Is calling Beanieboy a . . .

Is calling Beanieboy a . . .


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Lighthouse

The Dark Knight
Gold Subscriber
Hall of Fame
onchiki said:
ye shall not judge lest ye be judged thyself.
Wanna read further?

[Jesus]"Judge not, that ye be not judged. For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again. And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye? Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, 'Let me pull the mote out of thine eye;' and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye? Thou hypocrite first cast out the out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye."[/Jesus]
-Matthew 7:1-5
 

julie21

New member
Lighthouse...
Nice of you to reply to my post # 792, prior to my farewell t this thread in # 803.
I will respond to a few of your points, and am not going to go over any Beanieboy/faggot stuff as I made my views clear on that point.

I believe you are not Christ-like, in that Christ forgives us our sin, when we come to Him, and then discards it...He does not hold it against us nor refers to it in anyway....He does not say,"Remember when you were a rotten little slut?" ...or whatever. He wipes the slate clean and the life you have found in Him is new and fresh.

You on the other hand, bring it up and then declare that you didn't do it to "dig up my past"..I would love to run a poll on that and see how many think it was Christ-like of you to do that at all...and if it was pertinent in any way to the question raised originally by Lucky.
I do not feel guilty about what I did, yet you rave on that you are good at psychoanalyzing people, and so have determined that you believe I do feel guilty. You have not got a clue at all. :doh:

Did I consider myself a 'slut' back then...the answer is no.
I do not. Neither does my ex-husband, nor any of his family, who are all still my family.
Am I glad that I did it?
...I would say yes...You did not live my life back then, so will never know what it was like. And I do not personally care what you think about my answer.

And I know that you may not believe this Lighthouse, but you see, I do not think about it at all, because it is in the past. I do not feel guilty, or sad, or remorseful or actually anything about it...because I know that God does not think about it at all...it is gone from His memory and I had not thought about it at all until I , that is "I" chose to bring it up as a relevant point in another thread.
You have no idea whatsoever about my personal life and I think it is about time you refrained from even thinking about my life...as you think wrongly on every single count, but like to believe that you are so good at sussing people out. Again, I say you fail in that area dismally in this particular case.

I thank God, Lighthouse, that here on TOL, I have made some truly Christ-like friends, and I do not now, nor will, for as long as you continue in this manner, count you among them.

EPHESIANS 4:29....Do not let unwholesome talk come out of your mouths,
but only what is helpful for building up others according to their needs,
that it may benefit those who listen.

Paul was indeed making reference to the Body of Christ, when he said, "Do not let unwholesome talk come out of your [ those in the Body of Christ] mouths..."

So you do not believe that these first words are meant for you? Don't you profess to be in the Body of Christ?

I have said some of what I wanted to say here...but I have held back quite a lot that will remain unsaid...merely because I do not consider you worthy of hearing it.
And if Turkey is the worst mane I ever call you, then think yourself fortunate that God has given me the ability to not be as harsh as I once was...for I would now be banned from this board. ;)
 
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Delmar

Patron Saint of SMACK
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
temple 2000 said:
Do you observe all of the O/T laws or do you pick and choose?
Symbolic laws like the Saboth, curcumcision, and not wearing clothing of mixed fibers, laws that set the Hebrew people apart from the rest of the world I do not observe. I'm not a Jew! Criminal law, like murder, stealing, adultery, and homosexuality should allways apply to all people.
 

Lighthouse

The Dark Knight
Gold Subscriber
Hall of Fame
julie21 said:
I believe you are not Christ-like, in that Christ forgives us our sin, when we come to Him, and then discards it...He does not hold it against us nor refers to it in anyway....He does not say,"Remember when you were a rotten little slut?" ...or whatever. He wipes the slate clean and the life you have found in Him is new and fresh.
If you think that was the purpose of what I said, you are gravely mistaken. Which is no surprise.

And you are correct, Christ forgives, when we come to Him. This is why we confront beanieboy. Because he has not come to Christ.

