Does Calvinism Make God Unjust?

[marhig]

I'm going to prove to you that Jesus is God. This will be more than a mere biblical argument, it will be a biblical PROOF.
We'll then see where your rejection of Jesus' diety is rooted....

The bible CLEARLY states that Jesus created the Universe and everything in it.

Colossians 1:15 He [Jesus] is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. 16 For BY Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him. 17 And He is before all things, and in Him all things consist.

John 1: In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made. 4 In Him was life, and the life was the light of men. 5 And the light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it.

6 There was a man sent from God, whose name was John. 7 This man came for a witness, to bear witness of the Light, that all through him might believe. 8 He was not that Light, but was sent to bear witness of that Light. 9 That was the true Light which gives light to every man coming into the world.
10 He was in the world, and the world was made through Him, and the world did not know Him. 11 He came to His own, and His own[d] did not receive Him. 12 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name: 13 who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

14 And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth.

Genesis 1:1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

Isaiah 45:Truly You are God, who hide Yourself,
O God of Israel, the Savior!
16 They shall be ashamed
And also disgraced, all of them;
They shall go in confusion together,
Who are makers of idols.
17 But Israel shall be saved by the Lord
With an everlasting salvation;
You shall not be ashamed or disgraced
Forever and ever.

18 For thus says the Lord,
Who created the heavens,
Who is God,
Who formed the earth and made it,
Who has established it,
Who did not create it in vain,
Who formed it to be inhabited:
“I am the Lord, and there is no other.​

The bible teaches two undeniable things...

1. That God created the universe.
2. That Jesus created the universe.

If Jesus is the Creator, He is God. Like it or lump it.
If you deny it, its for reasons other than an allegiance to God's word and a willingness to submit yourself to its clear teaching.

Resting in Him,
Clete

Clete, if all thing we're created through Jesus and for Jesus. Who created them through him and for him?

And God is reconciling and saving through Christ. Everything is done through him.

2 Corinthians 5

And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ,and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation; To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

Jesus was begotten of the father, meaning the father came before him and he has come from God and is born of God, not that he is God! He is the only begotten son of God and he's in his express image

Hebrews 1

God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,

Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things by whom also he made the worlds;

Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;"

It's Gods glory through Jesus and God glorifies Christ. Jesus is in the express image of God's person and Jesus Christ had Gods power, Because God was in him in fullness of the spirit because Jesus Christ laid down his life and did the will of God not his own will, to bring us back, thus he is our saviour. Saving us from flesh, sin and the world through a new and living way.

And look at this verse

1 John 5:1

Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.

So God begat Jesus

Hebrews 1:5

For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?

God begat Jesus but Jesus was begotten of him! God is the father and Jesus is the son, son of God not God the son!

And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth.

Jesus is the word of God because that's all he speaks, Gods word because he is the Christ. The anointed of God. If Jesus is the Christ, then there must be a God above him to anoint him, if he was God, then he would not have needed to be anointed because he would be God!

It says in the Bible, God exhalted Jesus, and the Christ is under subjection to him and that God is his head of Christ and that God is the God of Jesus. i can see so much in the new testament pointing God being the God of Jesus Christ that I have to believe it. And I believe Jesus when he says that Gods his God!

 

[marhig]

I can agree with that. Above all things, love is first and most important, more important than doctrine. Paul says as much to the Corinthians. But to know God you must know Jesus Christ whom he has sent, and the significance of that is that to know Christ is to truly know God. If you cannot somehow make the obvious connection, like the way the DC universe can't quite figure out that Superman is Clark Kent, I believe that is forgivable. It does say that all sins can be forgiven, save blasphemy against the Holy Spirit.

Mat 12:31-32 KJV
(31) Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.
(32) And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.


Is an honest mistake as of the Son of Man was (and is, and is to come) blasphemy? Is it accusation of the undeniable power and being of God and assigning it to devils? I don't think that it is. But I'm not appealing on the basis of "subscribe or be tortured" but rather on the love of truth.

But rosenritter, Jesus doesn't say to know Christ is to truly know God. He says.

To know YOU the only true God and Jesus Christ whom YOU have sent

But you are right, to know Christ is to know God. Because God was in Jesus and he was seen fully through him because Jesus had the full strength of his spirit. It says in Hebrews 1 that Jesus was in the express image of God, meaning he isn't God but is in the image of God's person!

And how can it be blasphemy not to believe that Jesus is God? It doesn't say anywhere in the Bible that I have to believe that, but that I have to believe that Jesus Christ is the son of God, and I do!

