These are two statements that mean different things to different people.
cheap salvation
- Thread starter meshak
- Start date
Cheap salvation pushers' comments are very much alike.
I know you are one of them too.
You have so many threads about "our works cannot save us" type.
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musterion
Well-known member
He thinks he's a Jew, idiot.
Your view puts Christ's work on the cross in 2nd place behind your obedience. You crucify Christ again. Hebrews 6:6 KJV - Your beliefs make Jesus a failure, because you think you have to do your part to be saved.
Why do you think Jesus, the Son of God, was sent to earth ? To give us commands ? Yes in part, but the main purpose of Jesus was to redeem us, and you pay no attention to Jesus' own words after He is risen.
What I am trying to say is that people might say one before the other, or that works and obedience are not always viewed as the same thing. To obey God and Christ. To obey the gospel. But to know no one is saved by works.
Why do you say that? I am a disciple of Jesus. I have no problem saying I am a follower of Jesus.
what's your point?
We are to obey God and Jesus Christ.
If you believe we are not saved by work or are not saved by obedience, why do you believe this? If a person believes they are not saved by obedience do they then also believe they are not saved by works?
Do you believe a person can be saved by works? And, do you believe a person can be saved by the works of the Law? Explain your answer. If so, how so? If not, how not?
Can a person think they are obeying God and Christ and find out they are not saved? Is it possible to think you are obeying when you are not? I believe yes.
But it is not your obedience that saves you. It is the blood of Jesus who died for you.
Do you preach obedience to Jesus to unbelievers? Do you preach it to believers? You may have women you can share with or those younger than yourself who are young women or what not.
The point is that obedience to Jesus makes sense. And that at the same time a person who is obedient to Jesus ought to be saved, but isn't necessarily saved? How can a person make sure they are saved when they believe they are being obedient? By realizing salvation is in God and Christ alone and not in their obedience. And then obey Jesus with everything you have!
Then to obey Jesus is for more than Israel and the Jews. It is for Gentiles (the nations) as well. Because we are saying that obedience to Jesus goes beyond Jesus being born under the Law to redeem those under the Law, and the jurisdiction of the old covenant and the Law of Israel which is rightly known as God's Law. If God's Law is for all, and the Law of Moses and the Ten Commandments is for the nation of Israel, then we know what righteousness according to the Law is. And we know what salvation according to Jesus is. Is this a righteousness by obedience? Or a righteousness to those who are of faith? Jesus said to repent and believe the gospel. He also said that those who love Him obey His commandments. "He who has my commandments and keeps them, He is the one who loves Me."
Is this about knowing God and Jesus?
John 14:21 NASB - 21 "He who has My commandments and keeps them is the one who loves Me; and he who loves Me will be loved by My Father, and I will love him and will disclose Myself to him."
How is a person saved Meshak? Do you know? What do you believe?
That's what I have been saying all these years.
and that's what this thread is all about.
In fact, most of my threads are about obedience to Jesus.
Considering who started this doctrine who were murder, it cannot be of God.
Amen to obeying Jesus and being obedient to Jesus, even though I was born a Gentile!
Salvation should not be complicated. We should know that we should obey Jesus even before we are saved. The other option, be it that we should obey Jesus (He told us to repent and believe the gospel), is to have faith and obey Him. Then our obedience comes after and or as a result of our faith whether faith is obedience or not (it is, but I know salvation and justification are by faith, and not of works). The good works God has for us to do are for saved people to do... and saved people can do them!
Is it impossible to obey Jesus if you are not a Christian? I know a person can try. But I know at that point, being unsaved and an unbeliever, there is a sense in which a person is powerless to obey.
I knew I sinned, as an unbeliever, and when I found out about salvation all I knew was I need to be saved. I believe God saved me in Christ.