What does Paul mean when he says God wants government to wield the sword of justice? Dispensationaly. What should governments do?
Ecclesiastes 3:8
toldailytopic: Some say: Hate the sin, love the sinner. But what does God say?
- Thread starter Nathon Detroit
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What does Paul mean when he says God wants government to wield the sword of justice? Dispensationaly. What should governments do?
Ecclesiastes 3:8
Krsto
Well-known member
Are you preaching universalism?
newjerusalem4
New member
God really didn't "send" Jesus as in He didn't send another person......God came himself!
Something tells me you aren't paying attention to what the other posters are saying.
Judge no one. You could be seriously led astray if you do.
Those who are led unconditionally by precisely what the Spirit has in mind for them as discerned within their own heart has God given freedom, liberty and justification to transgress the law (the Ten Commandments) and they do not accrue sin.
Such persons are authentic Christians, the only ones. They are glorified by God for living in this manner. Unaware people and others who are not in Christ will not find such people to be good or righteous. These unaware and others who are not 'in Christ' are and will continue to be very seriously and very sadly, mistaken.
Unaware people, including those under the law and others who are not in Christ, lack awareness of Truth. This deprives their actions from being informed by Truth. They are never in righteousness with God and the results of their actions always deliver them into sin and hell.
It is quite the opposite for those who can and are led unconditionally by precisely what the Spirit has in mind for them as discerned within their own heart. What the Spirit has in mind for one as discerned within one's own heart, is always in line with the will of God. This is what God says that one must 'do and pray for'.
One accrues no sin for unconditionally obeying this agenda. Example: God's will for Abraham was that he transgress the 'thou shall not kill (a human)' by offering to kill his son as a sacrifice. Abraham's unconditional willingness to unconditionally obey God, counted for righteousness. One accrue no sin if one transgress the laws of sin, when one is being unconditionally obedient to God.
How can an unaware person discern whether the apparent sinful actions of Christians are in fact sinful or simply unconditional obedience to precisely what God wills?
With the advent of Christians on earth, one can be judged only under the laws of the land and international laws. There is really no room for hating, what is perceived to be sin, in any absolute manner. Nor is their any basis for loving one who is perceived to a sinner, in any absolute manner. In actuality all actions by only authentic Christians can be loved and only all Christians can be loved. Every one else is unworthy and their action unworthy. . . . . . with respect to them, Jesus said, 'let the dead bury their dead', a show of absolute disdain.
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If God's son was made to be sin for all men does this mean that all men are now sinless and worthy. If yes, why are only a few chosen? Why are many called and few chosen?
And why did Jesus say, 'let the dead bury their dead'.
Seems to me that God sent the Spirit of His Son into the hearts of those under the law so that they might become adopted 'children of God' (re. Galatians: 4 verses: 5 to 7).
'Might' means that one has to discern, accept and adopt this offer of Jesus' Spirit within one's own heart. It is not guaranteed. One might become an adopted 'child of God', if one accept this offer from God of the Spirit of His son which He sent into your heart.
Seems that 'the dead' are those who are dead to the Spirit of Jesus within their own heart. And according to the prophesy of the Lord Jesus, this seems to be the very great majority of people (all but the few) who are called to Christianity.
Also it seems not only a matter of discerning, accepting and adopting the Spirit which God sent into one's heart. Salvation and deliverance seems to be also rooted in discerning precisely what the Spirit has in mind for one from within one's heart and obeying same unconditionally. That is, salvation and deliverance seems rooted in being led by the Spirit.
This idea that Jesus died for everyone or that He died for the sin of all, seems redundant against the background of these revelations.
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I think you can do that on your own.
I want to know what you mean by the terms.
This seem true.
However what is righteous judgment?
Does this mean that only God can judge?
Can any man 'judge with righteous judgment', what ever that is?
Cracked
New member
Romans 3:9-10
Romans 2:1-4
To truly exercise righteous judgment, you would have to be righteous. Interesting to contemplate...
If he is telling us to do it, then don't you think you can do it? Step one, take the beam out of our own eye, so we can see clearly to pull the speck out of our neighbors. You should condemn immorality, wickedness, evil, theiver, whatever it is. But you yourself should not be caught up in it either.
That isn't what he means, he means the judgement should be just, and not unjust. The adjective righteous is decribing the judgement.
