Jesus is God

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Mose claimed the attributes of God/being God... yet you speak not of Moses! Even Jesus never made such a bold statement as Moses.... Yet you deny his being God :think:

Why, because your tradition of men don't want you to believe, so you see Moses' words for what they are... Yet when applied to Jesus... your traditions of men blind you!

In Deuteronomy 29. Moses summons all of Israel and says to them, "You have seen all that the Lord did before your eyes in the land of Egypt to Pharaoh and all his servants and all his land; the great trials which your eyes have seen, those great signs and wonders" (v.2-3).

Moses continues to recite for the people all that God has done for them. But notice that in verse 6, while still reciting all God's wonders, Moses suddenly changes to the first person and says, "You have not eaten bread, nor have you drunk wine or strong drink, in order that you might know that I am the LORD your God." It is obvious that God himself is not personally speaking to the people. Moses is preaching. But Moses as the agent of God can speak as though he is the Lord himself. God is speaking through His man, His appointed representative. Therefore, Moses can move from speaking in the third person, “the LORD did this and that for you" to the first person: "I am the LORD your God doing this and that."

If Jesus ever spoke like Moses in Deuteronomy 29... You would freak out claiming total proof Jesus is God, yet you ignore Moses'... why would that be? Tradition?

Jesus does not claim to be God... but preaches and teaches ABOUT His GOD!!! :doh:

oly::sherlock:
Paul

Jesus is both, the Son of God, and God the Son! There are three.
God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit. Yet, they
are one! The BEST analogy for man to come up with, isn't good
enough! It is, what it is!

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

I am not denying his deity. But lets define deity. God, godlike, holy, Devine a god?

Christ is a form of God but he is not God. Your false trinity has made him God. That breaks the commandments of God. You completely ignore the words of your Lord in John 17:3.

The son is the express image of his creator, there was a time that he did not exist. The creator was alone. The creator is the only non creature. Christ is firstborn of all creatures. Nothing you posted says Jesus Christ is God. There is no scriptural proof of a three piece God. The trinity is a man made fable.

Complete and utter "Baloney!" False Doctrine at its finest!

 

[keypurr]

You sure like to put your efforts into "proving" that Christ
has NO Deity! You're truly, "warped!" You're in the 'Winter"
of your life and still have NO concept of who and what, Christ
represents! A life of study, down the drain!

Do you not understand English?

He is a FORM of God, not God. He told you his Father is the only true God, dispute it with him.

 

[keypurr]

Jesus is God

Complete and utter "Baloney!" False Doctrine at its finest!

Phil chapter 2. Dispute it with Paul.

No one listens to you GM.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Do you not understand English?

He is a FORM of God, not God. He told you his Father is the only true God, dispute it with him.

It's YOUR "nutty" ideas I have a problem with!

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Phil chapter 2. Dispute it with Paul.

No one listens to you GM.

You mean they'd rather listen to your "theory" that, Christ
and Jesus are two totally different 'entities?' You also
believe that "Jesus" is/was a "created being" and hasn't
"always" been! I'd rather listen to myself! After all, you're
a little bit of a "goof!"

 

[keypurr]

You mean they'd rather listen to your "theory" that, Christ
and Jesus are two totally different 'entities?' You also
believe that "Jesus" is/was a "created being" and hasn't
"always" been! I'd rather listen to myself! After all, you're
a little bit of a "goof!"

You do not have any logic GM. If Christ is the express IMAGE of God he is a creation.

Name ANY IMAGE that is NOT a creation.
Name any human that is not a creation.

Christ is firstborn of all CREATURES. Col 1:15, Heb 1:3. Christ a a created spiritual form of the Father. That seems to be to much for you to digest.

 

[beloved57]

Read John 17:3. The Father is the ONLY TRUE GOD, these are the words of your Lord.
Why do you not believe them? Whois the boss of your life? God or your church?
A churchman is one thing a true Christian is something different.

Christ said that his Father is the only true God that is good enough for me. I will follow the Lord to please his Father.

That scripture doesnt say Jesus is not God !

 

[Pierac]

jesus doesn't have to claim to be God. he is God, with God before the foundations of creation. it is the only way God could save mankind from sin and death, you must read and understand the epistles of Paul. scripture is not meant to be analyzed verse by verse. true understanding actually takes a lifetime and will still not be attained, God defeated death, sin, as Jesus, a man. through one man sin entered the world. through one man it was defeated.if you want a God you completely understand then create your own. everyone else does. the problem is that the Bible was compiled by men. how can we believe any of it ?

jg

Did you really just post this...

Your new! So you get a pass from the Anti-Trinitarian here on TOL!

So... when you say scripture is not meant to be analyzed verse by verse... You do realize Chapters and Verses in your version of scripture was added by man in the late 5th or 6th century!!! Thus never existed before that time! :think:

So... Do you want the truth or the traditions of men?

Pick some form of scripture that you think... says what supports your tradition of men... Then I will show you the truth! :readthis:

oly::sherlock:
Paul

 

[Pierac]

Jesus is both, the Son of God, and God the Son! There are three.
God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit. Yet, they
are one! The BEST analogy for man to come up with, isn't good enough! It is, what it is!

