ECT glorydaz says that Romans is Written to Unbelievers

[tetelestai]

HINT #3:

(Rom 7:3-4) So then, if she has sexual relations with another man while her husband is still alive, she is called an adulteress. But if her husband dies, she is released from that law and is not an adulteress if she marries another man.

Who is the adulteress?

Answer: The House of Israel (10 tribes)

(Jer 3:8) I gave faithless Israel her certificate of divorce and sent her away because of all her adulteries. ....

(Hosea 1:2) When the LORD began to speak through Hosea, the LORD said to him, "Go, marry a promiscuous woman and have children with her, for like an adulterous wife this land is guilty of unfaithfulness to the LORD."

(Jer 3:20) But like a woman unfaithful to her husband, so you, Israel, have been unfaithful to me," declares the LORD.

None of the above OT verses pertain to the Jews, they all pertain to the 10 tribes from the House of Israel.

 

[tetelestai]

you call that exegeting a text

Yes, I'm explaining to you who the Romans were.

If you disagree, then please tell me how I'm wrong, and please tell us who the Romans were?

 

[Danoh]

Yes, I'm explaining to you who the Romans were.

If you disagree, then please tell me how I'm wrong, and please tell us who the Romans were?

Your Jerry-at-trick agenda obvious; you'll have to satisfy yourself with concluding we don't know.

 

[Jerry Shugart]

Danoh-At-Trick Agenda?

Danoh-At-Trick Agenda?

It is written "to all the be in Rome..."

Why don't you quote the rest of the verse because it tells us who the "all" is referring to?:

"to all that are in Rome, beloved of God, called saints: Grace to you and peace from God our Father and our Lord Jesus Christ" (Ro.1:7).​

Why didn't you quote the whole verse, Danoh?

Did you not want anyone to see that the "all that are in Rome" of which Paul spoke were those beloved of God and called saints?

That changes completely the meaning of the small portion of the verse which you quoted.

See, this is why JW gives you such are hard time - because you have a Jerry-at-trick agenda.

I will let others decide if you have a Danoh-at-trick agenda.

 

[john w]

Funny how you MADists love to talk about your "two gospels"..

Once again, he satanically asserts that there is only one piece of good news in the bible.

That is what his satanic AD 70-ism/Preterism teaches.

 

[tetelestai]

I will let others decide if you have a Danoh-at-trick agenda.

So far only heir and Nick M have attempted to tell us who the Romans were.

hier claims they were pagan Gentile proselytes. Nick M says they were pagan Gentile proselytes who called themselves Jews. (sort of the same thing as heir)


However, Rom 4:1 proves them both wrong too:

(Rom 4:1) What then shall we say that Abraham, our forefather according to the flesh, discovered in this matter?

If you claim they were Jews, that's wrong

(Rom 11:13) I am talking to you Gentiles. Inasmuch as I am the apostle to the Gentiles, I take pride in my ministry

So, Paul makes it clear that the Romans were Gentiles who had Abraham as their ancestor according to the flesh, and that at one time they "were not a people"

There can only be one answer who the Romans were.

 

[john w]

When you and Johnny can't find your answers on Dispensational websites, you guys don't, and can't, answer the questions.

Which is why neither of you can tell us who the Romans were.

Craigie the wimp.

All you do is plagiarize from PlanetPreterism.

 

[tetelestai]

Craigie the wimp.

All you do is plagiarize from PlanetPreterism.

Once again, Johnny is afraid to answer the question.

Just tell us who the Romans were Johnny?

I thought you MADists were the only ones who knew how to "rightly divide"?

Surely one of your Dispensationalist leaders has told you who the Romans were?

 

[tetelestai]

HINT #4:

(Gen 48:19 YLT) And his father refuseth, and saith, `I have known, my son, I have known; he also becometh a people, and he also is great, and yet, his young brother is greater than he, and his seed is the fulness of the nations;'

(Rom 11:25 YLT) For I do not wish you to be ignorant, brethren, of this secret -- that ye may not be wise in your own conceits -- that hardness in part to Israel hath happened till the fulness of the nations may come in;

 

[patrick jane]

When you and Johnny can't find your answers on Dispensational websites, you guys don't, and can't, answer the questions.

