The Terrible God of Calvinism

beloved57

beloved57

Well-known member
Ask Mr. Religion said:
I recall a few years ago you denied being a Calvinist. Have you modified this opinion since that time?

AMR
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Its a difference to me in being a Calvinist and all that entails, I believe the Doctrines of Grace, the Truths of Tulip set forth the Gospel of Gods Grace systematically !

I also believe that if one does not receive and embrace the Doctrines of Grace that they are in unbelief Period ! Whereas a Calvinist in this day and time accepts those who dont believe the Doctrines of Grace as Gospel Believers anyway, I dont do that, thats a compromise of the Gospel ! Thats where I stand. Because I believe in Tulip, folk call me a calvinist, but I am not in the traditional sense, but if you want to call me one in a limited sense, thats ok with me, if you dont want to call me one thats ok, but know this, TULIP is the Gospel, and those who reject it, reject the Gospel, and if you accept as Christian those who do that, you are a unfaithful and disloyal to the Truth !

Now, you best save this response, because I know you will some day ask me the same question !
 
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beloved57 said:
Its a difference to me in being a Calvinist and all that entails, I believe the Doctrines of Grace, the Truths of Tulip set forth the Gospel of Gods Grace systematically !

I also believe that if one does not receive and embrace the Doctrines of Grace that they are in unbelief Period ! Whereas a Calvinist in this day and time accepts those who dont believe the Doctrines of Grace as Gospel Believers anyway, I dont do that, thats a compromise of the Gospel ! Thats where I stand. Because I believe in Tulip, folk call me a calvinist, but I am not in the traditional sense, but if you want to call me one in a limited sense, thats ok with me, if you dont want to call me one thats ok, but know this, TULIP is the Gospel, and those who reject it, reject the Gospel, and if you accept as Christian those who do that, you are a unfaithful and disloyal to the Truth !

Now, you best save this response, because I know you will some day ask me the same question !
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Thank you for the direct and plainly stated response. I will save it. The link (without the text) to your long ago previous post had expired during some TOL database purges. Since then I have taken up the habit of saving responses along with links to avoid this in the future.

As to your TULIP or "lost, hell-bound, and sin-bent" as the only choices of the professing believer, I must demur. I am satisfied to claim, until evidence to the contrary, that those that I believe may be confused on the specific matter of the doctrines of grace as brothers and sisters. Not all will come to the full measure of understanding and enjoy the graces of said understanding on matters of doctrine taught in Scripture. Gifts are given in the measure of the capacity of one's abilities. The gifts of practical knowledge is no substitute for the gift of heart knowledge, and the reverse. Both are necessary and given according to each believer's capacity, but we should not expect all to possess them both in equal measure.

AMR
 
beloved57

beloved57

Well-known member
Ask Mr. Religion said:
Thank you for the direct and plainly stated response. I will save it. The link (without the text) to your long ago previous post had expired during some TOL database purges. Since then I have taken up the habit of saving responses along with links to avoid this in the future.

As to your TULIP or "lost, hell-bound, and sin-bent" as the only choices of the professing believer, I must demur. I am satisfied to claim, until evidence to the contrary, that those that I believe may be confused on the specific matter of the doctrines of grace as brothers and sisters. Not all will come to the full measure of understanding and enjoy the graces of said understanding on matters of doctrine taught in Scripture. Gifts are given in the measure of the capacity of one's abilities. The gifts of practical knowledge is no substitute for the gift of heart knowledge, and the reverse. Both are necessary and given according to each believer's capacity, but we should not expect all to possess them both in equal measure.

AMR
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I see you as an unfaithful to the Gospel Truth!
 
beloved57

beloved57

Well-known member
NickCharles said:
Then add me to your list. I have trouble believing you're saved because between here and when you were on CF, you've never demonstrated anything resembling a Christ-like behavior.
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Consider it done, you are on the list and I see nothing in your behavior resembling a Christ like behavior since you don't believe the Gospel!
 
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Ask Mr. Religion

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beloved57 said:
Consider it done, you are on the list and I see nothing in your behavior resembling a Christ like behavior since you don't believe the Gospel!
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Well if you are going to quote Spurgeon in your sig and then think you are doing the man a favor of his actual position, you should understand the man better.

Review please:
View attachment 20581

In particular:

"I have also seen the measuring line in the hands of others—Doctrinalists. Yes; and their line has five marks which were originally made by John Calvin. And if your opinions do not square exactly to the standard, you are cut off from all part and lot in the blessings of vital godliness.

Zion is certainly built according to the arrangement of the five points, and therefore if any Brother or Sister does not comprehend and receive them all, he is not a weak Believer, but according to the measuring line of our rigid friends, he is not a Believer at all!

You know, Brothers and Sisters, that there is no soul living who holds more firmly to the Doctrines of Grace than I do, and if any man asks me whether I am ashamed to be called a Calvinist, I answer, I wish to be called nothing but a Christian; but if you ask me, do I hold the Doctrinal views which were held by John Calvin, I reply, I do in the main hold them and rejoice to avow it.

