. You stated you were listing instances for "preach" which is an English word. If you are going to start an argument that depends on splitting hairs, you had best make sure you are at least accurate with your hair-splitting.
Boo hoo.

AGAIN (for the apparently deaf) the POINT was that they (communicate and preach) are NOT the same thing.

Your allegation that Jerusalem was preaching "another gospel" needs substantiation, whereas you seem to be simply content to proceed on that assumption. Paul said that Peter was to be blamed, not because he had a different gospel, but because he was not being consistent in his behavior depending on whom he was with. Christians always have need for communication, that's what those that fear the LORD do, see Malachi 3:16.
I can see that it is impossible to cure your confusion.

Peter was not preaching another gospel UNTO THEM that Paul is addressing. Read the text for what is says and not what your preconceived idea requires.

No, you are content to simply assume and you and others here keep throwing little two-bit jabs without substance. "So you say, but you are incorrect" is NOT "substantiation!" It's a meaningless retort devoid of sincere communication.
:juggle:

Please state what you are disputing. That the gospel of God (of Jesus, his Son, peace, grace, the Kingdom, etc) has identical means or identical ends? The means is faith and belief in God unto repentance through the Son of God, Jesus Christ. The end is eternal life.
The gospel of the kingdom is not primarily about eternal life, it is about.... wait for it.... the KINGDOM.

There are many things that would be good news. It was good news when Peter was set free from prison, but the scriptures never simply refers to "news that is good" as "the gospel." You know that is not the meaning of the term. "The gospel" is salvation unto eternal life.
So you say..... there are MANY gospels in the Bible.... fight it all that you want. You lose.
 
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Squeaky

BANNED
Banned
He disavows logic and reason. That says it all. :dizzy:

I said
That is what God says to do. You will never know the Holy Spirit until you discard your carnal reason and logic.


REASON & LOGIC OR VERSES
2 Cor 11:6
6 Even though I am untrained in speech, yet I am not in knowledge. But we have been thoroughly manifested among you in all things.
Eph 3:3-5
3 how that by revelation He made known to me the mystery (as I have briefly written already,
4 by which, when you read, you may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ),
5 which in other ages was not made known to the sons of men, as it has now been revealed by the Spirit to His holy apostles and prophets:
Gal 1:6-7
6 I marvel that you are turning away so soon from Him who called you in the grace of Christ, to a different gospel,
7 which is not another; but there are some who trouble you and want to pervert the gospel of Christ.
2 Pet 2:18-20
18 For when they speak great swelling words of emptiness, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through lewdness, the ones who have actually escaped from those who live in error.
19 While they promise them liberty, they themselves are slaves of corruption; for by whom a person is overcome, by him also he is brought into bondage.
20 For if, after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the latter end is worse for them than the beginning
2 Pet 3:15-16
15 and account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation-- as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you,
16 as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.
Gal 1:10-12
10 For do I now persuade men, or God? Or do I seek to please men? For if I still pleased men, I would not be a bondservant of Christ.
11 But I make known to you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached by me is not according to man.
12 For I neither received it from man, nor was I taught it, but it came through the revelation of Jesus Christ.
I Jn 2:27-29
27 But the anointing which you have received from Him abides in you, and you do not need that anyone teach you; but as the same anointing teaches you concerning all things, and is true, and is not a lie, and just as it has taught you, you will abide in Him.
28 And now, little children, abide in Him, that when He appears, we may have confidence and not be ashamed before Him at His coming.
29 If you know that He is righteous, you know that everyone who practices righteousness is born of Him.
Phil 2:12
12 Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling;
Rom 12:2
2 And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God.
John 6:29
29 Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He sent."
2 Cor 13:5
5 Examine yourselves as to whether you are in the faith. Test yourselves. Do you not know yourselves, that Jesus Christ is in you?-- unless indeed you are disqualified.
(NKJ)
xxx Mans reasoning and logic is what keeps people from just believing the Word of God. Think about when you were a kid, how you could believe in Santa, or the tooth fairy, or the easter bunny. The ability to believe something has always been there. But as you grew up, you were programed to rely on mans logic. But what does the Word say:

Mark 1:14-15
14 Now after John was put in prison, Jesus came to Galilee, preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God,
15 and saying, "The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand. Repent, and believe in the gospel."
(NKJ)

xxx Many start out looking for reasons to believe the gospel. The only reason someone would do that is because of their carnal reasoning and logic. Think about this. When you were growing up, did you need a reason to believe your teachers at school? Did you need a reason to believe your parents? Did you need a reason to believe the light would come on when you fliped the light switch? Did you need a reason to get dressed? Did you need a reason to eat? Did you need a reason to breath?
But you need a reason to believe the bible, Gods Word. You start out with the bible full of doubts, and you submit to them doubts. When the first step to the bible is repent and believe in the gospel. If you take the first step wrong, all the rest are going to be wrong also. If you try to retain your human wisdom and logic you will always fall short of the truth. The devil is always there has been. Its only because of him that you cant just believe the Word the way it is written. And the Word teaches to purge out your human wisdom.
What greater test could God have than to ask you to believe something exists that doesnt exist. And to do it by faith. Faith in Gods Word that it is all true. Because only then will you see it work as it says it will work.

