Is White Privilege Real?

[ok doser]

Police kill more whites than blacks, but minority deaths generate more outrage
Analysis contradicts widespread views about racial targets

finally!

a "white privilege" we can all agree on


white criminals getting shot by police :thumb:


"you have the right to remain silent. if you are white, you have the privilege of being shot 1.7 times more than if you were black"

 

[Crucible]

Rather, that is where you pretend to be ignorant and look even more so.

From the woman widely credited with establishing the phrase as a point of serious consideration, Peggy McIntosh, I present a selection of things she considered distinguished her experience and expectations from those of her friends who were of a different color.

"Daily effects of white privilege I decided to try to work on myself at least by identifying some of the daily effects of white privilege in my life. I have chosen those conditions that I think in my case attach somewhat more to skin-color privilege than to class, religion, ethnic status, or geographic location, though of course all these other factors are intricately intertwined. As far as I can tell, my African American coworkers, friends, and acquaintances with whom I come into daily or frequent contact in this particular time, place and time of work cannot count on most of these conditions:"

I can avoid spending time with people whom I was trained to mistrust and who have learned to mistrust my kind or me.

If I should need to move, I can be pretty sure of renting or purchasing housing in an area which I can afford and in which I would want to live.

I can be pretty sure that my neighbors in such a location will be neutral or pleasant to me.

I can turn on the television or open to the front page of the paper and see people of my race widely represented.

When I am told about our national heritage or about "civilization," I am shown that people of my color made it what it is.

I do not have to educate my children to be aware of systemic racism for their own daily physical protection.

I can talk with my mouth full and not have people put this down to my color.

I can swear, or dress in second hand clothes, or not answer letters, without having people attribute these choices to the bad morals, the poverty or the illiteracy of my race.

I can speak in public to a powerful male group without putting my race on trial.

I can do well in a challenging situation without being called a credit to my race.

I am never asked to speak for all the people of my racial group.

I can criticize our government and talk about how much I fear its policies and behavior without being seen as a cultural outsider.

I can be pretty sure that if I ask to talk to the "person in charge", I will be facing a person of my race.

If a traffic cop pulls me over or if the IRS audits my tax return, I can be sure I haven't been singled out because of my race.

I can easily buy posters, post-cards, picture books, greeting cards, dolls, toys and children's magazines featuring people of my race.

I can go home from most meetings of organizations I belong to feeling somewhat tied in, rather than isolated, out-of-place, outnumbered, unheard, held at a distance or feared.

If I declare there is a racial issue at hand, or there isn't a racial issue at hand, my race will lend me more credibility for either position than a person of color will have.

My culture gives me little fear about ignoring the perspectives and powers of people of other races.

I can worry about racism without being seen as self-interested or self-seeking.

I can arrange my activities so that I will never have to experience feelings of rejection owing to my race.

I can easily find academic courses and institutions which give attention only to people of my race.

I can expect figurative language and imagery in all of the arts to testify to experiences of my race.

I can travel alone or with my spouse without expecting embarrassment or hostility in those who deal with us.

I will feel welcomed and "normal" in the usual walks of public life, institutional and social.

Do you know the difference between an 'imagination' and 'an acknowledgement of reality'?

Because nothing in your list is a reality- it is illegal, just like it's illegal to pay women less for the same work, for a person to get turned down for anything because they are black.

It simply doesn't happen.
And
We're tired of this paranoia being labeled as some 'fact' or that I'm just a spoiled, privileged person :AMR:

It's just a way to keep white mouths closed, so you all can continue to shout your dead platitudes from coast to coast.

The only privilege I have as white person is to be thrown under the bus by everybody, white or black, yellow, or red- those as yourself are just suckered into burning the feathers of your own flock.

That's the downfall of white people, and will continue to be so long as you follow the same narrative. Black people are their own enemies, hombre.

 

[Lon]

Hi Lon,

Never in my lifetime have I seen so many fragile white people insulting other peoples sensitivities, as I have in the last couple of years. It's really quite startling to see so many white people indulging in so much self-pity.

It is the aftermath of affirmative action, imho. Given two people, corporations often HAVE to hire the mediocre rather than the exceptional. Reason? Nothing but their skin color. Your and my skin color have nothing to do with 'exceptional.' The person who discriminates against the color of skin and the person who demands exception based on skin are both focusing on incidentals. Neither should do it. We assumed affirmative action had that goal in mind. It doesn't. Some people believe affirmative action needs to go away. I simply believe it needs to go back to the original goal: Skin is merely the wrapping. What is inside and capable, is what counts in Democracy. Racism imho, is less today BUT I live in an area where there is a great melting pot. Perhaps our particular politics are shaped by our location to some degree. Again, politics isn't my forte' These are just observations. I just don't think your skin color comes into my democratic needs. I know the 'Law' disagrees, but I'm saying the law is socialist and communist at that point. It is against Democracy as far as I can evaluate it. A society that is skin-colorless isn't a reality, but I think the bigots and non-exceptional should be left to fend for themselves. I realize my location may drive such sentiment. I'd like to think there are just owners and bosses that want to have the best workers rather than worrying about bigotry. It seems anti-profitable to me.

