toldailytopic: Why are there so many Christian denominations? And is that necessarily

[geraldN]

Christianity is a mess because people try and reconcile the gospels of circumcision and uncircumcision. Then you have people that water baptize and those that say they don't need to do it. And tithe, and keep other ordinances. Instead of following Paul(teachings), who is our apostle.

Of course. Don't the other users here agree?
I still need to read more i guess.

 

[geraldN]

PLEASE!

PLEASE!

I can't speak for Catholics but I met some new Catholic friends who are not like that at all. We can share with each, even disagree, without being disagreeable.

There are so many denominations because some have decided that they already know it all, and therefore lock themselves into a doctrinal stance which leaves no room for growth of the understanding of scripture.

Is having many denominations a bad thing?
No.
If you find yourself in one that has locked their growth of understanding, then you can try another, or start another.

i AGREE Tambora, until your last 3 words. Please don't start another.

 

[IXOYE]

To IXOYE: I need to read the entire thread. I wasn't expecting that kindof a response. I hope your's isn't at all typical of the dialog here. Be back.

What kind of response is that? The two observations aren't necessarily mutually exclusive. You shared yours, it bumped my mind to a lot, most, of what I see.

I didn't accuse yiu, did i?

From my perspective it provided balance to that aside. By all means if you took offense and felt it was to yiu I was speaking, let me know pm or public.

A lot of folks on here will say a lot of things about me on here. But I doubt anyone would say, without manialcle laughter, that I'm shy or afraid of someone being in my face@

 

[geraldN]

Ya know, your church isn't the only cult to use the fear of God to get people to submit to their church but it sure is the biggest and most successful.

Reasonable statement.

Failure to rightly divide the word of truth.

II Timothy 2:15

oatmeal

It's right you are.

Yep. Paul said to disregard the Lord Jesus Christ's ministry to Israel when he was in the flesh.

"Disregard" may not be the best word to use there; how about "rightly divide?"

I never said 'leaders' or 'church' is evil, I explained what I meant in my earlier post a few days ago. What is the problem when these things are so organized that it becomes about the organization of the organization, power, and control and the message and purpose is totally lost in all of the 'Power tripping' these things can cause. The message sometimes is not even understood with all of the layers of everything else (but God)we have covered the message with.

The message of Jesus is not even understood because of this in many circles. Everything is about "Us vs Them"---sigh!

It is funny how Christ came and had nothing to do with organizing Christianity and to show us the keys to life were Spiritual principles, simple ones by the way that 'Religion' has totally complicated.

Paul came along and started organizing Christianity ( with good intents ) to teach and instruct. The problem is that what we have today is nothing like I believe the early church had..(Before Rome's hijacking of it)..It is focused on who is in control, who can't do this or that, a lot of flesh for the most part. Christ came to bring us Liberty in the Holy Spirit.

Liberty in Christ is a threat to Religion---This is what the early Christians had and died for--This is where I know God wants to get us back to--The early days before all of the adding, corruption, and taking away of the message of the Good News---and to get back to truly the heart of God and the reason Christ came to earth.

Among a long list of other things, right division tells clearly why Jesus Christ came.

When believers say Catholicism is a "works religion" we mean that doing the things the religion prescribes is "works" as Paul said were not according to grace, but opposed.

I note the "right dividers" [as usual]have shaken off the dust and moved on. I may stick around a while; it is still interesting here.

 

[IXOYE]

Reasonable statement.



It's right you are.



"Disregard" may not be the best word to use there; how about "rightly divide?"



Among a long list of other things, right division tells clearly why Jesus Christ came.

When believers say Catholicism is a "works religion" we mean that doing the things the religion prescribes is "works" as Paul said were not according to grace, but opposed.

I note the "right dividers" [as usual]have shaken off the dust and moved on. I may stick around a while; it is still interesting here.

Paul also said it's not theology that matters but faith WORKING WORKING WORKING through love.

The very word AGAPAO can't be in your heart, if you have no works, it requires the demonstration or else it's just phileo.

If salvation is by grace, through faith, not works so no man can boast,
and faith will manifest in works,
then if you don't have works
You don't have faith, yet,
and without faith,
how can you have grace.

the works don't save you.

but if you have what saves you, you will have works.

So the catholic church teaches their people to do works. Which is exactly what Paul told them they were to do. Read eph 4 12-17 THE CHURCH PREPARES PEOPLE THROUGH WORKS OF SERVICE..... His own words say you have it wrong...

Your read on the Church of Rome is not founded in truth. I'm not blaming you, it's what you were taught. But you should get your hands wet and dig in some more.

btw, I'm not a big c Catholic in any sense of their faith. But, I'm not going to condemn them for what isn't their wrong.

 

[Cruciform]

And you have Scripture, and history to back you up. As a Protestant, I have, dissension and factions are of the.flesh, not spirit.

