Why would God need a hell?

[Mickiel]

Perhaps you grossly underestimate the gravity of sin and do not see it from God's perspective.

What does "other" mean in your description, by the way?

Other means I am not any of the listed. I am not in any religion, I walk alone in my belief, but some believe similar to some things I accept. I just do not accept hell as a solution designed by God, but by religious men. The true reputation of the Kingdom of God has suffered violence by misinformed men who actually believe; Matt. 11:12, and the worst of that violence, in my view, is this doctrine of eternal hell punishing. Its violent; do they know how long eternity really is?

Its like believing that God would punish humans alive for 900 million years, multiplied by another 10 trillion years of unheard of existence, and still the suffering has just only began. Its insane! For 70 years of sinning, I get 999,888,777 quadrillion years of misery, and its only just starting. No, no, I will never accept that God would allow such a thing, and this has turned many, many humans off from God. I don't care how bad sin is, its not worth all that misery.

 

[OCTOBER23]

Why would God need a hell?

For all those people that keep Xmas.

Jeremiah 10:3 For the customs of the people are vain:

for one cutteth a tree out of the forest,

the work of the hands of the workman, with the axe.

4 They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it move not.
5 They are upright as the palm tree, but speak not: they must needs be borne,

because they cannot go.

Be not afraid of them; for they cannot do evil,

neither also is it in them to do good.

 

[Mickiel]

Probably the heart of the discussion and question right there, Musterion. He doesn't appear to embrace Christ or Christianity.

You probably do not realize Jesus talked quite a bit about hell. Now you said 'Christians' so I assume you are no follower of Christ or Christianity by such. Such makes this quite a bit different in conversation. I'll ask again: If someone doesn't want God, where else can they go? Answer: Nowhere, else.

I don't embrace Christian theology, and I certainly don't view Christianity as holding a monopoly on the truth. I embrace the bible.

 

[quip]

allah is not real nor is zeus

Jesus called it hate

Joh_7:7 The world cannot hate you, but it hates me because I testify about it that its works are evil.

This is beside the point.
You have your presuppositions and I have mine. Mine are clear from any desires of "hate".

Yours?

 

[way 2 go]

Probably the heart of the discussion and question right there, Musterion. He doesn't appear to embrace Christ or Christianity.

not the biblical one

the God who said this:
Luk 19:27 But those who are my enemies, who did not desire that I should reign over them, bring them here and slay them before me.

 

[way 2 go]

I don't embrace Christian theology, and I certainly don't view Christianity as holding a monopoly on the truth. I embrace the bible.

embrace this
Joh_14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

reject it and...
Mat 25:46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

 

[way 2 go]

This is beside the point.
You have your presuppositions and I have mine. Mine are clear from any desires of "hate".

Yours?

your point was you did not hate fictional beings

if someone said I love you to your face and you and looked
them in the eye and then walked away that would be
hate

when you hear Jesus died for you and say you don't care
does not exist .
hate.

 

[patrick jane]

The word "hell" refers to the grave. Death and the grave will be destroyed in a lake of fire.

God is only calling a few into a relationship with Jesus Christ at this time.

If by few you mean billions upon billions then yes, few.

 

[Mickiel]

embrace this
Joh_14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

reject it and...
Mat 25:46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

Here's something Jesus taught that I embrace, which cancels out the Christian hell; Matt. 24:21, " For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, " Nor shall ever be!" This tribulation will occur before Christ returns, and Jesus taught that it will be worse than anything ever was in human history, and nothing to come would ever compare to it. Nothing in the future can be as bad; that cancels out eternal suffering, because if it were true, NOTHING could ever be worse than that!

Eternal misery would far surpass the tribulation; and I embrace this teaching of Jesus.

 

[jamie]

Listen to the Testimony of Yeshua in the Gospel accounts and what he says concerning all these things: "hellfire", or "everlasting fire", or "fire into the age"

Everlasting fire doesn't last forever.

...as Sodom and Gomorrah, and the cities around them in a similar manner to these, having given themselves over to sexual immorality and gone after strange flesh, are set forth as an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire. (Jude 1:7 NKJV)​

It's the result of the fire that lasts forever, not the fire itself.

 

[Hedshaker]

Clearly not believing does not = hate. The very idea that someone would hate something that doesn't exist is just plain daft, not to mention illogical.

But even if logic could be turned on its head and, just for the sake of argument, take the view that disbelievers hate God. Even then, eternal torture without reprieve for such a relatively minor crime is way over the top. It boggles the mind to wonder what punishment would be worthy of drawing God-cartoons?

No real God would act the way. Solid evidence for his none existence.

 

[musterion]

The very idea that someone would hate something that doesn't exist is just plain daft, not to mention illogical.

Then explain virulent atheists who bristle and rage at the very mention of a nonexistent God.

 

[jamie]

You probably do not realize Jesus talked quite a bit about hell.

Jesus not only talked about hell, he went there.

