When Did the Disciples of Jesus Stop Observing the Old Testament Laws?

clefty

New member
The Sabbath Day is about Jesus. Jesus is the Sabbath. The Sabbath is fulfilled in Christ.

Yes it is about Him because He kept it and it still remains binding and immutable...as He remains Lord of the Sabbath...it gives Him lordship...even still

You keep saying He is a calendar date but where is the scripture or even logic?

Does He fulfill a Monday too? No need to note it is the second day of the week?

So the debt is fulfilled but in no way does that mean we aren't getting charged or continue to owe...the curse remains...

But He paid it all and asked us to Remember...and to keep the commandments if we love Him...out of gratitude for paying
 

God's Truth

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"Faith Without Work is Dead" ... What Kind of Work does God Want from the Faithful?
ACTS 26:10 Which thing I also did in Jerusalem: and many of the saints did I shut up in prison, having received authority from the chief priests; and when they were put to death, I gave my voice against [them].
DANIEL 6:10 Now when Daniel knew that the writing was signed, he went into his house; and his windows being open in his chamber toward Jerusalem, he kneeled upon his knees three times a day, and prayed, and gave thanks before his God, as he did aforetime.
DANIEL 6:11 Then these men assembled, and found Daniel praying and making supplication before his God.

God does not want us to make observances of feasts/sabbaths, or to have communion, or to give tithes to the churches (or to respect persons, principalities or powers) ........... God does not accept Intercession/Sacraments as a reproof of the "Hearing of his Word" (Grace) in the New Testament. What God wants to see is the "Hearing of the Word" that applies itself to the "Chastisement of the Heart" ........... The First Commandment to Love the Written Word, has never been modified in the Old Testament or in the New Testament. The Second Commandment concerning the Love of Your Person has been modified so that Intercession/Sacraments serve as a snare for the wicked, and for the races and peoples God does not intend to pay for sin with "Joseph the Blessings". (You have more accountability in the New Testament, and therefore greater division between the people that God has inview for "Joseph the Blessings" by the payment of Jesus) (In the New Testament Era, God does sometimes count the Law for Grace to Bless Work, so that the Gentiles are a witness of the faith ........... that in itself is not supplication for the "Hearing of the Word", the Law does not substitute Grace, but its not a sole basis for God to withhold his blessings, you are not given a new gospel)(You don't have 10 Commandments anymore, You only have Two Commandments, which represents a more complete representation of the Gospel's Law) (In terms of euthanasia, relative to the Sign of Divorce, these questions will be answered with live demonstrations in the near future, but not necessarily at this time).

There is a major difference in the New Testament than that of the Old Testament. The major difference is that we are reconciled to God in the New Testament.

We have God Himself living in us, and we are living in Him in heaven.

In the New Testament we have Jesus living to intercede for us.

In the Old Testament, a person had to go to the tent, or the temple, just to be near God's Spirit.

One had to do many acts just to be able to go in the tent, or later, the temple.

Jesus now makes us clean and no one makes themselves clean by doing external washings and the sacrifice of animals, etc.

Jesus changed many of the old laws.

There is no tithe because that is the old law and it involved a priesthood.

We do not have to do many things that one did in the old law.

The apostles from the New Testament received all the truth we need to guide us to eternal life. All we need to guide us to eternal life is written down in the Scriptures: John 16:13; 2 Peter 1:3; Acts 20:20, 27; Matthew 28:20; I Corinthians 14:37; 2 Timothy 3:16, 17.
 

God's Truth

New member
He also fulfilled the 9 + others...

And He fulfilled scripture...does that mean they are no longer?

Just like driving 55 mph in a 55 mph zone ...you fulfill your role as a good citizen...and the law remains for the driver behind you too...

In my many years of debating, I have found that human analogies that are not in the Bible, they are just not good enough to adequately explain the scriptures. The human analogies given have too many flaws and the picture given with the analogy just does not allow for legitimate discussion and debate.
 

God's Truth

New member
Yes it is about Him because He kept it and it still remains binding and immutable...as He remains Lord of the Sabbath...it gives Him lordship...even still

You keep saying He is a calendar date but where is the scripture or even logic?

Does He fulfill a Monday too? No need to note it is the second day of the week?

So the debt is fulfilled but in no way does that mean we aren't getting charged or continue to owe...the curse remains...

But He paid it all and asked us to Remember...and to keep the commandments if we love Him...out of gratitude for paying

All the special days were about Jesus. Since Jesus, we are to observe Jesus all day every day.

We are reconciled to God when we are saved.

We are given the Holy Spirit of God to live in us when we are saved.
 

clefty

New member
In my many years of debating, I have found that human analogies that are not in the Bible, they are just not good enough to adequately explain the scriptures. The human analogies given have too many flaws and the picture given with the analogy just does not allow for legitimate discussion and debate.

Good...merely follow scripture then...

