Cross Reference
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Never mind a thread, why are you on a Christian FORUM?
ECT God does NOT grant eternal life
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Never mind a thread, why are you on a Christian FORUM?
Rosenritter
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Whether this is a Christian Forum is up for debate. I am confused as to how or why you would continue to champion such an anti-Christian teaching such as "GOD DOES NOT GRANT ETERNAL LIFE."
John 10:27-28 KJV
My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: [28] And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
1 John 5:11 KJV
And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.
As to why I am on this thread of yours, morbid curiosity I suppose. Even your vented hatred at me doesn't phase me in comparison.
Cross Reference
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I don't hate you. I pity you. You think you are alive but are dead. God cannot grant His life to dead people who have no capacity to even care to have it.
Rosenritter
New member
You just contradicted your thread title.
[*]Can salvation be lost? It can be deferred.
[*]Are works necessary for salvation? No.
[*]Will the rapture occur before the Tribulation? No.
[*]Should Christians eat "unclean" foods? No.
[*]Should Christian observe the Sabbaths? Yes.
[*]Is water baptism required? Yes.
[*]Should Christians expect physical miracles to happen? Yes, and they do.
[*]Are there still Apostles today? No.
And now you know the NT truth.
Rosenritter
New member
This New Testament passage seems to relate to your answers four and five:
Rom 14:1-9 KJV
(1) Him that is weak in the faith receive ye, but not to doubtful disputations.
(2) For one believeth that he may eat all things: another, who is weak, eateth herbs.
(3) Let not him that eateth despise him that eateth not; and let not him which eateth not judge him that eateth: for God hath received him.
(4) Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand.
(5) One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.
(6) He that regardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard it. He that eateth, eateth to the Lord, for he giveth God thanks; and he that eateth not, to the Lord he eateth not, and giveth God thanks.
(7) For none of us liveth to himself, and no man dieth to himself.
(8) For whether we live, we live unto the Lord; and whether we die, we die unto the Lord: whether we live therefore, or die, we are the Lord's.
(9) For to this end Christ both died, and rose, and revived, that he might be Lord both of the dead and living.
Can you show me where Gentiles are commanded to observe Sabbaths and observe dietary food laws? I know that those under the jurisdiction of Israel and the law of Moses had many laws to follow, but I cannot recall those being commanded of any Gentile.
Act 15:28-29 KJV
(28) For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things;
(29) That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.
Even the meats offered to idols was because how it might influence their conscience. The abstaining from blood was because of the symbolism with Christ's blood. Elsewhere Paul says that even meat offered to idols is acceptable depending on the conscience of him who eats.
In the body of Christ there is no difference made with regard to ethnicity. What's good for one is good for all.
The seventh day of rest is part of God's creation just like plants and animals and people.
The weekly Sabbath foreshadows the mlllennial Sabbath. Those who don't keep the weekly will not be expected to keep the millennial.
The dietary instructions are for sanctification.
People are free to esteem whatever days they choose. Some people esteem Kwanzaa, some people esteem Christmas, but not everybody esteems the same days. Esteem away.
But only God can make a day holy, man can't. We are instructed to remember the Sabbath to keep it set apart from the other days.
Only those who are persuaded to do so will do so, but it ranks with the other nine.
Rosenritter
New member
There is no more need for ceremonial sanctification of the Jews from the Gentiles. Jesus revealed this to Peter. The usefulness and application of that symbol is past. The Gentiles are no longer unclean.
Acts 10:28 KJV
And he said unto them, Ye know how that it is an unlawful thing for a man that is a Jew to keep company, or come unto one of another nation; but God hath shewed me that I should not call any man common or unclean.
The clean and unclean food laws represented the separation of Jew and Gentile.
Rosenritter
New member
Along that same line of logic, the Feast of Trumpets foreshadows Christ's return, the Day of Atonement foreshadows Christ's reconciliation of the saints and the banishment of the devil, and the Feast of Weeks foreshadows the thousand-year long reign of Christ with his saints. Do you likewise observe these? What of the eighth day of that feast, the last great day?
Was Noah a Jew?
Genesis 7:2 "You shall take with you seven each of every clean animal, a male and his female; two each of animals that are unclean, a male and his female."
The Feast of Trumpets foreshadows the Day of the Lord.
Joel 2:1 "Blow the trumpet in Zion and sound an alarm in My holy mountain!
Let all the inhabitants of the land tremble for the day of the LORD is coming,
For it is at hand."
Joel 2:30-31 "And I will show wonders in the heavens and in the earth, blood and fire and pillars of smoke.
The sun shall be turned into darkness and the moon into blood before the coming of the great and awesome day of the LORD."
musterion
Well-known member
Paul said Christ is the believer's life.