...he, foreseeing this, spoke concerning the resurrection of the Christ, that His soul was not left in Hades, nor did His flesh see corruption. (Acts 2:31 NKJV)​

 

[way 2 go]

Here's something Jesus taught that I embrace, which cancels out the Christian hell; Matt. 24:21, " For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, " Nor shall ever be!" This tribulation will occur before Christ returns, and Jesus taught that it will be worse than anything ever was in human history, and nothing to come would ever compare to it. Nothing in the future can be as bad; that cancels out eternal suffering, because if it were true, NOTHING could ever be worse than that!

Eternal misery would far surpass the tribulation; and I embrace this teaching of Jesus.

Matt. 24:21 is talking about tribulation on earth for everyone

Rev 20:11,12

Rev 20:14 Then Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire.
Rev 20:15 And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.

 

[Hedshaker]

Those who do not believe in God also reject the existence of hell and heaven, obviously.

But they surly see clear evidence for cloud cuckoo land

 

[Mickiel]

Matt. 24:21 is talking about tribulation on earth for everyone
.

That's right, and Jesus said nothing like it has ever happened before, and nothing as bad as it will ever happen again; which cancels out the Christian hell, because IF the Christian version of hell were true, then this teaching of Christ must be removed from the bible; because it would be FAR worse than the tribulation.

Another verse would have to be removed from the bible to satisfy the Christian hell, Rev. 21:4, " And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there will be no more death, no more sorrow, no more crying, and no more pain; all these things shall PASS AWAY!" If the Christian version of eternal hell were true, then pain, crying and sorrow would NEVER pass away! It would always exist in eternity.

 

[way 2 go]

I agree hell is the grave. The Old Testament mentions hell 31 times, each of those times it means " Sheol", the Hebrew for grave, and nobody in the OT is ever threatened with eternal hell punishing as a result from sin, no one.

Dan 12:2 And many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

 

[Greg Jennings]

He had 70 years to decide he hates God. The better question is: Why would he want to live with a God he has rejected all his life? He clearly doesn't. Where can he go? The only place left.

Lon, what if a nonbeliever has lived in a South American tribe all his life, and never had contact with the outside world, and therefore never heard of God? Is that still rejecting him?

 

[KingdomRose]

God doesn't. Men do. A man who rejects God needs a place to go to be away from the God he hates. I don't know the full answer, we know it exists, Jesus spoke about it, and did not shy from its existence.

Jesus did NOT speak about a literal fiery place where people are consciously roasted forever. That is ridiculous. His story about "The Rich Man and Lazarus" was a METAPHORICAL PARABLE, with not a literal thing in it. Hell-fire does not exist. Only in the minds of ogres and sadists.

Wherever "fire" is mentioned in Jesus' teachings, it usually means TOTAL DESTRUCTION. That is what "Gehenna" means, and he used that word several times in Matthew: chapter 5:22,29,30; chapter 10:28; chapter 18:9; chapter 23:15,33. Most of us know what Gehenna was in his day....a garbage dump outside the city. Trash and even criminals were thrown there. What happened to this stuff? It all burned up INTO NOTHING. The focus isn't on the fire in the dump, but what happened to the trash and bodies thrown there---NON-EXISTENCE.

A person has to do some research to see just which words are being translated into "hell." Sometimes it's "Hades," sometimes it's "Gehenna." Once even it's "Tartarus." All these words have different meanings, yet the King James renders them ALL as "hell."

There is no place like what Dante imagined in his popular Inferno. No fire where people must stay and suffer forever. What would be the point of roasting someone forever? There is no hope of an end to it. It certainly isn't for discipline so the person will change. There is no point, except for the delight of sick people.

The Greek word "Hades" has always been known to mean "the grave." Translators screwed people's understanding up when they jumbled all the words together which mean different things. When Jesus spoke of "the fire prepared for the devil & his angels," that was associated with "Hades" because "Gehenna" had been translated as "Hell" along with "Hades." Gehenna, the fire prepared..., and the lake of fire all mean ANNIHILATION. But the church focused on the "fire" instead of the end results of the fire. They told people that the fire was literal. It is not.

Some versions today use the original words, Hades & Gehenna. It would be a good thing to find these versions and have them in our personal libraries.

 

[way 2 go]

That's right, and Jesus said nothing like it has ever happened before, and nothing as bad as it will ever happen again; which cancels out the Christian hell, because IF the Christian version of hell were true, then this teaching of Christ must be removed from the bible; because it would be FAR worse than the tribulation.

Another verse would have to be removed from the bible to satisfy the Christian hell, Rev. 21:4, " And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there will be no more death, no more sorrow, no more crying, and no more pain; all these things shall PASS AWAY!" If the Christian version of eternal hell were true, then pain, crying and sorrow would NEVER pass away! It would always exist in eternity.

are you a universal salvation type ?

no more death or sorrow for Christians

Rev 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the Lake of Fire. This is the second death.
Rev 20:15 And if anyone was not found having been written in the Book of Life, he was cast into the Lake of Fire.