My post comes from the perspective of having been a lifelong committed Evangelical Protestant prior to entering the Catholic Church in 2001. I speak from deep in Protestant experience, as well as now from an informed Catholic viewpoint.



Gaudium de veritate,

Cruciform
+T+

 

[IXOYE]

My post comes from the perspective of having been a lifelong committed Evangelical Protestant prior to entering the Catholic Church in 2001. I speak from deep in Protestant experience, as well as now from an informed Catholic viewpoint.



Gaudium de veritate,

Cruciform
+T+

So you've said before. You still have Scripture and history on your side though. Whether you cash that in, or not.

Someday you gotta pm me about the Mary thing. That sticks on my craw.

 

[Cruciform]

So you've said before. You still have Scripture and history on your side though. Whether you cash that in, or not.

Actually, I cash it in all the time. :up:

Someday you gotta pm me about the Mary thing. That sticks on my craw.

Feel free to message me with any question you might have. I'll do my best to clarify the Catholic position.



Gaudium de veritate,

Cruciform
+T+

 

[IXOYE]

Actually, I cash it in all the time. :up:


Feel free to message me with any question you might have. I'll do my best to clarify the Catholic position.



Gaudium de veritate,

Cruciform
+T+

Actually, I think I could make your arguments for you. I want to get up in your personal koolaid stash. And find out from you. How you were convinced it was legit.

 

[unknown]

I can offer PAUL and JOHN as examples. Careful you are going to make a fool out of yourself by answering so surely without knowing why I said those two names. But, it's by their own words. HOWEVER, AGAIN the topic is DENOMINATIONS, and you've directed us to individuals. Do you even know what the words you are spitting mean?

You're the one who can only name 2 names so yeah I guess I have directed you to individuals, that's all you got.

Not being a Christian, I never accepted the doctrine of the trinity so don't expect me to accept a quintity either. If you want to make others (John and Paul) equal to God (one with the father as Jesus is one with the father) I'll be glad to let you. I'll just chalk it up to the fact that your comprehension skills are only in the 8th percentile.

 

[IXOYE]

You're the one who can only name 2 names so yeah I guess I have directed you to individuals, that's all you got.

Not being a Christian, I never accepted the doctrine of the trinity so don't expect me to accept a quintity either. If you want to make others (John and Paul) equal to God (one with the father as Jesus is one with the father) I'll be glad to let you. I'll just chalk it up to the fact that your comprehension skills are only in the 8th percentile.

Both names spoke for a group of people using plural pronouns. If i only gave one name it show it possible. That was all i.was.asked to.do. why do you ignore tthat and create false dilemmas, change your context and such? You aren't very open to ever having someone know more on something are you.

There is nothing in anything I said that implied they were gods. Your implying that shows either your ignorance, or your misunderstanding of the word so many translations write as perfect in English.

It ask shows you don't know crap about Scripture, jesus prays we are to be in Him and thus in God as He Himself was. Eph 4 writes that we are to be as spiritually mature as Jesus was. Blah blah blah. I guess not being Xian I shiukd cut you some slack for not being aware of those vss. But then I'm faced, with, "then why are they challenging me on scripture?"

You end with the.false dilemma you pulled out of your colorectal regions of a quintology, and attacked my reading comprehension skills. A sure tactic of one threatened that can't support their argument so attempt to discredit the one they speak with. It was almost an ad hominem, too.

So, thank you for trying to play. Please remember you must be this tall to ride this ride. Maybe next year.

 

[IXOYE]

You're the one who can only name 2 names so yeah I guess I have directed you to individuals, that's all you got.

Not being a Christian, I never accepted the doctrine of the trinity so don't expect me to accept a quintity either. If you want to make others (John and Paul) equal to God (one with the father as Jesus is one with the father) I'll be glad to let you. I'll just chalk it up to the fact that your comprehension skills are only in the 8th percentile.

Btw, why did you just drop all the places in that post i.corrected you onk. Are you tryong to hide tthat yiuyiu were wrongk. Thats pretty dshonest. The fact iis your first objections were reconciled. So rather than admit that, yij behave like a petulant brat that had their lollipop taken away.

 

[unknown]

Both names spoke for a group of people using plural pronouns. If i only gave one name it show it possible. That was all i.was.asked to.do. why do you ignore tthat and create false dilemmas, change your context and such? You aren't very open to ever having someone know more on something are you.

There is nothing in anything I said that implied they were gods. Your implying that shows either your ignorance, or your misunderstanding of the word so many translations write as perfect in English.

It ask shows you don't know crap about Scripture, jesus prays we are to be in Him and thus in God as He Himself was. Eph 4 writes that we are to be as spiritually mature as Jesus was. Blah blah blah. I guess not being Xian I shiukd cut you some slack for not being aware of those vss. But then I'm faced, with, "then why are they challenging me on scripture?"