Christ is Life itself, eternal, as the Father is eternal.
Therefore, the believer has eternal life.
That's what it says. You'll believe it or not.
Rosenritter
New member
No, Noah was not a Jew. Noah was vegetarian before the flood and ate every animal after the flood.
Before the Flood:
Gen 1:29-30 KJV
(29) And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, in the which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat.
(30) And to every beast of the earth, and to every fowl of the air, and to every thing that creepeth upon the earth, wherein there is life, I have given every green herb for meat: and it was so.
After the Flood
Gen 9:1-4 KJV
(1) And God blessed Noah and his sons, and said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth.
(2) And the fear of you and the dread of you shall be upon every beast of the earth, and upon every fowl of the air, upon all that moveth upon the earth, and upon all the fishes of the sea; into your hand are they delivered.
(3) Every moving thing that liveth shall be meat for you; even as the green herb have I given you all things.
(4) But flesh with the life thereof, which is the blood thereof, shall ye not eat.
Noah was given both the apple and the oyster alike as his sustenance after the flood. Sort of puts a perspective on things when you've been used to thinking as "Pork unclean" and telling yourself it was like that since creation... Apparently God had a plan for those animals later, but it wasn't for Noah then.
Rosenritter
New member
Do you see some similarity between the scapegoat led into the wilderness by a rope under the hand of a strong man, and the fallen angel being bound into the pit by an angel with a great chain?
Lev 16:21-22 KJV
(21) And Aaron shall lay both his hands upon the head of the live goat, and confess over him all the iniquities of the children of Israel, and all their transgressions in all their sins, putting them upon the head of the goat, and shall send him away by the hand of a fit man into the wilderness:
(22) And the goat shall bear upon him all their iniquities unto a land not inhabited: and he shall let go the goat in the wilderness.
Rev 20:1-2 KJV
(1) And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
(2) And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
The scapegoat isn't slain, it is bound and cast out by the hand of a "fit" man into the wilderness, away from the congregation of Israel. The serpent isn't slain at that time either, but bound by an angel and confined away from the rest of humanity. If you see this so far, do you also observe the Feast of Trumpets and the Day of Atonement that you might also have right to participate in those days?
I would like to see how consistent you are with this. At the spot where I get a "no" answer I can go on to illustrate my point.
Nope, Satan will die at least once and he could die twice depending on what he says and does when he is resurrected.
Only God is immortal.
Rosenritter
New member
Who said anything about the devil being immortal? It does not say he is killed by being chained in the pit. The symbolism doesn't match. Chains bind, pits confine, but fire destroys.
Leviticus 16:22 "The goat shall bear on itself all their iniquities to an uninhabited land and he shall release the goat in the wilderness."
The scapegoat symbolized Jesus Christ bearing all sin to an uninhabited place.
The ultimate uninhabited place is the grave.
The scapegoat symbolized Jesus Christ bearing all sin to an uninhabited place.
The ultimate uninhabited place is the grave.
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Rosenritter
New member
There were two goats. One was slain for our sins. The other was cast out and even the person that banished it to the wilderness had to be specially washed before he would be considered clean. Does that second goat really sound like Christ to you? Think about what the word "Christ" means. Doesn't the word mean "savior?" That second goat doesn't save anyone. The two goats are contrasted, not compared.
Lev 16:8-10 KJV
(8) And Aaron shall cast lots upon the two goats; one lot for the LORD, and the other lot for the scapegoat.
(9) And Aaron shall bring the goat upon which the LORD'S lot fell, and offer him for a sin offering.
(10) But the goat, on which the lot fell to be the scapegoat, shall be presented alive before the LORD, to make an atonement with him, and to let him go for a scapegoat into the wilderness.
Christ was never banished from us for our sins. Christ was sacrificed for our sins and we are said to be saved by his blood. The blood of the first goat hallows what it touches. This other goat bears the iniquity of Israel and is presented is cast out alive. Jesus died. This goat didn't.
Lev 16:22 KJV
(22) And the goat shall bear upon him all their iniquities unto a land not inhabited: and he shall let go the goat in the wilderness.
Lev 16:26 KJV
(26) And he that let go the goat for the scapegoat shall wash his clothes, and bathe his flesh in water, and afterward come into the camp.
That's how unclean the second goat really is. Why are you suggesting that the second goat is Christ?
The problem with that interpretation is that the second goat isn't killed. The first goat is killed, but not the second. Roaming about a wilderness is not a proper descriptive of death - I don't think you prescribe to death as wandering about the ends of the earth, do you?
Revelation answers this for us. It's the devil that is bound and cast out by the hand of a fit angel, when Jesus makes atonement for his saints by his blood. It is the Lamb that was Slain that redeems us, not the impostor that bears the truly bears the iniquity of all.