I'm not accusing you of that. But I'm wondering if you've noticed it.

Relatedly, there was another terrorist attack stopped today. Check it out (although, warning, the language quoted is quite vulgar):

http://www.live5news.com/story/3452...-the-spirit-of-dylann-roof?clienttype=generic

I think Obama was a president for the minority and focused very little on the masses. He didn't care about serving the whole country imho. Trump clearly is the sign that the vast majority of the people of the US have been ignored. We need to rethink media shaping the US rather than reflecting it. They don't reflect the majority of the US for values BUT a good portion of the majority are moving that way: entertainers shaping America by virtue of nothing but grabbing kids attention. They have no study or expertise, but love the worship. Most of that industry, including news 'entertainers' (owned by studios), are liberal nonChristians. Odd given that 70% of our country is Christian? :think: When I was younger, churches encouraged their parishioners to abstain from TV and movies. They didn't, not after awhile anyway. I think the internet helps, even with misinformation. I didn't vote for Trump, but these are some of his sentiments as well. I've had them before I ever knew of Trump so I think there is some precedence for these observations. At any rate, I'm trying to give perspective for what I think is happening in society that I 'think' is accurate social commentary. As I continue: I'm not a political officiate of any kind. I'm not sure my opinions or thoughts are worth much other than perhaps expressing some ruminations I may share with others. Re newsfeed: I've seen racism in the South and Midwest. I went to an all-black church once while working in Texas as a foreman. They asked me to leave because of the racism that would lead to bigoted criminality. As I said before, any anti-discriminatory law needs to be written carefully to avoid favoring one race over another. I think the legals 'tried' but just haven't gotten it yet. We have to have legislation that is Democratic, not socialist or communist (again I'm not someone to pay attention to without the no-politician caveat) -Lon

 

[ok doser]

Rather.....

Wisconsin students group demands free tuition for black students



Would this be considered a privilege?

 

[Angel4Truth]

So excelling is a privilege?

Yall don't even know what the word actually means.

Is "Angel4Truth" arguing that "whites" in America have excelled because they are inherently superior to other
"so-called" races?

yeah, thats totally what i said. You should get a job at CNN, or the New York Times!

 

[Angel4Truth]

These people you perceive as 'racist' are mostly just people who have gotten tired of the bullcrap.

Because black people kill us twice as much as we kill them, and yet they demanded that we adhere to their 'Black Lives Matter' thing- we were called racist for stating 'All Lives Matter'.
You see, because with liberals, white lives matter less.

White people are under attack and are called racist if they stand up for their selves- and they are tired of it- and you're shouts of racism and bigotry is losing it's influence one day at a time :wave2:

:Applause:

 

[Town Heretic]

Do you know the difference between an 'imagination' and 'an acknowledgement of reality'?

Sure. Setting out evidence would illustrate the latter. Listening to your "analysis" would constitute the former.

Because nothing in your list is a reality

It's not my list. It included a number of things from the author's longer list. Some of them were dated. Some aren't the problem they were twenty years ago. Many remain true.

It simply doesn't happen.

It? Discrimination happens all the time. Race baiting happens all the time. Minorities being singled out for abuse and treatment related to their race happens all the time. Not long ago a Dairy Queen closed down after the manager went on an N-bomb tirade with a mother who had a problem with a botched drive thru order. The police came. He used the same language to them about her. Then he tried to back peddle and corporate shot him down.

I've witnessed incidents like that in my life, in well educated and affluent circles. People speaking by degree as ignorantly as any hayseed with a sheet over his head...Once, in law school I was going through a fast food drive-thru late at night when I noticed a car full of teenage kids in front of me, being teenage kids (shoving each other and rocking the car, laughing, etc.). I could hear the conversation between them and the woman in the window. Bad attempts to flirt. Teenage nonsense. Got to the window and she said, "Sorry about the wait. You know how they are." I said, "Yeah, teenagers can be a handful." She looked at me funny and I knew she wasn't talking about their youth.

