So you deny spiritual Israel Jesus talks about?
The Slaying of Reformed Theology (Calvinism)
- Thread starter Evil.Eye.<(I)>
- Start date
- Status
So you deny spiritual Israel Jesus talks about?
Because it agrees with the scriptures. It begins where the Scriptures say to begin- with GOD, not YOURSELF. Wisdom begins at HIS SOVEREIGNTY, not YOUR FREE WILL.
Calvinism actually holds to God, in which God shapes people- you all believe in a fallible being whom you shape to secure your salvation.
You said it. Interpretations asserted as a lens to view scripture through.
You can't even get past the point 2 without failing.
[MENTION=7209]Ask Mr. Religion[/MENTION] pumped [MENTION=5671]nikolai_42[/MENTION] with his link. This asserts my assertion of 1 John 2:27. It has to be dismembered to support Calvinism.
Literally! Scripture is being twisted by those that claim "Sola Scripture".
[MENTION=10685]Brother Ducky[/MENTION] is the only one here that has approached this straight forward the whole way without attempting to hide his extra biblical learned doctrine or twist scripture.
Last edited:
If your theology is truly as you claim then why have you provided no scripture or rebuttal to all the scripture which has already to this point utterly slain your theology and left it wounded and bloodied? Calling people idiots and imbeciles only reveals that you wish to remain where you are, with your head in the sand, and defer to your church leaders. The very fact that you do so reveals that what you say is not true because your theology comes not from the scripture but from your church founders and elders.
It appears you do not understand what I wrote.
I asked you a simple question. why such lengthy answer?
Dude, I dropped a myriad of scripture on you and you failed to show that they did not conflict with your belief- in fact, a lot of those verses swing right back around and refute the interpretations you have on your own references.
You being either too prejudiced or too dumb to figure it out is your own problem, you all have really 'slain' yourselves, because you've just shown how spastic and unreliable you all are when it comes to edifying anybody on anything.
So go back to the drawing board and try again, I'm done with this thread :rotfl:
God's Truth
New member
Let us talk about those scriptures Calvinists use. I tell you, you might be surprised.
You dropped scripture that means something through the lens of Reformed writings.
You claim "Sola Scripture" and in front of God and everybody, [MENTION=7209]Ask Mr. Religion[/MENTION] posts a link to his writing for Nikolai_42 to draw from. Even after I subscribe... I won't view the link. That is secretive and I initially took the stance of a good sport... but then... [MENTION=5671]nikolai_42[/MENTION] comes back with a statement about puritan writings on scripture.
Game Over for him too. I was duped into thinking [MENTION=5671]nikolai_42[/MENTION] could honestly give his opinion in the matter, but he needs to look at 1 John 2:27 through the lens of the reformed.
[MENTION=10685]Brother Ducky[/MENTION] remains the only one that has stepped up and remained up front and void of having a theological hand shoved up his scripture hole to give an answer.
This is enormously sad!
Now...... [MENTION=18375]Evil.Eye.<(I)>[/MENTION] walks up to the house of Calvinism with a piece of paper, hammer and nail. He looks at its well trafficked door and places the piece of paper as high as he can reach. He takes the single nail and pins the top of the piece of paper to the door. The Hammer swings back and... "Bang, Bang, Bang". The 6 Theses hang on the door as simple, irrefutable scriptural truths.
(EE)is the OP quoted said:
....... Simple, Straight from scripture and Fully Defensible by every word of scripture.
Before you laugh and think 6 scripture references can't put Calvinism in Check Mate, I will explain.
1: Is God a promoter of Sin? Absolutely Not
The concept of "free will" is the key to this Galatians reference.
2: Let no man teach you
The defense of any extra biblical document as entry into scholarly, theological debate is rendered as heresy by this simple 1 John reference.
3: Let your yes be yes and your no be no, anything else is from the evil one
This Matthew reference fully destroys a doctrine based believer's ability to skirt around any direct question with a wall of theological effort.
4: God shows no favoritism
This James reference is razor sharp and when used in conjunction with 1 - 3, it becomes impossible to defend the doctrine of election and reprobation.
