Was Lazarus A 'Bum'?

[glassjester]

Not sure why you keep going on about not having kids outside of marriage. Regardless of what you think about sex out of wedlock it's going to happen, a lot. That's simple fact.

So?

What you're simplistic about is the myriad reasons why people find themselves in poverty and homelessness and it's not all self inflicted by any stretch.

I never said it was.

Still, none of that gives the government the right to forcefully take away a citizen's money, and give it to another citizen.

 

[glassjester]

I'm arguing from reality. Take away aid for the poor and those out of work and the poverty rate would increase exponentially, fact. If you think that's justifiable then up to you although hardly a compassionate attitude, else explain how you could do away with the benefits/welfare system and ensure a way whereby people in need received help. That'd be some feat...

Why do I need to offer a perfect solution to point out that your preferred solution is unjust?

Here's a good solution. Anyone below the poverty line should be legally allowed to steal money from anyone above the poverty line.

Now tell me why that's no good.

 

[Angel4Truth]

Why do I need to offer a perfect solution to point out that your preferred solution is unjust?

Here's a good solution. Anyone below the poverty line should be legally allowed to steal money from anyone above the poverty line.

Now tell me why that's no good.

you do know there are actually liberals that teach that should be ok already and people who believe it already?

 

[Arthur Brain]

Why do I need to offer a perfect solution to point out that your preferred solution is unjust?

Here's a good solution. Anyone below the poverty line should be legally allowed to steal money from anyone above the poverty line.

Now tell me why that's no good.

If you cared at all you'd supply some way whereby those out of work and unable to work could be effectively reached without a welfare safety net. Is it "just" to have a society where people starve and suffer poverty simply because they don't have a job or can't work? Do you think all those in corporate industry and big business/banks deserve such high wages in turn? Ever get up in arms over that?

I could argue that the government stole my money in taxes when they ply it into schemes that I consider a complete waste but that's the way it is. Why a Christian would bemoan a system that covers those who would be left with nothing but squalor without it is baffling, especially when it's there for everyone, imperfect as it is.

 

[Angel4Truth]

Why do I need to offer a perfect solution to point out that your preferred solution is unjust?

Here's a good solution. Anyone below the poverty line should be legally allowed to steal money from anyone above the poverty line.

Now tell me why that's no good.

If you cared at all you'd supply some way whereby those out of work and unable to work could be effectively reached without a welfare safety net. Is it "just" to have a society where people starve and suffer poverty simply because they don't have a job or can't work? Do you think all those in corporate industry and big business/banks deserve such high wages in turn? Ever get up in arms over that?

I could argue that the government stole my money in taxes when they ply it into schemes that I consider a complete waste but that's the way it is. Why a Christian would bemoan a system that covers those who would be left with nothing but squalor without it is baffling, especially when it's there for everyone, imperfect as it is.

You didnt answer the question, at all. You didnt even try, it looks like.

 

[Arthur Brain]

So?

So why bring it up in the first place?

I never said it was.

Still, none of that gives the government the right to forcefully take away a citizen's money, and give it to another citizen.

Maybe you should just refuse to pay taxes altogether.

lain:

 

[Arthur Brain]

You didnt answer the question, at all. You didnt even try, it looks like.

Yes, I did, and you're just smarting because of your nonsense earlier on. Seriously, why would a guy who considers disabled and homeless people to be bums argue in support of a system that would give them support outside of charity?

 

[Angel4Truth]

Yes, I did, and you're just smarting because of your nonsense earlier on. Seriously, why would a guy who considers disabled and homeless people to be bums argue in support of a system that would give them support outside of charity?

The question was should those below the poverty line, be allowed to steal whatever they want from those above it, yes or no?

Try again.

 

[Arthur Brain]

The question was should those below the poverty line, be allowed to steal whatever they want from those above it, yes or no?

Try again.

No. Easy. The welfare system isn't doing that, as much as you like to load it that way.

 

[Angel4Truth]

No. Easy. The welfare system isn't doing that, as much as you like to load it that way.