Yet the BEST analogy for man to come up with... fails to agree with scripture??? TRY to actually read Scripture...

Deu 4:35 "To you it was shown that you might know that the LORD, He is God; there is no other besides Him….39 "Know therefore today, and take it to your heart, that the LORD, He is God in heaven above and on the earth below; there is no other.

Deu 32:39 'See now that I, I am He, And there is no god besides Me;

Isa 44:6 "Thus says the LORD, the King of Israel and his Redeemer, the LORD of hosts: 'I am the first and I am the last, And there is no God besides Me.

The New Testament clearly states Jesus has a God and Father, both before and after his resurrection. We know the Bible does not contradict.

(John 8:40) "But as it is, you are seeking to kill Me, a man who has told you the truth, which I heard from God; this Abraham did not do.

Rev 1:1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave Him

Act 2:22 "Men of Israel, listen to these words: Jesus the Nazarene, a man attested to you by God with miracles and wonders and signs which God performed through Him in your midst, just as you yourselves know--


Grosnick Marowbe, your a child trying to understand adult spiritual things! But you will never understand as long as you still follow men in such spiritual understandings... I'm not insulting you... I'm simply showing you how your traditions of men contradict with ALL the scripture above!!! :readthis:

YOU can not be GOD and then claim to HAVE ONE!
oly::sherlock:
Paul

 

[Bright Raven]

Yet the BEST analogy for man to come up with... fails to agree with scripture??? TRY to actually read Scripture...

Deu 4:35 "To you it was shown that you might know that the LORD, He is God; there is no other besides Him….39 "Know therefore today, and take it to your heart, that the LORD, He is God in heaven above and on the earth below; there is no other.

Deu 32:39 'See now that I, I am He, And there is no god besides Me;

Isa 44:6 "Thus says the LORD, the King of Israel and his Redeemer, the LORD of hosts: 'I am the first and I am the last, And there is no God besides Me.

The New Testament clearly states Jesus has a God and Father, both before and after his resurrection. We know the Bible does not contradict.

(John 8:40) "But as it is, you are seeking to kill Me, a man who has told you the truth, which I heard from God; this Abraham did not do.

Rev 1:1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave Him

Act 2:22 "Men of Israel, listen to these words: Jesus the Nazarene, a man attested to you by God with miracles and wonders and signs which God performed through Him in your midst, just as you yourselves know--


Grosnick Marowbe, your a child trying to understand adult spiritual things! But you will never understand as long as you still follow men in such spiritual understandings... I'm not insulting you... I'm simply showing you how your traditions of men contradict with ALL the scripture above!!! :readthis:

YOU can not be GOD and then claim to HAVE ONE!
oly::sherlock:
Paul

Isaiah 43:11 King James Version (KJV)

11 I, even I, am the Lord; and beside me there is no saviour.



Luke 2:11 King James Version (KJV)

11 For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.

 

[Omniskeptical]

Isaiah 43:11 King James Version (KJV)

11 I, even I, am the Lord; and beside me there is no saviour.



Luke 2:11 King James Version (KJV)

11 For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.

Actually the preposition for beside in Hebrew according to the BLB, bil`adey tends to mean beyond, past, without. I suspect the Jews prefer this over "... and beyond me, there is no savior."

I suspect those verses are useless. Even Caesars and heroes were called saviors.

 

[Pierac]

Isaiah 43:11 King James Version (KJV)

11 I, even I, am the Lord; and beside me there is no saviour.



Luke 2:11 King James Version (KJV)

11 For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.

Again, your seeing as a child. You do not understand who's actually doing the saving!

Mar 2:5 And Jesus seeing their faith *said to the paralytic, "Son, your sins are forgiven."

When Jesus pronounced the man forgiven/healed, the Pharisees say that Jesus is "blaspheming" because he is claiming to be God. But a little careful attention to detail will show that Jesus is not claiming deity. He is rather claiming "authority." He says, "But that you may know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins…" (v.10). The parallel account in Matthew's report is that once the people saw Jesus healed a paralytic, "they were filled with awe, and glorified God, who had given such authority to men" ( Matt 9:8).

We note that Jesus is claiming to be "the Son of Man," that is, the human Messiah, with a God given right to pronounce forgiveness.

Not too much later Jesus invested other men-his apostles-with the same authority to forgive sins: "If you forgive the sins of any, their sins have been forgiven them; he to retain the sins of any, they have been retained" (John 20:23). If only God can forgive sins, then God and Jesus and the apostles are all God! :think:

The prophets predicted a human being who would under God's anointing Spirit rescue us.

You read Jesus out of the Prophets and straight into Plato!

oly::sherlock:
Paul

 

[Bright Raven]

Again, your seeing as a child. You do not understand who's actually doing the saving!

Mar 2:5 And Jesus seeing their faith *said to the paralytic, "Son, your sins are forgiven."