Which is why neither of you can tell us who the Romans were.

from NIV -

ORIGINAL AUDIENCE:
Then Christians in Rome

DATE WRITTEN:
About A.D. 57, from Corinth, as Paul was preparing for his vist to Jerusalem.

SETTING:
Apparently Paul had finished his work in the east, and he planned to visit Rome on his way to Spain after first bring a collection to Jerusalem for the poor Christians there 15:23-28. The Roman church was mostly Jewish but also contained a great number of Gentlles

i posted this to you about a week ago. do you need a copy of the official Church membership census ? py

 

[tetelestai]

The Roman church was mostly Jewish but also contained a great number of Gentlles

How were they Gentiles if Abraham was their forefather according to the flesh?

(Rom 4:1) What then shall we say that Abraham, our forefather according to the flesh, discovered in this matter?

How were they Jews

(Rom 11:13) I am talking to you Gentiles. Inasmuch as I am the apostle to the Gentiles, I take pride in my ministry

Also, according to MAD there were two programs ("kingdom" & "Body")

Which program were these Roman Christians under before receiving Paul's epistle?

 

[Danoh]

HINT #4:

(Gen 48:19 YLT) And his father refuseth, and saith, `I have known, my son, I have known; he also becometh a people, and he also is great, and yet, his young brother is greater than he, and his seed is the fulness of the nations;'

(Rom 11:25 YLT) For I do not wish you to be ignorant, brethren, of this secret -- that ye may not be wise in your own conceits -- that hardness in part to Israel hath happened till the fulness of the nations may come in;

ROFL - Now that was hilarious!

 

[tetelestai]

ROFL - Now that was hilarious!

No, what's hilarious is how you MADists can't tell us who the Romans were, and what "program" they were under.

Like I said, you guys sure like to go on and on about how great Mid-Acts-Dispensationalism is, and how you guys are the only ones who know how to "rightly divide".

Yet, in this thread, other than heir and Nick M, all you MADists are scared to death to answer the questions.

 

[Danoh]

How were they Gentiles if Abraham was their forefather according to the flesh?

(Rom 4:1) What then shall we say that Abraham, our forefather according to the flesh, discovered in this matter?

How were they Jews

(Rom 11:13) I am talking to you Gentiles. Inasmuch as I am the apostle to the Gentiles, I take pride in my ministry

Also, according to MAD there were two programs ("kingdom" & "Body")

Which program were these Roman Christians under before receiving Paul's epistle?

Yeah, ok, smart guy; Romans 4:1 forward is written in connection with the issue Paul anticpates Jews raising - the issue he anticipates in the last verse of chapter 3.

Romans 3:31's "Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law."

And you and your new buddy wonder why we don't bother with you other than for answering a fool according to his folly.

 

[tetelestai]

Yeah, ok, smart guy; Romans 4:1 forward is written in connection with the issue Paul anticpates Jews raising - the issue he anticipates in the last verse of chapter 3.

Romans 3:31's "Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law."

Er, no.

You keep forgetting that Paul used phrases like "my gospel", "my Lord", and "my God" many times in his epistles.

In Rom 4:1, Paul refers to Abraham as "our forefather" according to the flesh.

Therefore, both Paul and the Roman audience were physical descendants of Abraham.

It's the same language the Samaritan woman used:

(John 4:12) Are you greater than our father Jacob, who gave us the well and drank from it himself, as did also his sons and his livestock?”

The Samaritan woman wasn't a Jew, yet she was a physical descendant of Jacob.

The Romans Paul was addressing weren't Jews, yet they were physical descendants of Abraham.

Like I said, if I'm wrong, then just tell us who the Romans were?

To date, you have purposely avoided answering the questions every time.

And you and your new buddy wonder why we don't bother with you other than for answering a fool according to his folly.

Oh, I know why you don't answer.

You don't answer because you know you don't have an answer.

 

[Danoh]

Er, no.