Demanding money from me for charities i do not choose, is theft. Government is for security and infrastructure.

 

[Arthur Brain]

Demanding money from me for charities i do not choose, is theft. Government is for security and infrastructure.

Then the government has stolen plenty of money off me if it comes down to things I don't choose to pay for in turn, so suck it up. That exact same system is also in place for you if you were to find yourself out of work also. You'd think Christians would support that which would help the unfortunate as it's only a system like this which could do that for the most part. Charity certainly wouldn't.

 

[Angel4Truth]

Then the government has stolen plenty of money off me

yes

 

[Arthur Brain]

yes

Hey, refuse to pay your taxes if you feel that strongly about it.

 

[Angel4Truth]

Hey, refuse to pay your taxes if you feel that strongly about it.

Cant do that, i like not being in jail. Better, elect people who actually follow the law and try to revise government and let me choose what charities i wish to donate to.

 

[Arthur Brain]

Cant do that, i like not being in jail. Better, elect people who actually follow the law and try to revise government and let me choose what charities i wish to donate to.

Well you could do that if you felt that strongly about it. Seriously, you've got Heaven to look forward to haven't you so why on earth would you, as a Christian be that up in arms over a system that tries to provide for everyone who's on hard times, including you if you were to find yourself out of a job? It's the only realistic way to ensure poverty is kept to a minimum. Do away with it and it would escalate off the scale.

Still want to accuse me of thinking that disabled people are bums?

lain:

 

[Angel4Truth]

Well you could do that if you felt that strongly about it. Seriously, you've got Heaven to look forward to haven't you so why on earth would you, as a Christian be that up in arms over a system that tries to provide for everyone who's on hard times, including you if you were to find yourself out of a job? It's the only realistic way to ensure poverty is kept to a minimum. Do away with it and it would escalate off the scale.

Still want to accuse me of thinking that disabled people are bums?

lain:

'Hard times' is subjective. I am old enough to decide what "hard times" i wish to contribute to, and not getting free birth control or sex change, isnt a "hard time" and thats just one of a billion examples of the theft of tax money.

 

[glassjester]

If you cared at all you'd supply some way whereby those out of work and unable to work could be effectively reached without a welfare safety net.

How about private, voluntary unemployment insurance?
You buy a policy, you pay the premium. Then, if you find yourself out of work, your policy pays out - for whatever amount of coverage you freely chose to buy.

Is it "just" to have a society where people starve and suffer poverty simply because they don't have a job or can't work?

No.

Do you think all those in corporate industry and big business/banks deserve such high wages in turn?

No, probably not.

Ever get up in arms over that?

If my feelings toward welfare count as "up in arms," then yes.

I could argue that the government stole my money in taxes when they ply it into schemes that I consider a complete waste but that's the way it is. Why a Christian would bemoan a system that covers those who would be left with nothing but squalor without it is baffling, especially when it's there for everyone, imperfect as it is.

I am sorry you're baffled.

 

[Arthur Brain]

'Hard times' is subjective. I am old enough to decide what "hard times" i wish to contribute to, and not getting free birth control or sex change, isnt a "hard time" and thats just one of a billion examples of the theft of tax money.

You ever been homeless or wondering where the next meal comes from? Not interested in your other tangents for the purposes of this thread. I could moan about several government projects but a system that provides for those in and out of work ain't one of them, especially when without it the poverty rate would skyrocket.

Wise not to continue with that pathetic accusation you leveled at me from earlier on though.

:thumb:

 

[Angel4Truth]

You ever been homeless or wondering where the next meal comes from?

yes, and you?

I also used to volunteer at head start, a government program for low income children to have "preschool" so their parents can work and for many of them received the only meals they would have for the day.

Wise not to continue with that pathetic accusation you leveled at me from earlier on though.

I charged you with what you said, i proved it also. Then you admitted you should have worded what you said better, but feel free to try to attack me with what you dont know about me at all. I think its hilarious.

 

[glassjester]

No. Easy.

Why would it be unjust to allow impoverished people to steal money from wealthier people?