And do His Fatheŕs will...
 

clefty

New member
All the special days were about Jesus. Since Jesus, we are to observe Jesus all day every day.

We are reconciled to God when we are saved.

We are given the Holy Spirit of God to live in us when we are saved.

Yes we do receive the Spirit...to live in His temple made by His hands in His image doing things as He does...in accordance to His will...His way...His calendar
 
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CherubRam

New member
Celebrating special days is now worthless.

(Special Days) is referring to the other holy days, the Festivals; this does not include the Sabbath Day Rest command. To think that Christ or the disciples spoke against God's Seventh Day Sabbath is an error.
 

God's Truth

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It's better than observing Easter

or celebrating the idolatry of Christmas

As if that isn't harmful...

Replacing what is His with what is man's is exactly that...idolatry

You make the Sabbath a requirement, which makes you a bitter root who falls from grace.

Observing Christmas is not commanded by God and I do not know of any Christian who speaks that it is.

It is not a sin to celebrate Christ. It is a sin to say it is commanded. Just like the Sabbath.
 

God's Truth

New member
(Special Days) is referring to the other holy days, the Festivals; this does not include the Sabbath Day Rest command. To think that Christ or the disciples spoke against God's Seventh Day Sabbath is an error.

The error is you not understanding that Jesus is the Sabbath Rest. All the special days is about him.
 

clefty

New member
His command says observing special days is worthless now.

Oops...you missed again

His command is if we love Him...keep His commandments as He kept His Father's...and do His Father's will...

His Father willed that we are to remember the seventh day Sabbath and keep it Holy...

We would have to alter even more scripture to reflect what you intend it to say...

Why you make Him a liar?
 
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clefty

New member
You make the Sabbath a requirement, which makes you a bitter root who falls from grace.

Grace is why I keep the Sabbath...not to gain grace but because I have it and in gratitude wish to keep His commands as He said to if we love Him.

Observing Christmas is not commanded by God and I do not know of any Christian who speaks that it is.

And like Sunday they still keep it...idolatry worshipping another God....

It is not a sin to celebrate Christ.
is exactly the attitude that made the golden calf...celebrating contrary to what was instructed...

if one celebrates Christ by stealing money or the Holy Land that is sin...

It is a sin to say it is commanded. Just like the Sabbath.

Yes because the Sabbath is commanded...

Still...see? Present tense...
 

clefty

New member
The error is you not understanding that Jesus is the Sabbath Rest. All the special days is about him.

All the days are about Him not just the special days... He asked for us to remember one was set apart by Him to remind us that all the days are about Him...because of Him
 

Flaminggg

BANNED
Banned
There is a major difference in the New Testament than that of the Old Testament. The major difference is that we are reconciled to God in the New Testament.

We have God Himself living in us, and we are living in Him in heaven.

In the New Testament we have Jesus living to intercede for us.

In the Old Testament, a person had to go to the tent, or the temple, just to be near God's Spirit.

One had to do many acts just to be able to go in the tent, or later, the temple.

Jesus now makes us clean and no one makes themselves clean by doing external washings and the sacrifice of animals, etc.

Jesus changed many of the old laws.

There is no tithe because that is the old law and it involved a priesthood.

We do not have to do many things that one did in the old law.

The apostles from the New Testament received all the truth we need to guide us to eternal life. All we need to guide us to eternal life is written down in the Scriptures: John 16:13; 2 Peter 1:3; Acts 20:20, 27; Matthew 28:20; I Corinthians 14:37; 2 Timothy 3:16, 17.

Dispensation of Angels (Sacraments/Intercession) God No Longer Uses in the New Testament to Assist in the "Hearing of his Word" (Jude 1:3-4)
EPHESIANS 3:2 If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward:
EPHESIANS 3:3 How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,
EPHESIANS 3:4 Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ )

Unequally Yolked with Persons, Principalities and Powers (Sacraments/Intercession will Choke the "Hearing of the Word") ... God uses the Chastisement of the Written Word exclusively to assist in the "Hearing of the Word" for the faithful ... We have a Complete Written Gospel, and God is exemplifying that fact to divide the faithful
HEBREWS 10:23 Let us hold fast the profession of [our] faith without wavering; (for he [is] faithful that promised)
HEBREWS 10:24 And let us consider one another to provoke unto love and to good works:
HEBREWS 10:25 Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some [is]; but exhorting [one another]: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.

