Why would God need a hell?

[Mickiel]

Let me tell you why Christians can't condemn you, in Luke 5:24 Jesus said that he has power to forgive all sins on earth. That's your salvation in a nutshell right there; Christianity cannot take it from you. A Christian may not forgive your sin of rejecting Christ and not believing, but they are not Jesus; Jesus came here to forgive you. Jesus did not get beaten to death, in order for you to be beaten for eternity in a Christian hell.

 

[serpentdove]

The leaven of the Pharisees and Sadducees is belief in eternal hell punishing

The beliefs of Pharisees and Sadducees differed.

Leaven is figurative of: kingdom of heaven (Matt. 13:33), corrupt teaching (Matt. 16:6, 12), infectious sin (1 Cor. 5:5–7), false doctrine (Gal. 5:1–9). Thomas Nelson Publishers. (1996). Nelson’s quick reference topical Bible index (p. 376). Nashville, TN: Thomas Nelson Publishers.

 

[Totton Linnet]

Read Romans seven much? what is going to happen to Paul's flesh that is stated as being no good thing? better look in the mirror before you send anyone to hell forever.

Thanks be to God Christ delivered Paul from that wretchedness. it will not be me who says the dread words "depart from Me ye cursed into eternal punishment..."


....you should take it up with Jesus.

 

[Mickiel]

Can you find for me the place in the gospels where Jesus plainly says to His opponents "ye are of your father the devil and His lusts you do"

Were you born a Child of God? If you say no, then you believe there was a time you were not his child. Who's child were you before your conversion?

 

[Mickiel]

A time comes when you just have to fight Christians, to keep them from thinking they can condemn the world. To keep them from throwing people into their hell.

 

[Totton Linnet]

You know this makes me wonder; could a human suffering in the Christian hell, ever escape?

I mean, he could get slick and get out, if he waits until about the 9 trillion years of suffering mark; hey, after all that time, the guards may not be paying attention. He would just have to figure out a way to put the fire on his skin out, then figure out where he is going to go when he runs.

My only advice to him in his escape, is to steer clear of Christians, or your sure to get thrown back in.

This is the crux of your problem, you see everything with your natural eyes. You see sin, say murder, and you seem to think it no great deal so you say to the murderer "go in peace, it will go well for you"

We do not suppose ourselves able to properly judge these matters so we trust the word of the Lord.

And we do trust His judgement.

 

[Totton Linnet]

you are so wrong

your hate has blinded you

you really need help
and
all you have to do is ask for it

Get to your knees and tell the Lord He was wrong to call those Pharisees the devil's children [they were soon to nail Him to the cross] tell HIM that He is filled with hate.

 

[Mickiel]

This is the crux of your problem, you see everything with your natural eyes. You see sin, say murder, and you seem to think it no great deal so you say to the murderer "go in peace, it will go well for you"

We do not suppose ourselves able to properly judge these matters so we trust the word of the Lord.

And we do trust His judgement.

I see Christianity with my natural eyes as well, how they are self righteous and condemning the world of unbelievers. The Apostle Paul was murdering Believers in God before he was converted, if you were God, he would have never became an Apostle, because you would have thrown him in your hell.

And God desires that all men be saved, Christians in no manner trust in that judgment of God.

 

[Totton Linnet]

The world is suffering, and believers are preaching eternal hell suffering
The world is in increasing pain, and believers are teaching eternal pain in hell
Children are crying in this world, and believers are preaching that humans will cry forever in hell
This world is hurting, and believers are witnessing that God will hurt people forever in hell
The bible is the worlds most shoplifted book, eternal hell misery is the books most perverted message; it is shoplifting sinners from the Kingdom of God.

That the world is suffering is PROOF that man has fallen, is on the wrong path and if he does not alter course it will lead him to eternal suffering.

If you had any pity you would warn them...tell the TRUTH ye liars, you don't love anyone.

 

[Totton Linnet]

why would a christian want others to suffer?

why do they think God wants them to suffer?

it doesn't make sense

Why do you pretend to care about abortion? it doesn't make sense.

 

[serpentdove]

"Did you know that Jesus was sent to earth to destroy the works of the devil? Read that in 1 John 3:8...If you are being taught that millions of humans are going to be in some hell, what happened to them when Jesus destroyed Satan's work? What, they just got left out? They missed the train?"