5: God is Love
Calvinism must narrow the scope of God's Love to support its claim that God specifically created and reprobated certain persons to "eternal" punishment. This 1 John reference makes it impossible to deny that Love is God's supreme attribute. (Note: Calvin taught eternal hell fire, thus it is impossible to soften this from reformed doctrine)
6: Love knows no limit to its endurance, no end to its trust, no fading of its hope; it can outlast anything. It is, in fact, the one thing that still stands when all else has fallen.
This excerpt from 1st Corinthians makes it irrefutable that God's Love has no bounds or limits.
Together, these simple scriptures force concession, denial of biblical truth or acknowledgement that Reformed Theology is just another doctrine of men that divides believers with dishonest assertions.
Link to my fully disclosed motivation for posting this
In-depth disclosure of my full motivation
To be direct... All 6 work interchangeably together (flawlessly) as crossed swords that are poised to undo the Spiritual damage that this doctrine, that is named after a man, has done.
Bottom line purpose and stance of this OP edited in due to Slander against its validity.
I do not assert that anyone that proclaims the blood of Christ is anything but a Christian. I am challenging a hyphenated addition of baggage.
The core OP asserts that the extra biblical additions of Calvinism cannot stand when confronted with these 6 simple truths in scripture.
I am clearly contesting admission of the reformed commentary, Calvin's Institutes and The Westminster Confessions of Faith into any legitimate debate. Read more closely before you casually dismiss my assertions.
Scripture has been provided and scripture free of added commentary has been challenged to be brought back that contest's my assertion.
Whatever the proper way to say this is, no Calvinist here has displayed a passion for scripture by refuting this with scripture, but a passion for Calvin.
Something is wrong with Calvinisms perpetual proclaimation of Calvinism.
It's JESUS, not calvin that saves us.
perhaps we without faith in doctrines of men can stand united on this matter, despite our collective theological and personal divisions.
Over and Over this OP is being affirmed true! 1 John 2:27 is cited........
Head Calvinist AMR kindly provides someone a reference to "theologically" dismantling 1 John 2:27's core meaning... "sola scripture"
Calvinism points its fingers at the Catholic Church and many others, but it has a "Prophet" of its own. It's the conglomerate works of the reformists.
Hi, my name is Bobby, I'm a vegetarian that only eats vegetarian animals....
Logic... busted
Last edited:
Lol, "back to the drawing board" he says:
Two vessels from the selfsame lump of clay as already shown:
Rom 9:13-26, Jer 18:1-6, Jer 19:1-11, Isa 29:14, 15, 16, and Isa 64:6, 7, 8.
And every man is a lump of clay as has also already been discussed in several different ways. What Reform and Calvinism does is to essentially reject the will of the Potter Himself, who says that He has the right to make them twain; for first comes the old man Esau nature, the natural man, a vessel fit to dishonor and destruction: then comes the second vessel, the new man which is born out of the destruction of the old. It is an allegory which when made into literal physical individual human beings, as Calvinism and Reform indeed do in their theology, ends up assigning literal physical individual human beings into destruction simply because God wills it to be so. They deny the right of the Creator Himself to make from themselves two vessels from the selfsame single lump of clay, themselves, so that they have no need to actually repent or change themselves: but this unfortunate set of circumstances comes at the expense of fellow human beings whom they assign to eternal hell fire just because those people do not agree with their own "elect" doctrines.
Carnal Minded Man -vs- Spiritual Minded Man
Old Man -vs- New Man
Pharaoh -vs- Moses
Ishmael -vs- Isaac
Esau -vs- Jacob
Elohim hardens the heart of the old man so that Elohim may destroy him and bring about a new birth, an Elohim seed, (Malachi 2:15), a holy one, the new man; and this is fulfilled in Messiah if we carry out his holy Testimony in our own lives: two vessels of spirit from the one single selfsame lump of clay. In this way of thinking there is NO UNRIGHTEOUSNESS with Elohim because He is not predetermining any one of His own individually created human beings into destruction just because He wills it to be so. Instead He has predetermined that each and every individual must part himself asunder, and render unto Caesar the things that be of Caesar, and render unto Elohim the things of Elohim. We therefore are required, as He says, to CLEAVE away unto Him if we love Him. Thus the "old man" must be crucified, mortified, put to death, allowed to die off on the vine: and Messiah is the only True Vine because his holy Testimony shows us how to do these things and become pleasing to his and our heavenly Father.
Rom 9:13-26, Jer 18:1-6, Jer 19:1-11, Isa 29:14, 15, 16, and Isa 64:6, 7, 8.
Jeremiah 18:1-6 KJV
1 The word which came to Jeremiah from the LORD, saying,
2 Arise, and go down to the potter's house, and there I will cause thee to hear my words.
3 Then I went down to the potter's house, and, behold, he wrought a work on the wheels.
4 And the vessel that he made of clay was marred in the hand of the potter: so he made it again another vessel, as seemed good to the potter to make it.
5 Then the word of the LORD came to me, saying,
6 O house of Israel, cannot I do with you as this potter? saith the LORD. Behold, as the clay is in the potter's hand, so are ye in mine hand, O house of Israel.
But you fail to realize that even though the above speaks to the nation as a whole still yet other passages clearly make this personal and individual to each in his or her own appointed times. You are the lump of clay, O man, as it is written, "Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated", and these two were twins. What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with Elohim? Absolutely not! For he says to Moses, "I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion." So then it is not of him that wills, nor of him that runs, but of Elohim that shows mercy. For the scripture says unto Pharaoh, "Even for this same purpose have I raised you up, that I might show My Power in you, and that My name might be declared throughout all the earth." Therefore He has mercy on whom He will have mercy, and whom He will, He hardens. You will say then unto me, Why does He yet find fault? for who has resisted His will? Nay but, O man, who are you to reply against Elohim? Shall the thing formed say to Him that formed it, Why have you made me thus? or Why have you made me twain? Has not the Potter the power over the clay, of the selfsame lump to make one vessel unto honor, and another unto dishonor? (for behold, He says, "I kill, and I make alive", and we know the terror of the Absolute Master, for He is an all consuming fire). What if Elohim, willing to show His wrath and to make His power known, endured with much long-suffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction so that He might make known the riches of His glory on the vessels of mercy which He had before prepared unto glory: even us, ourselves, whom He has called; not of the Yhudim only, but also of the Nations?
Who are you, O man, to reply against the Potter? You are the lump of clay! :rotfl:
If He says He will make two vessels out of you then He will . . . :Nineveh:
You can't even let your yes be yes!
Outright... Did God "Predestine" men to damnation that currently have no free will, thus they "cannot" believe on Jesus to be saved?
You don't even fully understand predestination. None of you do- you've all been duped into a false idea that predestination implies that we are 'robots'. I explained it in this thread, and many other threads- you all just have unfounded hatred for the Reformists is all.
I'm not getting into any heavy debate with either of you, I'm just going to point out the monolithic inconsistencies you two pour out :wave:
I just don't understand the Calvinists who are so loyal to murderer's teachings.
Do you know Calvin was murderer?
This is the million dollar example of how "Extra Biblical Prophet" based Dogma's justify themselves. You secretly discuss your extra biblical teachings and when they are challenged you say this exact thing.
I opened this OP believing Calvinism was a marginally honest dogma, but the longer it goes on, the more distraught I become. I have heard these same claims by many other religious divisions that say the exact same verbiage structure you just wrote.
The follow up is... let me "teach" you what we really believe.
You can't answer with a yes or no!
I assert over and over that I am a fallible man and hold to core scriptural principals. I have spoken to my doctrine free brothers and sisters and am on record as asking us to only be united in Christ Crucified.
#Your internet layman joke is funny
#Your straw man is half consumed and [MENTION=7209]Ask Mr. Religion[/MENTION] fanned the flames
Evening Tally
[MENTION=10685]Brother Ducky[/MENTION] remains the only Calvinist representative that has been up front and answered apart from doctrine. He only cited doctrine when asked, and did so honestly, but has yet to answer the last question asked of him.
I merely assert this entire OP's discussion to support my statement.
[MENTION=10685]Brother Ducky[/MENTION] remains the only Calvinist representative that has been up front and answered apart from doctrine. He only cited doctrine when asked, and did so honestly, but has yet to answer the last question asked of him.
I merely assert this entire OP's discussion to support my statement.
Eagles Wings
New member
- Status