We're tired of this paranoia being labeled as some 'fact' or that I'm just a spoiled, privileged person

You're making the common assumption or assertion of people who don't understand the phrase. It has nothing to do with being spoiled. It's about minorities having to deal with any number or assumptions and problems that aren't on your plate, simply because you're white.Nothing in that means that being white will give you a noodle salad life, only a better chance at one and one without all sorts of distractions, impediments and reasonable fears that would accompany you if you were black.

It's just a way to keep white mouths closed, so you all can continue to shout your dead platitudes from coast to coast.

That sounds about like what I'd expect from the woman at the window.

he only privilege I have as white person is to be thrown under the bus by everybody, white or black, yellow, or red- those as yourself are just suckered into burning the feathers of your own flock.

No, but it's like you to believe that. You're either fortunately ignorant, or willfully so, but you don't know much about the world if that's your thinking.

That's the downfall of white people, and will continue to be so long as you follow the same narrative. Black people are their own enemies, hombre.

Not so long as people like you and worse are breathing, kid.

 

[glassjester]

I could hear the conversation between them and the woman in the window. Bad attempts to flirt. Teenage nonsense. Got to the window and she said, "Sorry about the wait. You know how they are." I said, "Yeah, teenagers can be a handful." She looked at me funny and I knew she wasn't talking about their youth.

That? That's your example of personally witnessed racial discrimination? A look from a cashier?

 

[ok doser]

That? That's your example of personally witnessed racial discrimination? A look from a cashier?

that's what i've been eating popcorn for for the last three days? :freak:

 

[glassjester]

that's what i've been eating popcorn for for the last three days? :freak:

I thought you got what you were waiting for with the stop-and-frisk post.

 

[Town Heretic]

That? That's your example of personally witnessed racial discrimination? A look from a cashier?

No, it's one. I've witnessed far worse and more frank examples, as I've noted. I've heard and witnessed them across years traveling in well educated and well healed circles. I learned that racism isn't always or necessarily about means or education, though I think it's an angrier and easier thing where both are thin. It's about being taught to consider yourself better than the other fellow for no particularly compelling reason, to follow the ethnocentric impulse to a dark conclusion...and it's a means to maintain a separation that carries a degree of empowerment.

The thing that struck me about the window incident and the reason I noted it was its casualness, what that sort of thinking does to people, her assumption that I'd be a fellow on the point merely because we shared the same racial distinction. Because I wasn't (and because of my own bias about where I was, the close proximity to a venerable institution of higher learning) I assumed the benign until I couldn't. I returned her look with a stoic but unmistakable lack of empathy. She left the window quickly to do something else and another person brought my order. I doubt she was ashamed. I suspect she simply wanted me out of the line.

 

[annabenedetti]

That? That's your example of personally witnessed racial discrimination? A look from a cashier?

What exactly were you hoping for?

 

[Angel4Truth]

That? That's your example of personally witnessed racial discrimination? A look from a cashier?

I heard a black supervisor tell a black applicant, not to worry about a white woman (me), that she takes care of the sistas. Somehow that isnt racism though. It would have been even less if it would have been just a look and a pat on the back.

 

[glassjester]

What exactly were you hoping for?

I don't hope for any racial discrimination.

But as far as racism goes, that wasn't so bad.

Notice, the customers were still served.
The alleged racist in that scenario didn't act on her allegedly racist bias.

Good for her.
Good for her customers.

 

[Town Heretic]

I heard a black supervisor tell a black applicant, not to worry about a white woman (me), that she takes care of the sistas. Somehow that isnt racism though.

Who said it wasn't? I didn't read that, but I haven't read every post. What I suggested was suing, because someone stupid enough to say that within your hearing range probably has a paper trail of that sort of odious behavior and should be called to account. Anyone who uses race to belittle or deny should be held accountable for it.

 

[ok doser]

I doubt she was ashamed. I suspect she simply wanted me out of the line.

betcha she spit on your burger

 

[annabenedetti]

I don't hope for any racial discrimination.

But as far as racism goes, that wasn't so bad.

Notice, the customers were still served.
The alleged racist in that scenario didn't act on her allegedly racist bias.

Good for her.
Good for her customers.

Does it have to be another Emmett Till for it to be more than "that wasn't so bad?"

 

[glassjester]

I heard a black supervisor tell a black applicant, not to worry about a white woman (me), that she takes care of the sistas. Somehow that isnt racism though. It would have been even less if it would have been just a look and a pat on the back.

That's a shame. She should have just hired whomever she thought would do the best work.

 

[glassjester]

Does it have to be another Emmett Till for it to be more than "that wasn't so bad?"

What did the cashier actually do to the kids in the car?

 

[annabenedetti]

What did the cashier actually do to the kids in the car?

Does it have to be another Emmett Till for it to be more than "that wasn't so bad?"