Jews rejected Jesus. God applied the blood of Joseph's coat to the tribes. Otherwise they would have been wiped out. They would have had no sacrifice for their sins (Ge 37:31-33, Mt 27:25, Heb 9:22).

"Right Living (1 Jn 2:29–3:10)

John again emphasized the importance of right action as a demonstration of Christian commitment. Christians who had been divinely begotten of God had the privilege of experiencing God’s love and living as members of His family. They were to demonstrate their family membership by righteous living. John indicated that Christ had come to take away our sins (3:5). Jesus had died for the purpose of causing us to stop sinning.

John pointed out that the person who made a practice of sinning had never known Christ. In verse 9 he indicated that the experience of a believer in conversion rendered the practice of sin a moral impossibility. John was not suggesting that a Christian will never commit an act of sin. He did indicate that a believer could not live in the practice of sin.

The conclusion in verse 10 pointed out the importance of righteous behavior and also underscored the significance of loving other believers. It makes a good transition from discussion of right action to another presentation of the proper attitude, an attitude of love." Lea, T. D. (1998). The General Letters. In D. S. Dockery (Ed.), Holman concise Bible commentary (p. 647). Nashville, TN: Broadman & Holman Publishers.

 

[Mickiel]

That the world is suffering is PROOF that man has fallen, is on the wrong path and if he does not alter course it will lead him to eternal suffering.

If you had any pity you would warn them...tell the TRUTH ye liars, you don't love anyone.

Mankind has not fallen, that's a bunch of Christian baloney; we were born in sin, there has never been a time that humanity has lived upright. The fall is a Christian myth, God created us in sin and conceived us already down and out.

 

[Totton Linnet]

Well the best answer is " Deception", they have been deceived. In Rev. 12:9, the devil has deceived the whole world, and Christians are not excluded from that. The seduction of the Christian mind has been a dazzeling display of satans power to seduce. And the devil has used the bible to do this; its easier to seduce a believer, if you use the bible and a church, or a pastor or a preacher. You make the believer think that what they are believing is God's will. In this manner satan " Appears as god" to them, and the seduction is made complete.

satan, years ago, even changed how the bible was being translated, because hell does not even appear in the original text. Its been a masterful seduction of the believing mind; its VERY well planted now, and cannot be uprooted by any power but God; so God is aware of this. Its not the believers fault, because powers FAR greater than they have completed the deception before they were even born. They were raised with hell, taught it from their birth. More than one religion is teaching it, more than one culture believes it; its really been a worldwide deception.

Anyone who believes it, is just deceived; blind; totally off base concerning what God will do with unbelievers. Some believers here will fight for hell; they will argue for it to be true! They will call you a blasphemer if you don't believe it. Its a stunning deception, and absolute proof to me that the powers of deception are absolute and incredible in their reach and ability. Some believers are more excited about hell than they are heaven. The power of deception is gripping; for example;

Not long ago a rumor started in the church, through pastors and teachers, that the bible mentions hell more than it does heaven. A stunning lie, but as usual , it caught fire and millions of believers swallowed it, hook, line and sinker; the sheer power of deception. Hell is mentioned 54 times in some bibles, heaven is mentioned over 1500 times in all bibles. Its not even close. And a simple study and short research of any concordance would show anyone this, but people just will not study.

A real study of the history of hell would show people the truth, but they cannot see it because of the spirit of stupor that comes with hell belief, is over them. Its a spirit that wants to keep the person in ignorance, and most of the people " Love the deception." They don't WANT to let it go. In example, a simple true study of Christmas and Easter would reveal the obvious pagan origins of them, but people love these holidays and don't want to give them up. They are their traditions.

Hell is mentioned 54 times in the bible....why do you deny it?

You believe in Satan, you believe he is a deceiver, Jesus said hell was created for him and his angels....if people follow him where will they end up?

And you are a professed liar if you say Christ did not warn against eternal punishment...false preacher, a buddy of Satan, joining him in his deception.

God will punish you.

 

[Mickiel]

Jews rejected Jesus. God applied the blood of Joseph's coat to the tribes. Otherwise they would have been wiped out. They would have had no sacrifice for their sins (Ge 37:31-33, Mt 27:25, Heb 9:22).