But, my dear Friends, far be it from me even to imagine that Zion contains none within her walls but Calvinistic Christians—or that there are none saved who do not hold our views!

Most atrocious things have been spoken about the character and spiritual condition of John Wesley, the modern prince of Arminians. I can only say concerning him, that while I detest many of the Doctrines which he preached, yet for the man himself I have a reverence second to no Wesleyan; and if there were needed two Apostles to be added to the number of the 12, I do not believe that there could be found two men more fit to be so added than George Whitefield and John Wesley. The character of John Wesley stands beyond all imputation for self-sacrifice, zeal, holiness, and communion with God. He lived far above the ordinary level of common Christians, and was one of whom the world was not worthy. I believe there are multitudes of men who cannot see these Truths of God, or, at least cannot see them in the way in which we put them, who nevertheless have received Christ into their hearts, and are as dear to the heart of the God of Grace, as the soundest Calvinist out of Heaven. I thank God we do not believe in the measuring line of any form of bigotry."
​

:AMR:

AMR
 
beloved57

beloved57

Well-known member
Ask Mr. Religion said:
Well if you are going to quote Spurgeon in your sig and then think you are doing the man a favor of his actual position, you should understand the man better.

Review please:
View attachment 20581

In particular:

"I have also seen the measuring line in the hands of others—Doctrinalists. Yes; and their line has five marks which were originally made by John Calvin. And if your opinions do not square exactly to the standard, you are cut off from all part and lot in the blessings of vital godliness.

Zion is certainly built according to the arrangement of the five points, and therefore if any Brother or Sister does not comprehend and receive them all, he is not a weak Believer, but according to the measuring line of our rigid friends, he is not a Believer at all!

You know, Brothers and Sisters, that there is no soul living who holds more firmly to the Doctrines of Grace than I do, and if any man asks me whether I am ashamed to be called a Calvinist, I answer, I wish to be called nothing but a Christian; but if you ask me, do I hold the Doctrinal views which were held by John Calvin, I reply, I do in the main hold them and rejoice to avow it.

But, my dear Friends, far be it from me even to imagine that Zion contains none within her walls but Calvinistic Christians—or that there are none saved who do not hold our views!

Most atrocious things have been spoken about the character and spiritual condition of John Wesley, the modern prince of Arminians. I can only say concerning him, that while I detest many of the Doctrines which he preached, yet for the man himself I have a reverence second to no Wesleyan; and if there were needed two Apostles to be added to the number of the 12, I do not believe that there could be found two men more fit to be so added than George Whitefield and John Wesley. The character of John Wesley stands beyond all imputation for self-sacrifice, zeal, holiness, and communion with God. He lived far above the ordinary level of common Christians, and was one of whom the world was not worthy. I believe there are multitudes of men who cannot see these Truths of God, or, at least cannot see them in the way in which we put them, who nevertheless have received Christ into their hearts, and are as dear to the heart of the God of Grace, as the soundest Calvinist out of Heaven. I thank God we do not believe in the measuring line of any form of bigotry."
​

:AMR:

AMR
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I don't have to agree with everything spurgeon did and said because I agreed with a few statements of his! You still are unfaithful to the Truth of the Gospel, and call unbelievers Christians, that is a lack of love for the Truth!
 
R

Robert Pate

Well-known member
Banned
NickCharles said:
So do you you try to win them to the truth, or do you judge and condemn them?
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I give them the Gospel that justifies the ungodly, Romans 4:5 and reconciles the world unto God, 2 Corinthians 5:19.

That is all that I can do. It is up to the Holy Spirit to do the rest.
 
NickCharles

NickCharles

New member
Robert Pate said:
I give them the Gospel that justifies the ungodly, Romans 4:5 and reconciles the world unto God, 2 Corinthians 5:19.



That is all that I can do. It is up to the Holy Spirit to do the rest.
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Well, I can quote many posts of yours to me where you've judged my salvation and said I would end up in hell. Is that how you always evangelize?
 
R

Robert Pate

Well-known member
Banned
NickCharles said:
Well, I can quote many posts of yours to me where you've judged my salvation and said I would end up in hell. Is that how you always evangelize?
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You don't have the Holy Spirit. That is very evident.

No Spirit, means no salvation.

Some one said, "Try the Spirits to see if they be of God".
 
R

Robert Pate

Well-known member
Banned
NickCharles said:
See? Back to judgement and condemnation. It's your fallback when you can't defend your view. You make it look like its the fault of your opponent.
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You are professing to be a Christian, not an unbeliever.

People that profess to be Christians when they are not, or do not believe in the basics of Christianity need to be rebuked.
 
beloved57

beloved57

Well-known member
Robert Pate said:
I give them the Gospel that justifies the ungodly, Romans 4:5 and reconciles the world unto God, 2 Corinthians 5:19.

That is all that I can do. It is up to the Holy Spirit to do the rest.
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You don't believe or understand those verses of scripture, you teach against them both! You teach that millions upon millions for whom Christ lived and died for shall yet die in their sins in unbelief!
 
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