You end with the.false dilemma you pulled out of your colorectal regions of a quintology, and attacked my reading comprehension skills. A sure tactic of one threatened that can't support their argument so attempt to discredit the one they speak with. It was almost an ad hominem, too.

So, thank you for trying to play. Please remember you must be this tall to ride this ride. Maybe next year.

John 17:21

That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.

Then I take it you do not believe that Jesus is God either.

 

[unknown]

Btw, why did you just drop all the places in that post i.corrected you onk. Are you tryong to hide tthat yiuyiu were wrongk. Thats pretty dshonest. The fact iis your first objections were reconciled. So rather than admit that, yij behave like a petulant brat that had their lollipop taken away.

free will

 

[IXOYE]

Coward.

free will

 

[IXOYE]

John 17:21
Then I take it you do not believe that Jesus is God either.

Sigh, and didn't you comment on reading comprehension? The Trinity is defined as together and seperate. Having a Howard,h of sorts on "heaven" is therefore not that hard to grasp, and is Biblical. The healing miracles were done by faith from god. All of creation was created by God, through. The word. So jesus was in His father. Jesus is our gate, he said so himself, so we are in HIM through Him, so we are down the line from being God.

Now go back and answer the rest, stop throwing crap on the wall to see if you can get some to stick.

 

[unknown]

Coward.

Is Jesus God in your religion?

To give you a better answer (why I dropped most of your text)....

I just came back from a long weekend, and didn't want to get into all that editing (the quote button only displays your reply outside of the quote tags). I didn't even deal with the whole of what was outside the tags.

I normally put idolators on ignore but since you admitted your deficiency in reading comprehension I cut you a little slack (it won't last long).

 

[IXOYE]

Is Jesus God in your religion?

@@@@ I guess a third grade vBS class may say yes? The creed says they are together, and seperate. So your answer is yes and know. This, of course, sass already answered in my hierarchy statements. The ones you are a coward to face.@@

To give you a better answer (why I dropped most of your text)....

I just came back from a long weekend, and didn't want to get into all that editing (the quote button only displays your reply outside of the quote tags). I didn't even deal with the whole of what was outside the tags.

@@@@nor.did you read it. And especially noted none was considered. You wwouldnt have answered as you did, if you had.@@@@

I normally put idolators on ignore but since you admitted your deficiency in reading comprehension I cut you a little slack (it won't last long).

And, where did I admit that... wake up, come on...
What is the idolatry? Show your work.

All you have is made yoi accusations. Yiu can't answer the rebuttals, which means you can't lose as being so smart, which means you mist bring me down, so your "perch" isn't shaken.

In one word, coward.

 

[unknown]

And, where did I admit that... wake up, come on...
What is the idolatry? Show your work.

All you have is made yoi accusations. Yiu can't answer the rebuttals, which means you can't lose as being so smart, which means you mist bring me down, so your "perch" isn't shaken.

In one word, coward.

You said your reading comprehension was in the 8th percentile, from my viewpoint that is a deficiency.

You make John and Paul one with (equal to) God, you are an idolator.
I believe (not sure because I rejected the doctrine of the trinity long ago) that the doctrine says Jesus is fully God and fully man. If you believe that you are an idolator, Nothing is equal to God, God is infinite. (at least in my opinion).

Psalm 119:165
Great peace have they which love thy law: and nothing shall offend them.

you are offended because you have your own laws.

 

[IXOYE]

You said your reading comprehension was in the 8th percentile, from my viewpoint that is a deficiency.

I'm too lazy to look back, frankly you aren't worth the effort you won't respond if you are wrong anyway. You sure that disn't say top 8%?

You make John and Paul one with (equal to) God, you are an idolator.

No I don't. And you don't have an argument to show I do. Your ignorance of what a God is, and what I explained is showing. It may make them United with God. But not equal to God. If my words are too big let me know, but they are mostly very common 5th grade at worse words.

If you believe that you are an idolator, Nothing is equal to God, God is infinite. (at least in my opinion).

I agree God is infinite. I agree nothing is equal to God, but I recognize that GOD is manifested in a few ways. You can divide infinity by 3 and you still have infinity. Think about it.

Make a number line 0, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 ....
It runs on for infinity, just like it does here, -5, -4, -3, -2, -1, 0, 1
And between 1 and 2 you have an infinite set of numbers. However it is held within the infinity set, and you have many infinity sets within the infinitey set.

I really don't care how you look at the Trinity, or let's call it the Divinity. I don't think believing they are together and separate is a requirement to get to heaven.

you are offended because you have your own laws.

yip yip yip yip. like a 18 oz dog barking like a great dane.

Show me where I have my own laws. I think you might could make the argument, had I not given scripture for all I did/said. Since you haven't refuted that, you have nothing but an urge to, YIP YIP YIP YIP>...