When Jesus pronounced the man forgiven/healed, the Pharisees say that Jesus is "blaspheming" because he is claiming to be God. But a little careful attention to detail will show that Jesus is not claiming deity. He is rather claiming "authority." He says, "But that you may know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins…" (v.10). The parallel account in Matthew's report is that once the people saw Jesus healed a paralytic, "they were filled with awe, and glorified God, who had given such authority to men" ( Matt 9:8).

We note that Jesus is claiming to be "the Son of Man," that is, the human Messiah, with a God given right to pronounce forgiveness.

Not too much later Jesus invested other men-his apostles-with the same authority to forgive sins: "If you forgive the sins of any, their sins have been forgiven them; he to retain the sins of any, they have been retained" (John 20:23). If only God can forgive sins, then God and Jesus and the apostles are all God! :think:

The prophets predicted a human being who would under God's anointing Spirit rescue us.

You read Jesus out of the Prophets and straight into Plato!

oly::sherlock:
Paul

Who is this human Messiah? Or for that matter, who is Messiah? You and I can forgive the sins of others. Don't we have to take the matter in the context in which it is given? Are you saying that the Apostles are Gods because Jesus gave the power. I believe that is slightly out of context. Jesus is that one who would be under God's anointing. No matter how you put it you Can Not prove that Jesus the Messiah, the anointed one is not God. The entirety of the Gospel of John was written for that purpose, that "these things are written that ye may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name." John clearly shows who Jesus is. He alone is the only begotten Son of God. You don't have to believe it but one day you will have to acknowledge it. And in that day you knowledge and worldly wisdom will be of no avail.

 

[Aimiel]

Isaiah 43:11 King James Version (KJV)

11 I, even I, am the Lord; and beside me there is no saviour.



Luke 2:11 King James Version (KJV)

11 For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.

Nailed it!!! :thumb:

 

[Lazy afternoon]

Yet the BEST analogy for man to come up with... fails to agree with scripture??? TRY to actually read Scripture...

Deu 4:35 "To you it was shown that you might know that the LORD, He is God; there is no other besides Him….39 "Know therefore today, and take it to your heart, that the LORD, He is God in heaven above and on the earth below; there is no other.

Deu 32:39 'See now that I, I am He, And there is no god besides Me;

Isa 44:6 "Thus says the LORD, the King of Israel and his Redeemer, the LORD of hosts: 'I am the first and I am the last, And there is no God besides Me.

The New Testament clearly states Jesus has a God and Father, both before and after his resurrection. We know the Bible does not contradict.

(John 8:40) "But as it is, you are seeking to kill Me, a man who has told you the truth, which I heard from God; this Abraham did not do.

Rev 1:1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave Him

Act 2:22 "Men of Israel, listen to these words: Jesus the Nazarene, a man attested to you by God with miracles and wonders and signs which God performed through Him in your midst, just as you yourselves know--


Grosnick Marowbe, your a child trying to understand adult spiritual things! But you will never understand as long as you still follow men in such spiritual understandings... I'm not insulting you... I'm simply showing you how your traditions of men contradict with ALL the scripture above!!! :readthis:

YOU can not be GOD and then claim to HAVE ONE!
oly::sherlock:
Paul

Corrrection.

Grosnick is not a Christian at all.

He is a dyed in the wool religionist who only learns from man.

LA

 

[Lazy afternoon]

Who is this human Messiah? Or for that matter, who is Messiah? You and I can forgive the sins of others. Don't we have to take the matter in the context in which it is given? Are you saying that the Apostles are Gods because Jesus gave the power. I believe that is slightly out of context. Jesus is that one who would be under God's anointing. No matter how you put it you Can Not prove that Jesus the Messiah, the anointed one is not God. The entirety of the Gospel of John was written for that purpose, that "these things are written that ye may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name." John clearly shows who Jesus is. He alone is the only begotten Son of God. You don't have to believe it but one day you will have to acknowledge it. And in that day you knowledge and worldly wisdom will be of no avail.

Yes Jesus is the son of God.

Why add to it?

LA

 

[Aimiel]

Because The Lamb of God slain from the foundation of the world has no beginning and no end. He is the glue that holds the universe together. He created everything there is and we have eternal life in Him.

 

[keypurr]

Who is this human Messiah? Or for that matter, who is Messiah? You and I can forgive the sins of others. Don't we have to take the matter in the context in which it is given? Are you saying that the Apostles are Gods because Jesus gave the power. I believe that is slightly out of context. Jesus is that one who would be under God's anointing. No matter how you put it you Can Not prove that Jesus the Messiah, the anointed one is not God. The entirety of the Gospel of John was written for that purpose, that "these things are written that ye may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name." John clearly shows who Jesus is. He alone is the only begotten Son of God. You don't have to believe it but one day you will have to acknowledge it. And in that day you knowledge and worldly wisdom will be of no avail.

The anointed is not the anointor BR.
God does not need anointing.

 

[keypurr]

Because The Lamb of God slain from the foundation of the world has no beginning and no end. He is the glue that holds the universe together. He created everything there is and we have eternal life in Him.

Wrong Aimiel, every image has a beginning.
Heb 1:3, Col 1:15. Tell us that Christ is an express image of the father.