 

[marhig]

Yet the Christ can still be the Alpha (first born) and the Omega( the final judge of all) without being considered the coeternal utter fullness of GOD and man.

The Holy Spirit that filled the Christ, Jesus was the first creation and all other creation was of that spirit which is GOD. GOD also appointed the Christ as the final judge and that same spirit is the Omega.

Is that nonsense or deemed heretical by the orthodox Christian?

Peace

Sent from my Z988 using Tapatalk

Pops (I call you this just to shorten your name, hope it's ok,)

I loved your post, yes he is the (alpha) first born and the omega (the final judge of all) he is also the beginning and the end.

I see that he is the firstborn of God and the firstborn in us, our foundation our rock, revealed by God to us that he is the Christ. He is also the final judge, I love this, and I've never seen it quite like that before but that's spot on! He came in flesh and judged us by the word of God, and he judges our hearts by the word within and when we speak the word that we have been given, he judges others through us. He's the final judge appointed of God. And we are judged by him.

He is the beginning and he is the end, the beginning of our new life in God and the end of our old life in the flesh. Once we hear the word of God we can either believe, or not. We have a choice, listen to his ministry of reconciliation, being washed by the word inside and out. Or live our life in the flesh and deny him. If we listen and obey him, he will be the beginning of our new life and the end of our old life we will be at one with him and God!

I don't know if you see it as I do, but I enjoyed your post and I agree with it all, thanks for sharing that

 

[marhig]

Did I say it was?

You haven't said it wasn't either!

No human being should take the life of another, God gave life and only God should take it away again. Just because Michael servetus didn't want to be killed by being beheaded, doesn't mean it was ok to kill him. It was a sin before God to take his life, regardless of what he believed. Thou shalt not kill, means just that! Nowhere in the Bible does it say that we have to believe in the trinity, or that we must believe in the trinity to be saved, man has added that on and it's a false teaching! Unless you can show me where it is in the Bible that is?

 

[Crucible]

No human being should take the life of another, God gave life and only God should take it away again. Just because Michael servetus didn't want to be killed by being beheaded, doesn't mean it was ok to kill him. It was a sin before God to take his life, regardless of what he believed. Thou shalt not kill, means just that! Nowhere in the Bible does it say that we have to believe in the trinity, or that we must believe in the trinity to be saved, man has added that on and it's a false teaching! Unless you can show me where it is in the Bible that is?

The Bible gives the green light for killing heretics. It's splashed through the entire whole of the Bible, and why Christianity practiced it up until the end of the Late Ages. Jesus never said a single thing about it either, nor the apostles- even though killing heretics was pretty routine.

Basically you are appealing to modern bias, and nothing more. When you actually want to go to history and the scriptures, let us know :wave:

 

[TulipBee]

You haven't said it wasn't either!

No human being should take the life of another, God gave life and only God should take it away again. Just because Michael servetus didn't want to be killed by being beheaded, doesn't mean it was ok to kill him. It was a sin before God to take his life, regardless of what he believed. Thou shalt not kill, means just that! Nowhere in the Bible does it say that we have to believe in the trinity, or that we must believe in the trinity to be saved, man has added that on and it's a false teaching! Unless you can show me where it is in the Bible that is?

I didn't say it was ok to kill. Anything else you want to make up? are you wasting my time?

 

[marhig]

The Bible gives the green light for killing heretics. It's splashed through the entire whole of the Bible, and why Christianity practiced it up until the end of the Late Ages. Jesus never said a single thing about it either, nor the apostles- even though killing heretics was pretty routine.

Basically, you are appealing to modern bias, and nothing more. When you actually want to go to history and the scriptures, let us know :wave:

What? How can loving God and following Christ make someone a heretic? Just because they don't believe in the trinity? Show me where it says in the Bible that I must believe in the trinity?

Jesus said that we should show violence to no man, he came in love and peace and cared for all, even forgiving those who hated him and killed him. And if we have his spirit within, then we will be like him. Not a murderer who kills others because they don't believe as we do.

Jesus breaks it down even more

Matthew 5

Ye have heard that it was said of them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment:
But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment

So even being angry without a cause is wrong, never mind killing!

That's the spirit of Satan, he's the murderer and a liar, and those who do these things are listening to him! The only way Gods people put to death, is with the sword of the mouth, which is the word of God given by the spirit of truth through Christ! Not through violent means, as Paul said our weapons of warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds.

Our weapon is the word of God, which is sharper than any two edged sword and it pulls down the strong holds of Satan by putting to death the lusts of the flesh through Christ by the spirit in our hearts, washing us clean and giving us a mouth to speak to bring Gods word to others!

