marhig
Well-known member
I ask you to think about this a bit further. Keypurr is absolutely correct to say that Jesus Christ HAS a God, and that is the Father. The Father is Supreme. (Psalm 83:18, KJV)
Revelation 1:8 refers to the Father, not Jesus. Both Jesus and God (the Father) are being spoken about in chapter one. It is perfectly reasonable to say that verse 8 is about the Father. Indeed, verse 9 refers to Jesus AND God. John said that he was on the island of Patmos because he was "speaking about God and bearing witness to Jesus." It is only the Father, God, who is "Almighty."
That leads us into your second reference, at Isaiah 9:6. Most versions of the Bible simply go along with the King James Version there, which is OK, but the Holy Bible from the Aramaic of the Peshitta renders it this way:
"For unto us a child is born, to us a son is given; and the government will be upon his shoulder: and his name is called 'wonderful counsellor, the mighty one, the everlasting god, the prince of peace.'"
So much for "Everlasting Father." But that can be explained too, if we insist on the KJV. Anyway, we of course know that there are no capital letters in Hebrew/Aramaic, or even in Greek. Jesus is referred to as "god" in perhaps two places in the Bible, but never Almighty God (in upper-case OR lower-case). The "god" that Jesus is is from the Hebrew El Gibbohr, which means "mighty god," NOT Almighty God.
Only Jehovah is referred to as El Shaddai, which is Almighty God.
So the prophecy in Isaiah refers to the Messiah to come, but not Almighty God. He is a "mighty god," meaning that he will be a powerful, important, highly regarded individual. That is what "god" meant to the Jewish audience of Isaiah's day and also in the Apostle John's day. Gods were distinguished from one another by certain titles, such as "El Gibbohr" and "El Shaddai," or, as in John's day, definite articles.
It is interesting that the Jewish Publication Society's Tanakh renders Isaiah 9:6 like this: "He has been named 'the Mighty God is planning grace; the Eternal Father, a peaceable ruler.'" We already know that "Mighty God" just means a powerful person, and only the Father, Jehovah, is Almighty. It could even be referring to Jehovah, as He is called BOTH "mighty" and "almighty." But the Messiah is also called "Eternal Father" here. That must be in the sense that he has given life to someone, as Jesus did when he died for our salvation so that we could live forever. (Even Paul considered himself a spiritual "father" to his believing "children," though he had no fleshly children.)
Jesus never accepted worship as God Almighty. He accepted "worship" in the sense of being respected. Only his Father deserved worship as the Almighty. Jesus always pointed to the Father as the Most High, and his God. (John 17:3; John 20:17)
I agree with most of that, except that Jesus didn't give us life by his death on the cross. He was dead a long time before the cross, he gave his whole life to God and we receive life through him. He gave us life through the spirit, firstly by the word of God through the the gospel of salvation and then by the spirit within once we are born anew of God. And those who believe and have faith are saved from death. And if they endure to the end they have the hope of receiving eternal life.
John 6
It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
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