Why would God need a hell?

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ok doser

lifeguard at the cement pond
The very last verse in the bible is universal, " Rev. 22:21, " The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you ALL!" This the biblical message is for, its for ALL! Salvation and grace is for everyone.

right before it:
18 For I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book; 19 and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life, from the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.




gee - that "Book of Life" part sounds scary

i wonder what it means?
 

Mickiel

New member
In Rev. 22:3, " There shall be no more curse." This eliminates the Christian myth of eternal hell, because such a place would be a curse. God did not send Jesus to curse humans he sent him to save us, and part of what he is saving us from is religion.
 

ok doser

lifeguard at the cement pond
In Rev. 22:3, " There shall be no more curse." This eliminates the Christian myth of eternal hell, because such a place would be a curse. God did not send Jesus to curse humans he sent him to save us, and part of what he is saving us from is religion.


14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city. 15 But outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie.




gee, so those horrible people will be outside?
 

Mickiel

New member
In Rev. 21:4, " And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes, there shall be no more death, no more sorrow, no more crying and no more pain; all these things will pass away!"

If the Christian hell was real, all those things would last forever.
 

ok doser

lifeguard at the cement pond
In Rev. 21:....

:think:


21 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.

2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.

3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.

4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.

6 And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.

7 He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.

8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.





that lake sounds pretty scary to me :idunno:
 

Mickiel

New member
In Rev. 22:7 And who ever will , let him take the water of life FREELY! Amen, its absolutely free! And no religion can put a cost on it.
 

Mickiel

New member
In Rev. 19:1, Salvation is " Unto God." Salvation is God's thing, its not a result of human choice. Salvation is God's gift.
 

ok doser

lifeguard at the cement pond
In Rev. 19...


:think:


19 And after these things I heard a great voice of much people in heaven, saying, Alleluia; Salvation, and glory, and honour, and power, unto the Lord our God:

2 For true and righteous are his judgments: for he hath judged the great whore, which did corrupt the earth with her fornication, and hath avenged the blood of his servants at her hand.

3 And again they said, Alleluia And her smoke rose up for ever and ever.

4 And the four and twenty elders and the four beasts fell down and worshipped God that sat on the throne, saying, Amen; Alleluia.

5 And a voice came out of the throne, saying, Praise our God, all ye his servants, and ye that fear him, both small and great.

6 And I heard as it were the voice of a great multitude, and as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of mighty thunderings, saying, Alleluia: for the Lord God omnipotent reigneth.

7 Let us be glad and rejoice, and give honour to him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready.

8 And to her was granted that she should be arrayed in fine linen, clean and white: for the fine linen is the righteousness of saints.

9 And he saith unto me, Write, Blessed are they which are called unto the marriage supper of the Lamb. And he saith unto me, These are the true sayings of God.

10 And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.

12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.

13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.

14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.

15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, King Of Kings, And Lord Of Lords.

 

ok doser

lifeguard at the cement pond
fierceness

wrath

the fearful

unbelieving

the abominable

murderers

whoremongers

sorcerers

idolaters

all liars

the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone






any of this ringing a bell?
 

freelight

Eclectic Theosophist
Lets get our 'terms' clear.......

Lets get our 'terms' clear.......

That's what essentially he is preaching.

Jesus says "for God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son that whoever believed in Him shall not perish but have eternal life."

He has been saying everyone will be saved without Jesus.


this is what UR is all about.


In general if we're talking about UR within a biblical context, within Christianity,....UR certainly does believe that all souls shall be reconciled to God thru 'Christ' who is the redeeming agent. Lets not forget that,....Jesus is still the way, the truth and the life. When we specify our terms as 'Christian Universalism' or 'Biblical Universalism'....it definitely includes Jesus as the redeeming agent....since it is biblically centered.

Only a more liberal 'pure universalism' or 'Unitarian Universalism' includes ways of reunion with God that are outside a biblical context, being more syncretic or pluralistic in their world-view.

See:

Christian Universalism

Articles on Christian Universalism
 

Mickiel

New member
In general if we're talking about UR within a biblical context, within Christianity,....UR certainly does believe that all souls shall be reconciled to God thru 'Christ' who is the redeeming agent. Lets not forget that,....Jesus is still the way, the truth and the life. When we specify our terms as 'Christian Universalism' or 'Biblical Universalism'....it definitely includes Jesus as the redeeming agent....since it is biblically centered.

Only a more liberal 'pure universalism' or 'Unitarian Universalism' includes ways of reunion with God that are outside a biblical context, being more syncretic or pluralistic in their world-view.

See:

Christian Universalism

Articles on Christian Universalism


Yes, when she said that I have been saying that everyone will be saved without Jesus, she was telling an outright falsehood; that just is not true, I have said no such thing. Then she said I was calling Jesus a liar, another dirty low blow; so I am done with her. 4 or 5 Christians here have done the same thing to me ; they can get real ugly when you disagree with their precious Christianity.
 

serpentdove

BANNED
Banned
Life is not a free will choice...
Ge 2:17

...John 8:42...he [Jesus] was " Birthed by God"...
"Jn 8:42, 43. If God were your Father, ye would love me—“If ye had anything of His moral image, as children have their father’s likeness, ye would love Me, for I am immediately of Him and directly from Him.” But “My speech” (meaning His peculiar style of expressing Himself on these subjects) is unintelligible to you because ye cannot take in the truth which it conveys..." Jamieson, R., Fausset, A. R., & Brown, D. (1997). Commentary Critical and Explanatory on the Whole Bible (Vol. 2, p. 144). Oak Harbor, WA: Logos Research Systems, Inc.
...John 5:26...Jesus was NOT always alive!
For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself;
And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man [John 5:26–27].


"The Lord Jesus is a life giver, you see. Not only does He have life, but He gives life. He also has the right to execute judgment. He came the first time as the Savior and not to judge, but He is coming the next time as the Judge. At that time, those in the graves will hear His voice." McGee, J. V. (1997). Thru the Bible commentary (electronic ed., Vol. 4, p. 398). Nashville: Thomas Nelson.

As a reminder Mickiel is number 47 on Satan, Inc. (TOL Heretics list) in "The 'Jesus is not God' people (Non-trinitarians) category. :burnlib:
 
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