If you paid attention, I intentionally highlighted where the text says explicitly that BY HIM all things were created.
God created the universe for Himself and it was God the Son that the creating was done through.
There is only one God, Marhig. We are not given sufficient detail to understand the triune nature of God but we are told enough to understand that the One God exists in three persons, God the Father, God the Son & God the Holy Spirit. But the three are ONE GOD. And so your question is a non-sequitur. It could only come out of the mouth of an unbeliever.
This applies to Jesus the man, yes. There was no Jesus before Mary conceived Him in her womb by the Holy Spirit but God the Son was with God and was God in the beginning and the became flesh and took on the name, Jesus. This also was directly quoted in my post and could not be more explicitly stated by the text of John chapter 1. Why do you ignore that explicit teaching, the clearest possible, directly stated teaching of the bible? What's the point?
Amen! Thank you for finally conceding the debate!
How else am I supposed to respond to what you just said here?
I understand that you are making some sort of distinction between Jesus and God but it contrived and I think now that you know it's contrived (intuitively). I mean any child can understand that God the Son did not go by the name Jesus before He was born of a human woman but that doesn't mean that God the Son didn't exist prior to that event. The bible states in no uncertain terms that God became man and that the Logos of God both existed with God and was God in the beginning and that He made everything that was made.
Quite so.
Only a moron would need to have such a verse quoted to him. No one here is denying that Jesus was begotten of the Father.
John chapter 1
Nothing else needs to be said to refute you.
Jesus the man submitted Himself to obedience to the Father, even unto death. That does not mean that He wasn't also God. You simply desire to deny the triune nature of God.
Thank the Lord Himself that He was wise enough to have placed John chapter 1 and Colossians chapter 1 in the Bible.
I don't understand people like you. I really don't. Why do you even care to be a Christian at all if you aren't going to accept its teachings on things that are not disputable? I mean, if you wanted to dispute dispensationalism, that would be one thing, because well-meaning people of good conscience could honestly come to different conclusions concerning issues as complex as that but this is not one of those kinds of issues. The bible claims explicitly that Jesus is the incarnation He who created all things. It also undeniably teaches that there is only One Creator.
Further, Jesus' death is sufficient to pay the sin debt of the human race precisely because He is God. If Jesus is not God then His death was that of a mere man. Even if that man was sinless and perfectly innocent, His death would only have been sufficient to pay for a single other person's sin debt. One man's life is not worth that of millions or billions or even trillions of others unless that Man was God in the flesh, which Jesus was. God is just. He cannot pay for a thing with less than what it's worth. To do so would relegate the gospel to some sort of arbitrary act of God that is more sadistic than just. If God could trade the life of one mere man for the souls of all humanity then why couldn't he have traded the life of a goat for the same? The injustice would be of a kind, the difference being only a matter of degree. To deny the deity of Christ is to undermine the entire gospel as well as the very character of God Himself.
Resting in Him,
Clete
