beloved57
Well-known member
Sinners Christ died for are complete and perfected by His death even while they hate God and are unbelievers, just like Paul was !
Who Justifieth the Ungodly
- Thread starter beloved57
- Start date
Idolater
"Matthew 16:18-19" Dispensationalist (Catholic) χρ
Once they are converted and regenerated, you mean. Before conversion, though the elect is assured of eternal salvation, they are not saved until they are actually regenerated by the Holy Spirit, coming to faith in the Gospel of Christ.
Your theology is riddled with nonsensical religious philosophy. No sinner is born again before he is baptised into Christ for believing God at the preaching of the Holy Ghost.
beloved57
Well-known member
No, they are complete in Christ and perfected/justified by His Death before regeneration and conversion, yet thats why they will be regenerated and then converted by the Gospel.
The apostle Paul never attained absolute perfection on earth and yet you believe untegenerate unclean sinners are already perfect before they get saved? Your theology is riddled with nonsense.
beloved57
Well-known member
You fail to understand.
beloved57
Well-known member
God Justifieth the Elect Rom 8:33
33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.
Justification is an act of God’s Free And Sovereign Grace and Love, wherein He through the redemption that is in Jesus Christ Rom.3:24, has freely forgiven/pardoned the sins of all his elect, and approves of them in Him as completely just and righteous, Rom 5:19
19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous. This while they are yet ungodly, thats why its of Grace !
33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.
Justification is an act of God’s Free And Sovereign Grace and Love, wherein He through the redemption that is in Jesus Christ Rom.3:24, has freely forgiven/pardoned the sins of all his elect, and approves of them in Him as completely just and righteous, Rom 5:19
19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous. This while they are yet ungodly, thats why its of Grace !
God will justify the righteous who come to the light but He will not justify the wicked who refuse to repent when He calls them to repent and who refuse to be reconciled to God when He commands them to be reconciled to God and who refuse to come to Jesus when Jesus draws them to come.
Acts 17:30
And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:
2 Corinthians 5:20
Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.
John 12:32
And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.
beloved57
Well-known member
Did you understand the post ?
beloved57
Well-known member
God Justified the ungodly, yet not because they are ungodly in themselves, but because while ungodly, God views them clothed in Christs righteousness by imputation. Isa 61:10
I will greatly rejoice in the Lord, my soul shall be joyful in my God; for he hath clothed me with the garments of salvation, he hath covered me with the robe of righteousness, as a bridegroom decketh himself with ornaments, and as a bride adorneth herself with her jewels.
Ps 132:9
Let thy priests be clothed with righteousness; and let thy saints shout for joy.
Them who Christ died for, had their sins imputed to Christ, and in turn they had Christs Righteousness made unto them 2 Cor 5:21
21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.
I will greatly rejoice in the Lord, my soul shall be joyful in my God; for he hath clothed me with the garments of salvation, he hath covered me with the robe of righteousness, as a bridegroom decketh himself with ornaments, and as a bride adorneth herself with her jewels.
Ps 132:9
Let thy priests be clothed with righteousness; and let thy saints shout for joy.
Them who Christ died for, had their sins imputed to Christ, and in turn they had Christs Righteousness made unto them 2 Cor 5:21
21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.
Why does God justify the ungodly? Because He wants to and His choice has nothing to do with a sinner's response to the call of the Holy Spirit? No, that cannot be right because if God justified the wicked for no given reason then He lied when He said He would not justify the wicked. God only justifies the wicked when the wicked hear God and believe His word at the preaching of the Holy Ghost.
beloved57
Well-known member
Does God Justify unbelievers ?
In other words, can a person be in a state of active unbelief and yet at the same time be Justified before Gods Law and Justice ?
The answer is absolutely yes, or we must do away with this scripture Rom 4:5
5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
Now understand, if a person is ungodly, they are an unbeliever ! Its plain that God here in this scripture has Justified as such !
Therefore some sinners are Justified before their personal God given Faith causes them to believe. Now unfortunately all sinners, ungodly men and women are Justified while in that state, but instead thy are condemned and under Gods wrath Jn 3:18,36
18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.
In other words, can a person be in a state of active unbelief and yet at the same time be Justified before Gods Law and Justice ?
The answer is absolutely yes, or we must do away with this scripture Rom 4:5
5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
Now understand, if a person is ungodly, they are an unbeliever ! Its plain that God here in this scripture has Justified as such !
Therefore some sinners are Justified before their personal God given Faith causes them to believe. Now unfortunately all sinners, ungodly men and women are Justified while in that state, but instead thy are condemned and under Gods wrath Jn 3:18,36
18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.
Read it. God justifies only those sinners who believe and receive His word.
beloved57
Well-known member
Justification by Faith is by promise. God promised to Justify a particular seed by Faith, its a Gospel Promise. Its the seed of Abraham Gal 3:7-9
7 Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children/seed of Abraham.
8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.
9 So then they which be of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham.
The blessing of which all nations be blessed is " God Justifying through Faith" So Justification by Faith is a promised blessing to the seed of Abraham, his Spiritual seed.
Again the promise of God Rom 3:30
Seeing it is one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith.
The word shall denotes Gods promise to do something.
Justification by Faith depends on Gods Promise, and therefore sure to all the seed Rom 4:16
Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all,
7 Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children/seed of Abraham.
8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.
9 So then they which be of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham.
The blessing of which all nations be blessed is " God Justifying through Faith" So Justification by Faith is a promised blessing to the seed of Abraham, his Spiritual seed.
Again the promise of God Rom 3:30
Seeing it is one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith.
The word shall denotes Gods promise to do something.
Justification by Faith depends on Gods Promise, and therefore sure to all the seed Rom 4:16
Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all,
Jesus told His disciples to go into all the world to preach the gospel to every creature and to teach all men the Bible. God is not willing that any should perish and He has chosen the foolishness preaching to save sinners so He sends preachers to preach the gospel to sinners because how can they believe in Him of whom they have not heard?
The completeness and perfection are there for all men to take up, but, they have to take them up.
Sinners are neither complete or perfect.
The completeness and perfection are the results of repentance from sin, rebirth, and the gift of the Holy Ghost.
And even, then we are to continue to grow in grace and knowledge.
If men die before they convert and are regenerated, they are lost.
You need to add "physical" to your model of perfection.
Even the sinless get sick and die..."physically".
I agree with that.
So...while dead in trespasses and sins they are still goners.
Belief genders justification, sanctification, repentance, etc.
beloved57
Well-known member
You way off. Did you understand the post ?