You on the other hand, bring it up and then declare that you didn't do it to "dig up my past"..I would love to run a poll on that and see how many think it was Christ-like of you to do that at all...and if it was pertinent in any way to the question raised originally by Lucky.
I do not feel guilty about what I did, yet you rave on that you are good at psychoanalyzing people, and so have determined that you believe I do feel guilty. You have not got a clue at all. :doh:
Then why are you afraid to call people what they are?

Did I consider myself a 'slut' back then...the answer is no.
I do not. Neither does my ex-husband, nor any of his family, who are all still my family.
Then what were you?

Am I glad that I did it?
...I would say yes...You did not live my life back then, so will never know what it was like. And I do not personally care what you think about my answer.
That's sad.

I can understand that you are glad you got out of the marriage you were in, if it was a bad marriage. But glad that you committed adultery?:nono:

And I know that you may not believe this Lighthouse, but you see, I do not think about it at all, because it is in the past. I do not feel guilty, or sad, or remorseful or actually anything about it...because I know that God does not think about it at all...it is gone from His memory and I had not thought about it at all until I , that is "I" chose to bring it up as a relevant point in another thread.
You have no idea whatsoever about my personal life and I think it is about time you refrained from even thinking about my life...as you think wrongly on every single count, but like to believe that you are so good at sussing people out. Again, I say you fail in that area dismally in this particular case.
When you first came to TOL, you told me that you hated the old you. I believed you. I don't anymore.

I thank God, Lighthouse, that here on TOL, I have made some truly Christ-like friends, and I do not now, nor will, for as long as you continue in this manner, count you among them.
I don't care. I know who I am in Christ, and who I was apart from Him. And I will strive, as long as I live, to call people to Him, because His grace is truly amazing.

EPHESIANS 4:29....Do not let unwholesome talk come out of your mouths,
but only what is helpful for building up others according to their needs,
that it may benefit those who listen.

Paul was indeed making reference to the Body of Christ, when he said, "Do not let unwholesome talk come out of your [ those in the Body of Christ] mouths..."

So you do not believe that these first words are meant for you? Don't you profess to be in the Body of Christ?
Yes, I am in the Body of Christ. And I do not feel that calling someone what they are is unwholesome, especially if they are unwholesome.

I have said some of what I wanted to say here...but I have held back quite a lot that will remain unsaid...merely because I do not consider you worthy of hearing it.
And if Turkey is the worst mane I ever call you, then think yourself fortunate that God has given me the ability to not be as harsh as I once was...for I would now be banned from this board. ;)
Then PM me. I don't care. I've had plenty of insults thrown my way.

And don't worry about calling me turkey. I don't care.
 

beanieboy

New member
Lovejoy said:
It is a very powerful technique for discrediting a group. It is a little like "poisoning the well", ie, you can say that "I tried that and it did not work" "or I knew someone that it did not work for" as a way of defeating the approach without ever actually entering to a true debate over its merits.

http://www.mabenterprises.com/gaychristians/religious_text/failures6b.htm

EXODUS International

In order to learn more about Exodus International and Transformation Ex-Gay Ministry, we wrote letters to both organizations asking five basic questions (2). A conscious attempt was made to word the questions in as impartial a manner as possible. We asked:

1. How many chapters are currently in operation today? When was your organization founded?
2. How many men and women go through your program each year? How many men and women have gone through your program since its founding?
3. What is your success rate? What is your failure rate?
4. Do you have any statistics on the number of people who may have returned to homosexuality after finishing your program?
5. Do you have any follow-up programs after a person has gone through your program?

Transformation Ex-Gay Ministry (actually Transformation Christian Ministry, according to information supplied by Exodus International) did not respond, but Bob Davies, Executive Director of Exodus International, sent a packet of information detailing their program (3).

Exodus International is a referral agency only, according to Davies. In November 1993, it listed 78 agencies in 35 states (not 110 "nationwide," as the May tabloid claims) (4). Two of these ministries are listed for Kentucky: CrossOver Ministries, founded by Bruce Grimsley in Lexington in 1985, and Pathway Ministries, directed by Martin Ward in south Louisville.