And I believe you are in the Body of Christ, which makes you righteous to judge. So either way, you should do it, but not as a hypocrite or worse.
Merry meat
New member
It means that we must take over the government for Jesus.
patman
Active member
I think if you inserted the word "option" then it would help...
For example:
And love without the option for hatred is useless
Otherwise it is forced love, which isn't love at all.
I reject the yin-yang idea too. God didn't need hate to make love... like darkness is the lack of light, hate (simply put) is the lack of love. So it isn't that you need hate to have love, it is that without love, you have hate...
The statement in italics above is relevant when you consider the paradox of a life where hate is made impossible because one is forced to love... that isn't love it is slavery. Does that help?
Finally, my first response! Love/hate should be understood as both verbs and nouns. God loved (verb) His creation and did something about our condition instead of hating (verb) us and destroying all of mankind. But God still maintains an attitude of hate (noun) toward those that oppose Him. We rightly do the same thing. We love (verb) our enemies enough to do something about their condition by unselfishly devoting our personal time to them in the form of ministering; as opposed to hating (verb) them and simply ignoring their need. But we also maintain an attitude of hate (noun) toward those that oppose God.
Just and unjust judgment requires two fundamentals.
This requires one to be aware of every detail and/or instruction from God to the individual you are seeking to judge.
And it requires some set of generalized laws (like the Ten Commandment) which can be legitimately applied to every one. The fact is that the Ten Commandments do not apply to Christians.
Jesus through Paul confirmed that if there was a law given that could give life righteousness would have been by law. However, there is none. Not even the Ten Commandments. So now righteousness without the law is manifested.
What God tells a person to do, as discerned within one's heart from the Spirit (i.e. the Christian way), is known only to that person and God. God's will for one as discerned from the Spirit within one's own heart does not uphold or respect any fixed and generalized laws which must be the basis of any judgment system for use by man.
In order to unconditionally obey God, Abraham had to willingly transgress the 'thou shall not kill a human' commandment. (the human in question was his child).
This is what Abraham was faced with and he was prepared to kill his child as a sacrifice under the will of God.
It is confirmed by the Lord Jesus that the mere intent is the commission of the act.
Therefore as a Christian who is called to judge Abraham would you condemn him for his intent or put him in righteousness with God. For the many non Christian observers (some of whom erroneously believe that they are Christians), Abraham's intention to kill his child would be deemed malicious and wrong, however this earned Abraham righteousness with God because he was unconditionally obeying the will of God.
Therefore, when you judge your fellow Christian, how would you know whether or not the particular action which you are judging was done under the will of God as discerned from the Spirit from within his heart or not.
Fact is that there is nothing to judge with respect to Christians. Christian are people who have absolute God given freedom, liberty and justification to transgress all ideals and laws of society, morality and religiosity (including the Ten Commandments) when they are led unconditionally by precisely what the Spirit has in mind for them, as discerned within their own heart.
If you choose to judge Christians (as you seem eager to do) it can be only on the urging and authority of Satan. It cannot be on the urgings, authority and/or sanction of God. Only God judges His Children. God's children are Christians.
God gives precise and individualized missions to His Children which may require them to transgress prevailing ideals and laws of society, morality and religiosity (including the Ten Commandments). Only God would know the mission which he approved for each of his children. Only God would know, on an individual basis, if his children are unconditionally obeying precisely what the Spirit has in mind for them as discerned within they own individual hearts, as they ought to do unconditionally. Therefore only God can judge them.
Those who are authentic Christians know this absolutely. They never try to justify judging their fellow man. And they never judge their fellow man.
You are caught in a trap which reveals your 'unawareness' (i.e. your state of being 'dead within' or 'dead'). That is, you are caught in the trap which reveals that you are not 'in Christ'. And now you are known for who you are.
One is known by one's belief. One who discern wisdom in laws are still under the law. Such a person is not yet onto the Spirit of Jesus which God sent into the hearts of those under the law so that they might become adopted children of God. One who discerns wisdom in laws has not yet picked up this offer of the Spirit of Jesus (within his own heart) from God. Such a one is still simply dead within. He is 'the dead', who according to Jesus will bury their dead. That is, the dead will bury each other, God and/or Jesus have and will have, nothing to do with such people.
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