beloved57
Well-known member
You and gt both teach salvation by works, by what a person does! You deny Justification by Faith, in fact you don't know what it means. You say it because you see it in the bible, but your own comments deny it.
Does Calvinism Make God Unjust?
- Thread starter Robert Pate
- Start date
You and gt both teach salvation by works, by what a person does! You deny Justification by Faith, in fact you don't know what it means. You say it because you see it in the bible, but your own comments deny it.
Ask Mr. Religion
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Asked and answered. :AMR:
I normally do not engage the anti-Trinitarian in order to give them a platform for their heresies.
Do us all a favor and register your view in the Poll here:
http://theologyonline.com/showthread.php?115654-The-Trinity
This will save us plenty of time in the future.
AMR
I think it's hilarious how some people on here attack Calvinists with "You don't believe in justification by faith"-
because John Calvin was a co-founder of the actual doctrine.
They aren't even going against Calvinism anymore- they are going against some imagined terror of which they call 'Calvinism' :chuckle:
because John Calvin was a co-founder of the actual doctrine.
They aren't even going against Calvinism anymore- they are going against some imagined terror of which they call 'Calvinism' :chuckle:
Eagles Wings
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Your posts are well done, AMR, and expose the positions of people here.
I see you're "easily amused." Good for you, I like seeing a smiling/silly face.
You can hope. I hope God inspires you.
marhig
Well-known member
No you didn't answer, I asked you for the verse that says that those who don't believe in the trinity don't belong to Christ? Just one verse actually written here but you haven't shown me.
It's a shame you feel like that, because you sound very self righteous and you shouldn't look down on others, they could have a better heart towards God than you. But God will judge you. I hope that hardness leaves you one day.
I don't think I'll look at that link, because I don't judge others, I leave that to God seeing he's the righteous judge and we are just flesh and can't possibly know the hearts of others enough to condemn them!
marhig
Well-known member
If his post was well done then he could answer me.
Maybe you can answer me, can you show me the verse in the scriptures that says that we don't belong to Christ if we don't believe in the trinity? Or even that we are not saved unless we believe in the trinity?
You talk about exposing people's positions, well, when we judge others as not belonging to Christ because they don't believe as we do, even though we don't know their hearts, and when we start making ourselves as God and deciding who is and who isn't saved, then I think that exposes people very well, they show exactly what their heart is like from their own mouths, as do those who agree with them!
I hope that all get into heaven, but only God knows who are truly his, no human being can ever know that even though they think they do!
marhig
Well-known member
Oh well, never mind
You can't deny Jesus' Deity and be Christian.
The Muslims still cling to the Old Law because they reject the Trinity, which is what it takes for Jesus to suffice as the Lamb. It makes the entire thing vain when God could have just chosen any person or angel to the cross.
Or none at all
This is what non-Trinitarian believers fail to understand. If any of the apostles were here today, they would flat out tell you that he is GOD :doh:
The Muslims still cling to the Old Law because they reject the Trinity, which is what it takes for Jesus to suffice as the Lamb. It makes the entire thing vain when God could have just chosen any person or angel to the cross.
Or none at all
This is what non-Trinitarian believers fail to understand. If any of the apostles were here today, they would flat out tell you that he is GOD :doh:
Ask Mr. Religion
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The student of history will find that the men of the Reformation, Martin Luther, Ulrich Zwingli, William Tyndale, Heinrich Bullinger, and John Calvin, did not discover something not already plainly contained in Scripture.
These men merely recovered these teachings against those of the Romanist church of their day. This is why name Protestant arose. The Reformers were protesting the corruption of Scripture and calling for the church to reform to the proper teachings of Scripture. The Protestant Reformation was primarily a moment when God led the church deeper into the truth of the gospel and further into the teaching of their need for the Bible. Unfortunately, these men of their times are now held in disdain by not a few of those that wear the very label these men represented.
AMR
God's Truth
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AMR,
You have a lot of posts of mine where I proved you do not have right understanding of the scriptures that you use.
You were lazy and merely posted scripture references and then copy and pasted an old puffed up speech of yours.
I did a lot of work yesterday answering everything you said in that sorry of an excuse for a defense of what you call truth.
Now I expect you to answer everything I answered in reply.
Calvinism is in opposition to the doctrine of justification by faith.
Justification does not mean that faith justifies. What it means is that Christ is the justifier, Romans 3:26.
Christ makes us righteous in God's eyes. We are justified by the doing and the dying of Jesus. In our name and on our behalf Jesus fulfills the law and atones for our sins.
it is our faith that makes the Gospel ours. Because we are justified by faith predestination is worthless.
God's Truth
New member
Did you see how I answered every single thing he posted as a defense for the false doctrines of Calvinism?
Where is his replies to what I have said? He is a poor excuse for a so called debater and knowledgeable man.
As for the anti trinitarian list he gave and special condemnation to those who do not believe as he does, he did not give one scripture and biblical explanation to his Catholic beliefs.
God's Truth
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Nowhere anywhere in the Bible does it say we do not have to obey Jesus.
You preach faith alone which the Bible mentions one time and it is to warn us of what kind of faith not to have.
A little child can rebuke your ignorant teaching.
"No longer" must be future tense. We guess your past tense belief isn't obedience to you if it came before "no longer"
Ask Mr. Religion
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True.You can't deny Jesus' Deity and be Christian.