You keep forgetting that Paul used phrases like "my gospel", "my Lord", and "my God" many times in his epistles.

In Rom 4:1, Paul refers to Abraham as "our forefather" according to the flesh.

Therefore, both Paul and the Roman audience were physical descendants of Abraham.

It's the same language the Samaritan woman used:

(John 4:12) Are you greater than our father Jacob, who gave us the well and drank from it himself, as did also his sons and his livestock?”

The Samaritan woman wasn't a Jew, yet she was a physical descendant of Jacob.

The Romans Paul was addressing weren't Jews, yet they were physical descendants of Abraham.

Like I said, if I'm wrong, then just tell us who the Romans were?

To date, you have purposely avoided answering the questions every time.



Oh, I know why you don't answer.

You don't answer because you know you don't have an answer.

No, fool; Romans 4 is the same issue addressed in Galatians 2 and 3.

The point is general rules of thumb you remain clueless about. Til you get those straight; answering other questions will meet with more of the same recurrent blindness from you.

 

[tetelestai]

No, fool; Romans 4 is the same issue addressed in Galatians 2 and 3.

Nope, you're wrong.

(Gal 3:7) Understand, then, that those who have faith are children of Abraham.

Those who have faith (Jews & Gentiles) are children of Abraham regardless of genealogy.

In Romans 4:1, Paul links his Roman audience to Abraham by "our forefather according to the flesh" the same way the Samaritan woman linked her genealogy to Jacob (by the flesh)

Neither the Samaritan woman, nor the Romans were Jews, yet both were genealogical descendants of Abraham.

answering other questions will meet with more of the same recurrent blindness from you.

You won't answer the question because you can't.

It's the same reason most of the other MADists won't answer the question.

You guys can't.

 

[Danoh]

Nope, you're wrong.

(Gal 3:7) Understand, then, that those who have faith are children of Abraham.

Those who have faith (Jews & Gentiles) are children of Abraham regardless of genealogy.

In Romans 4:1, Paul links his Roman audience to Abraham by "our forefather according to the flesh" the same way the Samaritan woman linked her genealogy to Jacob (by the flesh)

Neither the Samaritan woman, nor the Romans were Jews, yet both were genealogical descendants of Abraham.



You won't answer the question because you can't.

It's the same reason most of the other MADists won't answer the question.

You guys can't.

Man are you slow. If merely proving we know an answer were the issue - as it is for you and your new friend [more like your twin] all we'd have to do would be to Google it; if we didn't know.

Lol, what a knucklehead you are in your quest to be Jerry-at-trick right.

 

[StanJ]

So what was he preaching?

5 These twelve Jesus sent out and commanded them, saying: “Do not go into the way of the Gentiles, and do not enter a city of the Samaritans. 6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. 7 And as you go, preach, saying, ‘The kingdom of heaven is at hand.’ 8 Heal the sick, cleanse the lepers, raise the dead, cast out demons. Freely you have received, freely give. 9 Provide neither gold nor silver nor copper in your money belts, 10 nor bag for your journey, nor two tunics, nor sandals, nor staffs; for a worker is worthy of his food.

Well as you emboldened the answer in v7, I will go with that. As well, they were to do what was noted in v1 where it states; gave them authority to drive out impure spirits and to heal every disease and sickness.

 

[tetelestai]

all we'd have to would be to Google it; if we didn't know.

Go ahead and google it. I know what all the Dispensationalist sights say, and so do you.

You guys don't have a valid answer, which is why you guys won't answer the question

Your first answer was dead wrong.

Paul proves you wrong in chp 9

(Rom 9:3 KJV) For I could wish that myself were accursed from Christ for my brethren, my kinsmen according to the flesh:

In the above verse, Paul is referring to his unbelieving Jewish brethren.

Paul refers to them as "my kinsmen according to the flesh"

That's the same language Paul used in chp 4 when linking himself and his Roman audience to Abraham: "Our forefather according to the flesh".

"according to the flesh" describes a physical seed line. It's not, and can't pertain to something spiritual like Galatians 3:7