"Right Living (1 Jn 2:29–3:10)

John again emphasized the importance of right action as a demonstration of Christian commitment. Christians who had been divinely begotten of God had the privilege of experiencing God’s love and living as members of His family. They were to demonstrate their family membership by righteous living. John indicated that Christ had come to take away our sins (3:5). Jesus had died for the purpose of causing us to stop sinning.

John pointed out that the person who made a practice of sinning had never known Christ. In verse 9 he indicated that the experience of a believer in conversion rendered the practice of sin a moral impossibility. John was not suggesting that a Christian will never commit an act of sin. He did indicate that a believer could not live in the practice of sin.

The conclusion in verse 10 pointed out the importance of righteous behavior and also underscored the significance of loving other believers. It makes a good transition from discussion of right action to another presentation of the proper attitude, an attitude of love." Lea, T. D. (1998). The General Letters. In D. S. Dockery (Ed.), Holman concise Bible commentary (p. 647). Nashville, TN: Broadman & Holman Publishers.

Show me a scripture that claims God came here for a Christian.

Show me a scripture that claims salvation is only for Christians.

Show me a scripture where God or Christ personally say that they sanction Christianity or endorse it.

The whole earth is the Lords, and salvation is for us all.

 

[Totton Linnet]

I have admitted to being a heretic
meaning that my views are not necessarily catholic ones
but
guess which belief amr, a former catholic priest, is most upset with

the fact that I don't believe in hell

go figure

Your views are not Christ's views either

 

[Totton Linnet]

Well one of the greatest human peer pressures, is religious peer pressure. They want you to believe exactly like the religion is traditionally taught to believe , and some of them will put you out if you don't comply. And much of this started in your church, the Catholic church, which I think is a deceived church of God; the first one deceived on a mass scale. It all started in Rome, and branched out from there. The original church did not teach hell, they learned it from their surrounding cultures, and as they grew and accepted more members, some of those members already believed in hell, and the belief got incorporated into the church.

Even science could not accept this hell teaching, because they were realist, but they were members of the church. Science got tired of these weird teachings of the Bishops, and they rebelled and left the church; that was called, " The Scientific Revolution." But either you accept their teachings, or you leave. Or just stay and keep your mouth shut. Because if you go against them, they gang up on you, and then you just got trouble; you cannot get into a deceived mindset; that mind is set on what it believes and set like concrete.

You have a lying deceitful spirit. It is the fundamentalist, the bible believer who are the ones who are ostracised and treated as dimbos

 

[Totton Linnet]

In my view, if you have a need to follow someone, then that is what you are going to do. Because its a need. I think a believer in God should follow God, his Holy Spirit, and his word. I am not in to the following a human thingy. I personally don't trust that, and don't need that. But I understand that not everyone is cut that way, some people need the crutch of leaning on a pastor or leader, I personally think that is one of the reasons the church got so messed up in the first place; the blind leading the blind.

Why do you not say you follow Jesus?

Because we will show you His words which you say is a lie

 

[Mickiel]

And you are a professed liar if you say Christ did not warn against eternal punishment...false preacher, a buddy of Satan, joining him in his deception.

God will punish you.

I understand it is your nature to insult me, call me names and condemn me; I understand that. I will not do those things to you in response, I have no need to. I believe as much in your salvation as I do mine. I know you " Want" God to punish me; I know that you would punish me if God left it up to you. And I know you would hurt me forever and ever; I know that about Christianity.

And I think its ugly. I am so happy that God has not placed Christianity in charge of any of this serious business.

 

[Totton Linnet]

Lets get back into some word. In John 12:47, again Jesus, "And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him NOT, for I come NOT to judge the world, but to save the world." Now right here Jesus reveals that unbelief cannot stop salvation! Any person that does not believe in God or accept Christ, Jesus teaches here that he is NOT judging them! Now believers in God will judge you to their hell for not accepting Christ, but Jesus did NOT teach that!

Jesus taught that he came here to save a world! Jesus said if they don't believe in him, he does NOT judge them; so what are you doing judging them for their unbelief?

Jesus did not come to judge but

John.9.39.
"for judgement I am come into the world, that those who see not may see and those who see may be made blind."

When He comes at the last day it will be to judge

 

[Timotheos]

Here in Connecticut it is 30 degrees, cloudy, no wind to speak of. Yesterday we had some rain.:rain:

Super cold again today, 2 below zero with a windchill, and I had to drive the (open) tractor to salt the driveway at work.