Rom 4:17-18
17 (as it is written, "I have made you a father of many nations") in the presence of Him whom he believed-- God, who gives life to the dead and calls those things which do not exist as though they did;
18 who, contrary to hope, in hope believed, so that he became the father of many nations, according to what was spoken, "So shall your descendants be."
(NKJ)


2 Sam 6:6-8
6 And when they came to Nachon's threshing floor, Uzzah put out his hand to the ark of God and took hold of it, for the oxen stumbled.
7 Then the anger of the LORD was aroused against Uzzah, and God struck him there for his error; and he died there by the ark of God.
8 And David became angry because of the LORD'S outbreak against Uzzah; and he called the name of the place Perez Uzzah to this day.
(NKJ)
 

Squeaky

BANNED
Banned
Boo hoo.
AGAIN (for the apparently deaf) the POINT was that they (communicate and preach) are NOT the same thing.
I can see that it is impossible to cure your confusion.
Peter was not preaching another gospel UNTO THEM that Paul is addressing. Read the text for what is says and not what your preconceived idea require.
:juggle:

texttablePlease state what you are disputing. That the gospel of God (of Jesus, his Son, peace, grace, the Kingdom, etc) has identical means or identical ends? The means is faith and belief in God unto repentance through the Son of God, Jesus Christ. The end is eternal life.
The gospel of the kingdom is not primarily about eternal life, it is about.... wait for it.... the KINGDOM.
So you say..... there are MANY gospels in the Bible.... fight it all that you want. You lose.[/QUOTE]


I said
SCRIPTURE IS ALREADY OUT OF CONTEXT(YOU NEED THE HOLY SPIRIT TO PUT IT RIGHT)(HE WILL ONLY QUOTE VERSES)


John 16:25
25 "These things I have spoken to you in figurative language; but the time is coming when I will no longer speak to you in figurative language, but I will tell you plainly about the Father
John 16:29
29 His disciples said to Him, "See, now You are speaking plainly, and using no figure of speech!
John 12:49
49 "For I have not spoken on My own authority; but the Father who sent Me gave Me a command, what I should say and what I should speak.
Matt 13:34
34 All these things Jesus spoke to the multitude in parables; and without a parable He did not speak to them,
Matt 13:9-11
9 "He who has ears to hear, let him hear!"
10 And the disciples came and said to Him, "Why do You speak to them in parables?"
11 He answered and said to them, "Because it has been given to you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it has not been given.
John 16:12
12 "I still have many things to say to you, but you cannot bear them now.
2 Tim 2:19
19 Nevertheless the solid foundation of God stands, having this seal: "The Lord knows those who are His," and, "Let everyone who names the name of Christ depart from iniquity."
1 Cor 3:1-2
1 And I, brethren, could not speak to you as to spiritual people but as to carnal, as to babes in Christ.
2 I fed you with milk and not with solid food; for until now you were not able to receive it, and even now you are still not able;
Heb 5:12-14
12 For though by this time you ought to be teachers, you need someone to teach you again the first principles of the oracles of God; and you have come to need milk and not solid food.
13 For everyone who partakes only of milk is unskilled in the word of righteousness, for he is a babe.
14 But solid food belongs to those who are of full age, that is, those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.
2 Cor 5:5
5 Now He who has prepared us for this very thing is God, who also has given us the Spirit as a guarantee.
John 14:26
26 "But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you.
John 8:43
43 "Why do you not understand My speech? Because you are not able to listen to My word.
Mark 4:13-15
13 And He said to them, "Do you not understand this parable? How then will you understand all the parables?
14 "The sower sows the word.
15 "And these are the ones by the wayside where the word is sown. When they hear, Satan comes immediately and takes away the word that was sown in their hearts.
Mark 4:18-19
18 "Now these are the ones sown among thorns; they are the ones who hear the word,
19 "and the cares of this world, the deceitfulness of riches, and the desires for other things entering in choke the word, and it becomes unfruitful.
1 Cor 2:13
13 These things we also speak, not in words which man's wisdom teaches but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
2 Cor 3:5-6
5 Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think of anything as being from ourselves, but our sufficiency is from God,
6 who also made us sufficient as ministers of the new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.
1 Cor 2:7
7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, the hidden wisdom which God ordained before the ages for our glory,
1 Cor 1:18-19
18 For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.
19 For it is written: "I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent."
1 Cor 1:21
21 For since, in the wisdom of God, the world through wisdom did not know God, it pleased God through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe.
2 Pet 3:16
16 as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.
(NKJ)
xxx The bible is already out of context. What the bible says is that everything Jesus spoke He spoke in parables. And everything Paul spoke he spoke the milk understanding. But they both said to find the Holy Spirit and learn from Him. And the Holy Spirit only quotes verses in the meat. There is a milk understanding and there is a meat understanding. The meat is only verses. Your receive the gifts of the Spirit in the milk, but to go into the meat you have to follow the verses(Holy Spirit).