Exodus International is clearly affiliated with the Protestant Christian belief system. In one of its pamphlets, "Exodus: A Way Out," it offers "Freedom from homosexuality, not through a method but a person, the Lord Jesus Christ!" It believes that only through total surrender to Christ can homosexuals hope to change into heterosexuals (although it does have special materials aimed at Catholics, Mormons, and others). It offers a huge selection of educational items, including videotapes as well as audio tapes, and provides lectures on request. It also publishes a quarterly newsletter, "The Standard."

Efficacy Of The EXODUS Program

Interestingly, Davies had "no idea how many people go through counseling" but said that Exodus processes up to 600 requests for information each month. Presumably, our request was one of those.

One of their local agencies, Love In Action, in San Rafael, California (north of San Francisco), estimates that they have processed over 30,000 requests for information since its inception in 1974. Davies guesses that all ministries nationwide have processed over 100,000 requests for information in the past 18 years (5). He provided no information on how many of these requests resulted in individuals signing up for their program.

Davies also did not have an answer concerning the success rate. "Each agency would probably give you a different answer," he states. Love In Action, he said, "estimates that about half the men who complete their program remain out of homosexuality after five years." Davies made no mention of any follow-up programs.

Here again, saying that they have remained "out of homosexuality" is not the same as saying they are now heterosexually involved: some of them may be celibate or impotent, or they may simply have given up sex with other members of the same gender but retain homosexual masturbatory fantasies. Without a lack of follow-up, success rates are difficult to ascertain.

In fact, the efficacy of a "cure" has been called into question by many gays who have gone through the Exodus program. And gay activists note that Exodus' so-called success stories consist almost entirely of tormented homosexuals who have become celibate rather than heterosexual, according to Kalmansohn.

Michael Bussee and Gary Cooper

Perhaps the most famous "former ex-gays" are Michael Bussee and Gary Cooper, who were instrumental in establishing Exodus International in 1976 (6).

Both Bussee and Cooper, troubled by their homosexual feelings, became fervent Christians in 1971 while still in their late teens. They met and became friends while working for a counseling and referral line at the Melodyland Christian Center in Anaheim.

Bussee, knowing what a struggle he'd had in dealing with his own homosexual feelings, grew worried when he heard operators of the center's hot-line tell gay and lesbian callers that they were "possessed by demons." Requesting specific training for such calls, he learned that none existed. "I told them I was a Christian homosexual," Bussee says. They replied, "There's no such thing. If you trust God, all your homosexual desires will be replaced by heterosexual ones."

Accepting this claim at face value, Bussee and Cooper soon became Melodyland's specialists in the conversion of homosexuals. In 1976, they helped found Exodus International.

Ironically, however, the more they worked together, the more they found themselves falling in love. Their breaking point came simultaneously in the late 70s on a road trip, when they found themselves booked by chance into a hotel room with only one bed. They took this accident as a sign from God and eventually left Exodus in 1979. In 1982, they were married (7). Cooper died of AIDS nine years later.

"The desires never go away," says Bussee, "the confrontations begin and the guilt gets worse and worse." Bussee recalls that some people who went through the Exodus program had breakdowns or committed suicide. "One man slashed his genitals with a razor and poured Drano on his wounds." Another man impulsively underwent an incomplete sex- change operation because he believed his sexual desires might receive divine approval were he biologically a woman (8).

"After dealing with hundreds of people," Bussee concludes, he and his lover hadn't "met one who went from gay to straight. Even if you manage to alter someone's sexual behavior, you cannot change their true sexual orientation."

"If you got them away from the Christian limelight," he concludes, "and asked them, 'Honestly now, are you saying that you are no longer homosexual and you are now heterosexually oriented?'...not one person said, 'Yes, I am actually now heterosexual.'"
 

Caille

New member
Lighthouse said:
How about you quit referring to masturbation?


Whatsamatta, too close to home for you ? :D

Besides, I was referring to semantic masturbation. Most intelligent people would recognize that as a "metaphor"

Main Entry: met·a·phor
Pronunciation: 'me-t&-"for also -f&r
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle French or Latin; Middle French metaphore, from Latin metaphora, from Greek, from metapherein to transfer, from meta- + pherein to bear -- more at BEAR
1 : a figure of speech in which a word or phrase literally denoting one kind of object or idea is used in place of another to suggest a likeness or analogy between them (as in drowning in money); broadly : figurative language -- compare SIMILE
2 : an object, activity, or idea treated as a metaphor : SYMBOL 2
- met·a·phor·ic /"me-t&-'for-ik, -'fär-/ or met·a·phor·i·cal /-i-k&l/ adjective
- met·a·phor·i·cal·ly /-i-k(&-)lE/ adverb





And don't forget that Nineveh is a woman.