Killing is wrong, and it is wrong before God to murder. Nothing makes it ok to do so. Only God has the right to take anyone's life, because God gave it!

 

[marhig]

I didn't say it was ok to kill. Anything else you want to make up? are you wasting my time?

No, but you are defending a man who killed many, Calvin was wrong to kill Michael Servetus. It wasn't good before God to kill the "heretic", and you haven't said it was the wrong thing to do either? It was a sin before the Almighty God and it was a wicked act. And Calvin was listening to Satan when he went about his murderous deeds plotting to have people put to death.

Nowhere in the Bible does it say that we have believe in the trinity to belong to God, it's a false teaching!

 

[popsthebuilder]

The Bible gives the green light for killing heretics. It's splashed through the entire whole of the Bible, and why Christianity practiced it up until the end of the Late Ages. Jesus never said a single thing about it either, nor the apostles- even though killing heretics was pretty routine.

Basically you are appealing to modern bias, and nothing more. When you actually want to go to history and the scriptures, let us know :wave:

Though Calvinism seems to hold many truths on some level. You personally are completely lost.

Explain to me, if you will; how one can love their enemy as themselves and simultaneously kill them from not believing in GOD and Christ in the exact same fashion as the perpetrator of the murder.

Pretty sure though shalt not kill predates and Christian doctrines. And I'm also pretty sure the Christ mentioned something about loving GOD with all your being and similarly, loving your neighbor as yourself. Just a side note, but love in the first case is that of utter unwavering grateful devotion, and in the second case it is a call to utter equity between all creation.

But you want to sit there and make broad statements about all but Calvinists. If you are one of the elect then you sure haven't been called to election yet. How soon know? By your words.

You really need to examine yourself and your motives. Honest introspection goes a long way.

Peace

Sent from my Z988 using Tapatalk

 

[Angel4Truth]

What? How can loving God and following Christ make someone a heretic?

John 8:24 That is why I told you that you will die in your sins, for unless you believe that I AM, you'll die in your sins." Several bible versions have the word he after the i am, there is no he in the greek. What was actually being stated was that Christ told them He is the one who was asked by moses who His name was.

This is why the jews wanted to stone Him for blasphemy. He plainly said to them that He was God.

Jesus again applies this name of God for Himself in John 8:56-58 “Your father Abraham rejoiced to see My day, and he saw it and was glad.” Then the Jews said to Him, “You are not yet fifty years old, and have You seen Abraham?”

“Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM.” I AM in Greek is Ego emi; is in the present indicative active form of the verb “to be.” Meaning, what is true of His being before is true of Him today, that He has no change from eternity past to eternity future (Malachi 3:6).

It was God who called Abraham out Gen.12:7-11: “And the LORD appeared unto Abram.” Stephen retelling this account says in Acts 7:2 tells us “The God of glory appeared to our father Abraham when he was in Mesopotamia, before he dwelt in Haran.” “And when Abram was ninety years old and nine, the LORD appeared to Abram, and said unto him, I am the Almighty God; walk before me, and be thou perfect.” It was God who interacted with Abraham.

They understood Jesus perfectly because we see their reaction to Jesus saying “Abraham rejoiced to see My day” and that He is I AM. (John 8:59) “Then they took up stones to throw at Him.” The only other time they picked up stones is recorded in John 10:30-33 when he said “I and My Father are one” (In Greek We are one). Then the Jews took up stones again to stone Him. Jesus answered them, “Many good works I have shown you from My Father. For which of those works do you stone Me?” The Jews answered Him, saying, “For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy, and because You, being a Man, make Yourself God.”

Again they understood His claim was being equal with God; being God. The Jewish leaders considered this idea blasphemous, they clearly understood his claim to be deity as elsewhere: “Therefore, the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God” (Jn. 5:18). So when Jesus tells them “Just what I have been saying to you from the beginning” (John 8:23-25), this was a consistent message of his explaining who he was. It was essential to grasp this fact and believe “for if you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins.” Their choice to reject his message was to reject God himself.

at the last supper he again makes it clear to his disciples John 13:19: “Now I tell you before it comes, that when it does come to pass, you may believe that I am He” Again the word He is added and not in the original text and reads “you may believe that I am.” What Jesus is emphasizing is that he foretells the future is the same one who is mentioned in the Scripture that foretells the future (Isaiah 48:3). That He is also whom the Scriptures speaks of (John 5:39). He foretold of his betrayal to prove He was the one Scripture spoke of; to prove His deity. What He spoke when fulfilled would give them understanding in knowing who He is.

http://www.letusreason.org/Trin19.htm

 

[marhig]

John 8:24 That is why I told you that you will die in your sins, for unless you believe that I AM, you'll die in your sins." Several bible versions have the word he after the i am, there is no he in the greek. What was actually being stated was that Christ told them He is the one who was asked by moses who His name was.