2 Tim 3:12
12 Yes, and all who desire to live godly in Christ Jesus will suffer persecution.
(NKJ)

2 Tim 3:14-15
14 But you must continue in the things which you have learned and been assured of, knowing from whom you have learned them,
15 and that from childhood you have known the Holy Scriptures, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
(NKJ)

see also the revelations of Jesus Christ, and the hidden language of the Holy Spirit
 

Rosenritter

New member
Boo hoo.

AGAIN (for the apparently deaf) the POINT was that they (communicate and preach) are NOT the same thing.

Your question was why would someone preach a second time in the same city. Your objection was my response that the answer was obvious, and my analogy that I would attempt to communicate many times in order to convey the same important message. Whether you were intentionally trying to create a diversion or whether you just got caught up in a reflex response of disagreement, would you be willing to set aside such red herring arguments for the purpose of focus?

The gospel of the kingdom is not primarily about eternal life, it is about.... wait for it.... the KINGDOM.

Just a moment here Mr. Ambiguous.

I asked you for clear clarification to state what you were disputing, and you provided nothing of substance. Instead you begrudgingly agreed that the Gospel (of the Kingdom, of Jesus Christ, of his Dear Son, of Peace, of whichever name) is unto eternal life. So in response to my statement that the Gospel has identical means and identical ends, you just agreed to the end. Do you object to the means unto eternal life?
Spoiler
Because emphasis on one portion of the gospel or another does not a different gospel make. If I have news that a brown DOG has entered the building, it is not a different news that a BROWN dog entered the building. But that seems to be the substance of your argument.

I have been continually asking for constructive answers. Could you please attempt to answer the questions without evasion?
 

Rosenritter

New member
No, it was not. I never asked any such thing.

Please QUOTE me asking that.

I asked why Paul would need "to communicate to THEM THAT gospel that I preach among the gentiles" if there is only ONE gospel and they were ALL ALREADY preaching it.

Clarifying, you asked why Paul would need to communicate the gospel to those that were preaching that gospel. The answer was very simple: sometimes people don't get it all the first time, sometimes you go over different aspects, any number of valid reasons. Your contention that this single passage was proof and evidence that they were preaching different gospels was unwarranted. May we leave off of this now?
 

Right Divider

Body part
Your question was why would someone preach a second time in the same city.

Clarifying, you asked why Paul would need to communicate the gospel to those that were preaching that gospel.
Notice these are two completely different things.

(I guess this makes sense, since you cannot understand things that differ).

Paul was communicating THAT GOSPEL that he preached among the gentiles to the leadership in Jerusalem.

For the millionth time in these forums, if they were all preaching the SAME gospel.... there would be NO NEED to communicate the SAME THING.

The answer was very simple: sometimes people don't get it all the first time, sometimes you go over different aspects, any number of valid reasons. Your contention that this single passage was proof and evidence that they were preaching different gospels was unwarranted. May we leave off of this now?
:yawn:
 
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Rosenritter

New member
For the millionth time in these forums, is they were all preaching the SAME gospel.... there would be NO NEED to communicate the SAME THING.
:yawn:

Your assumption fails the real world relevance test. The reality is that many people communicate the same thing all the time, whether it be by repetition or variation or reminder, at different times, venues, or targeted individuals.
 

Right Divider

Body part
Your assumption fails the real world relevance test.
Baloney.

The reality is that many people communicate the same thing all the time, whether it be by repetition or variation or reminder, at different times, venues, or targeted individuals.
PAUL did not need to communicate THAT GOSPEL that he preached among the gentiles to the leadership in Jerusalem if they were all preaching the SAME GOSPEL.

It's so simple that even a child can understand it.
 

Rosenritter

New member
Baloney.

PAUL did not need to communicate THAT GOSPEL that he preached among the gentiles to the leadership in Jerusalem if they were all preaching the SAME GOSPEL.

It's so simple that even a child can understand it.

Wow, Baloney. I can see that you Holy Spirit has gifted you with the art of language. You have outstanding questions which you are not answering, that are attempting to get to the heart of this matter, and you waste your time making sandwiches? You spend far too much effort EVADING for me to be able to presume your sincerity.
 

Right Divider

Body part
Wow, Baloney. I can see that you Holy Spirit has gifted you with the art of language.
You're easily offended.

You have outstanding questions which you are not answering, that are attempting to get to the heart of this matter, and you waste your time making sandwiches? You spend far too much effort EVADING for me to be able to presume your sincerity.
You presume and assume many things.... all falsely.
 

glorydaz

Well-known member
Your assumption fails the real world relevance test. The reality is that many people communicate the same thing all the time, whether it be by repetition or variation or reminder, at different times, venues, or targeted individuals.

Is it really so difficult to admit you're wrong? It's really quite a trivial point, and RD has explained it up one side and down the other.
 

Rosenritter

New member
Is it really so difficult to admit you're wrong? It's really quite a trivial point, and RD has explained it up one side and down the other.

RD is acting like he has been dropped on his head once too many times. Preaching by necessity communicates (in spite of his objections) and the gospel has had many different people communicating to each other all over the world back and forth as to its elements and applications. Someone going up to talk to another is no proof of a "different" gospel.
 
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