Justification of Faith through the Blessing of Works ... This is not a Substitute for the "Hearing of the Word/Grace", this is simply the removal of the limitation of Righteousness as a result of the "Hearing of the Word/Grace" ... so that "Adultery = Not observing the Second Commandment to Avoid Intercession", and "Fornication = Not observing the chastisement of the written word", appear to be blessed with good works ... this is a mechanism God uses to further divide the faithful in the New Testament Era, by using the Gentiles as a Witnesses of the Gospel's Program
ROMANS 2:13(For not the hearers of the law [are] just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.
ROMANS 2:14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
ROMANS 2:15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and [their] thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another)

1. Old Testament = Yes for Sacraments/Intercession (utilized for benefit)
2. New Testament = No for Sacraments/Intercession (simply observed)
3. Revelation = SNARE for Sacraments/Intercession (counted as a snare)

1. Dispensation of Angels = God was called an Angel, Gabriel to illustrate the Written Law was not Completed.
2. Unequally Yolked = God was called an Prophet, Emmanuel to illustrate the Written Law would be completed in that day.
3. Mark of the Beast = God is called Jehovah, A Memorial to illustrate the condemnation and wrath that must be given to those convicted of condemnation and wrath for the Lord's Body.

(God is going to use the Euthanasia of Genetic Dan at the Global Level as a point of discernment for his Mercy in the Sign of Divorce, God also wants those that share the conviction of the Lord's Body, to be euthanized likewise ............ when they scoff and criticize the Antichrist, and then commit suicide as you can understand the current affairs of the nations, this is only the beginning of what God wants, but you must do it in season. That is you will suffer the chastisement of the ungodly to mend your walk of faith, and then you will kill them in short order, once the Antichrist returns from his expedition to the center of the earth, just like the Apostle Paul had done in his day, so that is our goals of today, soon, as soon as the Mandrid Fault Line Alignment with the Solar Eclipse on 8/21/2017, we will begin, so that is soon)

(Jesus was a Prophet, and because Jesus was a Prophet or God, that means everyone else could only serve as Scribes or Recorders of the Written Law, that completed the New Testament. And so No Angel of from Heaven, or from under the Heavens can be called a Prophet more than a Scribe, but there are many doctrines of demons that are falsifications of the Gospel's Program, if we want to be slightly more correct in our positions)
 

clefty

New member
His command says observing special days is worthless now.


Follow my example, as I follow the example of Christ. I praise you for remembering me in everything and for holding to the teachings [or tradition -- NIV footnote], just as I passed them on to you. (1 Corinthians 11:1-2)

So we have a pattern of following tradition not ending it...

Paul continued keeping the same traditions Yahushua did...both of them asking us to do the same...


God the God of Jews only? Is he not the God of Gentiles too? Yes, of Gentiles too, since there is only one God, who will justify the circumcised by faith and the uncircumcised through that same faith. Do we, then, nullify the law by this faith? Not at all! Rather, we uphold the law. (Romans 3: 29-31)

because our gospel came to you not simply with words, but also with power, with the Holy Spirit and with deep conviction. You know how we lived among you for your sake. You became imitators of us and of the Lord;in spite of severe suffering, you welcomed the message with the joy given by the Holy Spirit. And so you became a model to all the believers in Macedonia and Achaia. (1 Thessalonians 1: 5-7)

There remained one way not two...

But yet there are those here who believe there was a change in the law or an end...or that we no longer are led to follow the example but follow another way...

Or don't follow at all...just rest...everyday...lol

They continue to slander with false accusations that Paul did not follow His Savior...His way

So let's recap and refresh as we rest today...

http://fogwhistle.ca/acts/follow.html
 

God's Truth

New member
Oops...you missed again

His command is if we love Him...keep His commandments as He kept His Father's...and do His Father's will...

His Father willed that we are to remember the seventh day Sabbath and keep it Holy...

We would have to alter even more scripture to reflect what you intend it to say...

Why you make Him a liar?

You did not get the message right, for Jesus is the change in the priesthood, and that means changes to the law.

Hebrews 712 For when the priesthood is changed, the law must be changed also.
 

God's Truth

New member
Grace is why I keep the Sabbath...not to gain grace but because I have it and in gratitude wish to keep His commands as He said to if we love Him.

Keeping a Sabbath day is no longer a command. How does a Sabbath observance mean anything anymore?

And like Sunday they still keep it...idolatry worshipping another God....

It is idolatry if you think it is a command when it is not. No special days are commanded

is exactly the attitude that made the golden calf...celebrating contrary to what was instructed...

I repeat the scriptures and it does NOT equal the attitude that made the golden calf.

if one celebrates Christ by stealing money or the Holy Land that is sin...
I do not understand what you mean there.

Yes because the Sabbath is commanded...

Still...see? Present tense...

Jesus came and he fulfilled the Sabbath…because it was about him.

All these things were commanded and are only fulfilled in him:

The Burnt Offering; The Grain Offering; The Fellowship Offering; The Sin Offering; The Guilt Offering; Dietary Laws; Purification After Childbirth; Cleansing From Infectious Skin Diseases; Cleansing From Mildew; Discharges Causing Uncleanness; The Day of Atonement; Rules for Priests; The Sabbath; Firstfruits; The Passover and Unleavened Bread; Feast of Weeks; Feast of Trumpets; Feast of Tabernacles; Oil and Bread Set Before The LORD; the Sabbath Year; The Year of Jubilee; Circumcision.
 
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