This is why the jews wanted to stone Him for blasphemy. He plainly said to them that He was God.

http://www.letusreason.org/Trin19.htm

And when the Jews wanted to stone him for as they saw it was making himself God, he corrected them by saying doesn't it say in your law that ye are god's to whom the spirit of God has come up on, but now say I blaspheme, because I say I am the son of God

Jesus doesn't plainly tell them that he is God, he plainly tells then that he is the son of God!

Jesus didn't say he was God, but the son of God.

It doesn't say believe that I am, but believe that I am he meaning believing that he is the son of the living God, that he is the Christ.

After he says that, he says this

Then said they unto him, Who art thou? And Jesus saith unto them, Even the same that I said unto you from the beginning.

Where does Jesus tell them he is God? He doesn't, he tells then that he is the son of God.

Here's verse 26 of John, 8

I have many things to say and to judge of you: but he that sent me is true; and I speak to the world those things which I have heard of him

It's clear in this verse that Jesus was sent, he was sent by God and that he speaks those things that God gives him to speak. Because God is his God.

Verse 28

When ye have lifted up the Son of man, then shall ye know that I am he, and that I do nothing of myself; but as my Father hath taught me, I speak these things. And he that sent meis with me: the Father hath not left me alone; for I do always those things that please him. As he spake these words, many believed on him

Here is the scripture word for word regarding the pharasees wanting to stone Jesus in John 10

John 10

The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.

Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?

If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken;

Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God?

They will die in their sins not because they don't believe that he is God, but because they don't believe in Jesus and that he is the son of God and because of the hardness of their hearts he can't save them!

Nowhere in the Bible does it say that we have to believe that Jesus is God, but we are to believe that Jesus is the son of God, and that he is the Christ!

 

[Crucible]

:yawn:

Heretics were put to death by God's own command, and through all Judaic and Christian history, a refusal to repent from heresy meant the death penalty.

People today reduce it all down to love and passivity, which is why Christianity is slowly dying- whenever this happens, people swear that the End Time is near. It has been repeated many times over in history, and then the Spirit descends unto man and man picks back up the reins.

You all need serious history lessons lain:

Christianity is not all roses and butterflies- quite frankly, I get tired of hearing notions straight out of fantasy- it's easy to sit there and act like a saint when the definition of a saint is refusing to do what is necessary and condemning those who do

 

[Angel4Truth]

And when the Jews wanted to stone him for as they saw it was making himself God, he corrected them by saying doesn't it say in your law that ye are god's to whom the spirit of God has come up on, but now say I blaspheme, because I say I am the son of God

Jesus doesn't plainly tell them that he is God, he plainly tells then that he is the son of God!

Jesus didn't say he was God, but the son of God.

It doesn't say believe that I am, but believe that I am he meaning believing that he is the son of the living God, that he is the Christ.

After he says that, he says this

Then said they unto him, Who art thou? And Jesus saith unto them, Even the same that I said unto you from the beginning.

Where does Jesus tell them he is God? He doesn't, he tells then that he is the son of God.

Here's verse 26 of John, 8

I have many things to say and to judge of you: but he that sent me is true; and I speak to the world those things which I have heard of him

It's clear in this verse that Jesus was sent, he was sent by God and that he speaks those things that God gives him to speak. Because God is his God.

Verse 28

When ye have lifted up the Son of man, then shall ye know that I am he, and that I do nothing of myself; but as my Father hath taught me, I speak these things. And he that sent meis with me: the Father hath not left me alone; for I do always those things that please him. As he spake these words, many believed on him

Here is the scripture word for word regarding the pharasees wanting to stone Jesus in John 10

John 10

The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.

Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?

If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken;

Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God?

They will die in their sins not because they don't believe that he is God, but because they don't believe in Jesus and that he is the son of God and because of the hardness of their hearts he can't save them!

Nowhere in the Bible does it say that we have to believe that Jesus is God, but we are to believe that Jesus is the son of God, and that he is the Christ!

Sigh, ive already told you, He most certainly told them He was God when He called Himself the name of God given to moses, you may not like that, but its fact.

Only God can forgive sins, also.

Mark 2:7 "Why does this man speak that way? He is blaspheming; who can forgive sins but God alone?"

This statement shows clearly that the jews understood that Christ was calling Himself God.