The Muslims still cling to the Old Law because they reject the Trinity, which is what it takes for Jesus to suffice as the Lamb. It makes the entire thing vain when God could have just chosen any person or angel to the cross.
Or none at all
This is what non-Trinitarian believers fail to understand. If any of the apostles were here today, they would flat out tell you that he is GOD :doh:
Some claim that to insist that only Christianity is true is intolerant. It's no more intolerant than insisting that whoever says two plus two equals anything but four is wrong. Toleration isn't a matter of what's true, it's a matter of what's permitted. Christians permit people to believe as they wish. They just say that some beliefs are false, others true.
Yes, there are many belief systems, but there is only One True God, the I AM of the Christian bible. We should seek to worship this God according to His revelation to mankind. To worship other beliefs is basically idolatry, forbidden by God. Of all the world’s religions, only Christianity possesses all of the following attributes:
1. Other religions revolve around their founder’s teachings, rules, regulations, and rituals. Christianity, however, revolves around a Living Person, the risen Jesus Christ.
2. Christianity is unique because it is based upon historical facts and the revelation of God in the Bible.
3. Christianity is the only religion that offers the assurance and security of salvation.
4. Christianity is the only religion that teaches that salvation is an unmerited free gift of God’s grace. There is nothing a person can do to merit salvation, since it is granted through faith granted by God Himself, apart from works.
5. Other religions were started because of man’s attempt to search for the supernatural, search for the truth, appease their innate sense of sin and guilt, and find favor with his god. But Christianity is the account of God’s search for mankind. "For the Son of Man has come to see and to save that which was lost" (Luke 19:10; John 10:10). God’s love for us was the reason He has revealed Himself to us through His Son Jesus Christ and by His grace we are saved (Ephesians 2:8-9).
6. Only Christianity reveals God as the Triune God - God as the Father, God as the Son, and God as the Spirit.
7. Christianity is exclusive in its claims. How is Christianity Exclusive?
A. The God of Christianity is claimed to be the only true God (Jeremiah 10:10; Jude 25).
B. The Bible is claimed to be the Word of God and the only true revelation from God (Isaiah 8:20; Revelation 22:18-19; 2 Timothy 3:16).
Investigation by even the most skeptical will also reveal that there exists NO SINGLE SCIENTIFIC DISCOVERY that has been shown to prove error, factually or doctrinally, in the Bible. There is lots of speculation and hypotheses, but not a single verifiable fact.
As a simple experiment, try turning one's objective intellect towards the argument that no book, comprising 66 “mini-books”, written over a period of 1500 years by 40 vastly different authors, possessing an outstanding literary internal consistency and coherency, could be written by man alone. Add to that the survival of the book’s ancient manuscripts, numbering in the tens of thousands, over thousands of years and yet these manuscripts remain over 98% textually pure. How this possible, when compared to all the other ancient writings are so few in number? For instance, the Dead Sea Scrolls contain all books of the Old Testament, except Esther, and have been dated to before the time of Christ. Now consider Julius Caesar’s Gallic Wars. Only ten copies written about 1,000 years after the event are in existence. In comparison, there are over 24,000+ New Testament manuscripts, the earliest one dating to within 24 years after Christ. How can we objectively and rationally explain this book, the Bible, especially in light of the claims made above?
An honest study of biblical prophecies that have come true will compellingly show the divine authorship of the Bible. Furthermore, archaeology confirms (or in some cases supports) accounts in the biblical record. No other presumed holy book comes close to the Bible in the amount of evidence supporting its divine authorship.
C. No other religion claims that the one, true, God came down to earth and walked among us as did Jesus Christ.
D. The Biblical way of Salvation is the only way of salvation. There is no other way (John 3:36). No matter how good, religious or sincere a person may be, unless he or she has faith in the work of Jesus Christ they will not be saved. "Nor is there salvation in any other, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved" (Acts 4:12).
E. Jesus Christ claims to be the only way to God, the only way of salvation and the only way to eternal life in heaven (John 3:16-17). Jesus said, "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me" (John 14:6).
From the above, it should be evident that there is something very different about Christianity. There is a reason for this difference, too.
AMR
The Bible says that you can't obey Jesus. That is what makes you a sinner? And in your case a hypocrite.
You dont reconized your core is rotton at ALL. You're good enough to play god according to your mormonism. Little god
God's Truth
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Robert Pate goes against the Calvinists and is himself like them in many ways.
They are half siblings who argue among each other on who obeys God the least.
Jesus says to believe and obey.
Calvinists say, "No, I will not and cannot believe and obey you until you save me first."
Robert Pate says: "No, I will not obey you until after you save me, but I will believe."
You both misunderstand Paul about no works. Paul is speaking about the righteous works of the old law that the people used to do to clean themselves. Paul is NOT saying we are saved by believing and not obeying!
They are half siblings who argue among each other on who obeys God the least.
Jesus says to believe and obey.
Calvinists say, "No, I will not and cannot believe and obey you until you save me first."
Robert Pate says: "No, I will not obey you until after you save me, but I will believe."
You both misunderstand Paul about no works. Paul is speaking about the righteous works of the old law that the people used to do to clean themselves. Paul is NOT saying we are saved by believing and not obeying!