Yes, but I'll bet she was intelligent enough to make the connection.
 

beanieboy

New member
Lighthouse said:
If someone told you you were being a child, would you be upset, or assess your actions, to see if the person might be right?
The people Jesus called names were most often offended, because they were too proud to consider that He might be right. Sometimes, however, they did step back, and take a look. Those that did submitted to Him.
.

With all due respect, there are those who are calling christians on acting like children, even other christians, and many act offended, upset, and won't even consider for a moment that they may be right.

Jesus offended the Pharissees more than he did the tax collectors and prostitutes.
 

beanieboy

New member
Lighthouse said:
That is not what Jesus said.:nono:

And what do you think loving your neighbor as yourself entails? True love hates wickedness. I hate my sin, just like I hate the sin of others. I hate what I was before Christ set me free. As I hate what others are when they don't come to Christ to be set free. I hate the old me, the me that was crucified. Just as I hate those who have not been crucified. I love them, exactly the way I love myself.

Loving your neighbor as yourself entails hating those who have not been crucified?
 

beanieboy

New member
I used to work on an emergency crisis line because I was studying psychology. I remember a call from a young kids who was 15 or 16 who was about to commit suicide, and said that he wanted to say goodbye to someone.

He had gone to his priest and told him that he was gay. His priest told him that it would be better if he were dead, than alive and gay. So he went home, got his father's gun, and called the line.

Ironically, the Catholic church had quite a few molestations going on, and rather than come clean about it, or to press charges, said nothing to make them look good on the outside, while continuing to harm victim after victim.

Is it any wonder people don't trust the church?
 

Nineveh

Merely Christian
The Edge said:
Remember, please.....when you point fingers, there are three pointing back at you. Nineveh,

Edge, it was you making a list of what you find offensive. When it was pointed out dave is the worse offender according to your own standard, you copped out.

it sounds like from this thread you need to re-evaluate the Christian image you are trying to portray. It's not making you look too good right now. I for one don't see much Christ in you from what I've seen on the board. It's my prayer that you repent if necessary and try to be a mirror for Christ in this dark world.

And what about you? Aren't you looking like a major hypocrite right now?
 

Caille

New member
beanieboy said:
With all due respect, there are those who are calling christians on acting like children, even other christians, and many act offended, upset, and won't even consider for a moment that they may be right.

Jesus offended the Pharissees more than he did the tax collectors and prostitutes.



Beanie, you realize that Brandon is a child ?


Can you really expect him to act mature ?
 

Lighthouse

The Dark Knight
Gold Subscriber
Hall of Fame
Caille said:
Whatsamatta, too close to home for you ? :D

Besides, I was referring to semantic masturbation. Most intelligent people would recognize that as a "metaphor"
It's a forbidden topic on TOL. Even if it is a metaphor, it's not something most of us want to think about. And phrases such as, "stroking it," are inappropriate, no matter the context, on a family oriented website.









Yes, but I'll bet she was intelligent enough to make the connection.
Maybe so. But that doesn't make it okay.
 

Nineveh

Merely Christian
temple 2000 said:
Nin...I did go back and read what Paul said. Apparently he had a great deal of trouble with that particular subject.

I think you are reading into things. I see where he is quite clear taking a Godly stand.

I still don't see where Jesus himself gave a command to insult and hate homosexuals. If I rcall correctly he said to his disciples "A NEW commandment I give you - Love your God with all your mind, heart and soul and you Neighbor as yourself." Do you observe all of the O/T laws or do you pick and choose?

Do you believe Jesus is the same God of the OT and the NT or some other God? Or do you think He got some therapy in the inter-testament period? You might want to point out where Jesus said, "That OT stuff? I was just kidding." You will have much more luck finding Jesus say, "repent" and "follow the Law".
 
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