Isaiah 43:25 I, even I, am He that blots out your transgressions for My own sake

Isaiah 43:11
"I, even I, am the LORD, And there is no savior besides Me.


Acts 20:28 "Be on guard for yourselves and for all the flock, among which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to shepherd the church of God which He purchased with His own blood.


Doesn't get any clearer. That says God purchased the church with His own blood.

Do you receive God as He is in Spirit and truth?

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

:yawn:

Heretics were put to death by God's own command, and through all Judaic and Christian history, a refusal to repent from heresy meant the death penalty.

Post the Scripture verses that ask for Heretics to be executed? I don't remember reading about that?

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Hey, Crucible, if you're talking about the "Spanish Inquisition" or something along that line, it had nothing to do with the God of the Bible. Would you suggest we start executing Heretics today? If we did, most of the population of the world would have to be executed. Leaving maybe a couple of thousand people or so. At least there wouldn't be long lines at the grocery store anymore.

 

[Crucible]

Post the Scripture verses that ask for Heretics to be executed? I don't remember reading about that?

Of course you don't, because MADist's use everything of the Bible besides Paul's books as a paperweight :rotfl:

 

[Rosenritter]

'Woman hater' :chuckle:
I'm 28 years old, and am less affected by the current state of liberal bias then others in their 40's. No doubt, it has a lot to do with men advocating feminist philosophy as a way to adore their wife.

Which is diametrically opposed to anything biblical. I find it particularly odd that men are pretty much being controlled by college students, as that is where you all's Stockholm's syndrome comes from- young girls making you submit to what they want :AMR:


And
You show how much you grossly misunderstand Calvinism, because EVERY Christian is confident in being of the elect. What Calvinism teaches is that it is ultimately God who brings people within His grace, not the other way around.

Deuteronomy 4:29 KJV
(29) But if from thence thou shalt seek the LORD thy God, thou shalt find him, if thou seek him with all thy heart and with all thy soul.

Luke 11:9-10 KJV
(9) And I say unto you, Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you.
(10) For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.

Seems to me that "seeking" is an action we are expected to take, and that God has promised to accept all that seek him. God brings people into his grace that seek him. The idea that God forces certain people "to seek him" defies the very meaning and essence of the word "seek."

 

[Rosenritter]

Rev.chs 4 and 5 prove you wrong.

as does Heb.ch s 1 and 2.

You are reading something into the text which is not there.

LA

LA, you need a better answer than that.

 

[Rosenritter]

Clete, if all thing we're created through Jesus and for Jesus. Who created them through him and for him?

And God is reconciling and saving through Christ. Everything is done through him.

2 Corinthians 5

And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ,and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation; To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

Jesus was begotten of the father, meaning the father came before him and he has come from God and is born of God, not that he is God! He is the only begotten son of God and he's in his express image

Hebrews 1

God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,

Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things by whom also he made the worlds;

Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;"

It's Gods glory through Jesus and God glorifies Christ. Jesus is in the express image of God's person and Jesus Christ had Gods power, Because God was in him in fullness of the spirit because Jesus Christ laid down his life and did the will of God not his own will, to bring us back, thus he is our saviour. Saving us from flesh, sin and the world through a new and living way.

And look at this verse

1 John 5:1

Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.

So God begat Jesus

Hebrews 1:5

For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?

God begat Jesus but Jesus was begotten of him! God is the father and Jesus is the son, son of God not God the son!

And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth.

Jesus is the word of God because that's all he speaks, Gods word because he is the Christ. The anointed of God. If Jesus is the Christ, then there must be a God above him to anoint him, if he was God, then he would not have needed to be anointed because he would be God!

It says in the Bible, God exhalted Jesus, and the Christ is under subjection to him and that God is his head of Christ and that God is the God of Jesus. i can see so much in the new testament pointing God being the God of Jesus Christ that I have to believe it. And I believe Jesus when he says that Gods his God!

Marhig, who begat Rosenritter? I am a flesh and blood person, and I don't naturally live within the universe called Theology Online. I created Rosenritter for the purpose of speaking to you here. Rosenritter is the only begotten Theology Online account of Andrew.

But if we met on the street, I could tell you that "I am Rosenritter" and you wouldn't believe me?

Your analysis is hardly being fair. Your theory has contradictions, contradictions which you keep sidestepping. You aren't allowing the obvious alternative fair consideration.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Of course you don't, because MADist's use everything of the Bible besides Paul's books as a paperweight :rotfl:

Your "Wit" is in the non-existent area and your ability to answer a simple question is not to be found within the confines of this dimension. :chuckle: