The Death of Manufacturing in the USA

[Aimiel]

When the car makers were in trouble a few years ago, the employee parking lot was filled with foreign cars. Whine because there's no jobs but buy foreign garbage. I buy american every chance I get and will never buy a foreign car.

We need people to buy american and we need protectionism like we used to have. Tax imports and create an outsourcing tax. And eliminate the income tax for all individuals and for business that hires exclusively Americans

Good for you! I love visiting Detroit and seeing something like 80-90% of the cars on the road being American cars. :thumb:

I've bought ONLY Ford products my whole life, but our government, in the 70's, should have put tariffs on foreign import automobiles. I noticed this problem and thought up it's solution while I was still in high school, but our congress was too stupid (read: friendly to Japan) to install those tariffs. Had they protected automobile manufacturing the way ball-bearing manufacturing and Mag-Lite flashlight copyrights are protected by our laws, we'd all be able to afford to drive Hummer's, Lincoln's or Cadillac's.

 

[rougueone]

I've written about this before, but few took the subject seriously. The US is no longer self-sufficient. We rely upon goods and services in foreign countries who we compete against, and lose. Obama's free trade bill for China is a step in the wrong direction. Please read and consider the following article.

http://cnsnews.com/news/article/ter...bs-manufacturing-employment-down-37-1979-peak

These jobs are now lost with little chance of turning the tide unless the government changes course. Will President Obama or President-in-training Hillary Clinton stem the tide? No. It was President Bill Clinton who gave us NAFTA with Republican support. What do we do?

NAFTA came after our lively hoods were stolen-outsourced. The Corporate Cartels who do own our Government, have spent the last 40 plus years stealing our industries that supported the middle class. 40 years of eliminating the Unions that did create the middle class. The Unions are now a frightened representatives of a fragmented small group of middle class workers. 40 years of planning, exploiting cheap labor abroad. 40 years to destroy the American worker.

They are not going to suddenly have a repentant heart and re-build America.

It's not over. It's going to get worse.

 

[rougueone]

Amen. http://deathbychina.com/

I watched that documentary on netflix, its excellent.

My perspectives are that China's growth was birthed by the U.S. Government and U.S. Corporate Cartels. Both are bed partners's. China took on the bulk of U.S. debt. They purchased the debt. In return the U.S. ceded it's position of power. Allowing China to become the greatest producer of goods on earth.
As you stated, a title the U.S. once held. China's military hardware will exceed the U.S. in about 5-7 years. Stealth bombers. fast attack subs, Aircraft carriers ET....Plus China developed the Dong Feng 21 missile . Designed to destroy foreign Air craft carriers.

http://www.usni.org/news-and-features/chinese-kill-weapon


Next comes a non nuclear attack....
The Asian Infrastructure Investment Bank. China's own Central Bank. To compete with the dollar. It has 67 Nations aboard. Many are supposed to be U.S. "allies". 34 nations joined when the link provided was written. It may well be a hundred Nations now. The globe is about to dump the dollar. China owns the bulk of the dollar debt. ( Dollars are debtor notes.) And China is going to want it's money back from the U.S.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-03-22/us-officially-loses-battle-over-china-led-investment-bank

ON Oct 21, the I.M.F.( International Monetary Fund) , will announce it's acceptance of China's Central Bank-currency, or not. Do the math. It is highly probable the I.M.F. will vote for China. Putting the dollar in a fierce and no win competition, for global dominance-Hegemony. The U.S. will not " fold-up" on Oct 21. But we will realize much quicker, " Game over" for the U.S..

 

[Mocking You]

So the U.S. no longer manufactures many consumer goods but we are world leaders in airplane manufacturing, large machinery and equipment manufacturing, earth moving equipment, computers, servers and networking equipment, telecommunications networks and devices, defense and weapons systems, satellites and space based electronic equipment, avionics electronics, etc.

Our focus has changed from consumer to industrial goods but since consumers buy stuff that says Made in China (or elsewhere) they incorrectly assume our manufacturing base is in deep trouble.

Furthermore, do not confuse a loss of manufacturing jobs to mean the US doesn't manufacture things. Efficiencies in the manufacturing process means less people are needed, and not necessarily that less products are produced.

 

[fzappa13]

I've written about this before, but few took the subject seriously. The US is no longer self-sufficient. We rely upon goods and services in foreign countries who we compete against, and lose. Obama's free trade bill for China is a step in the wrong direction. Please read and consider the following article.

http://cnsnews.com/news/article/ter...bs-manufacturing-employment-down-37-1979-peak

These jobs are now lost with little chance of turning the tide unless the government changes course. Will President Obama or President-in-training Hillary Clinton stem the tide? No. It was President Bill Clinton who gave us NAFTA with Republican support. What do we do?

... mmmm you forgot GATT ... and they were both forwarded by every American president since '47, Bill was just on watch when it was signed ... welcome to America.

 

[The Berean]

So the U.S. no longer manufactures many consumer goods but we are world leaders in airplane manufacturing, large machinery and equipment manufacturing, earth moving equipment, computers, servers and networking equipment, telecommunications networks and devices, defense and weapons systems, satellites and space based electronic equipment, avionics electronics, etc.

Our focus has changed from consumer to industrial goods but since consumers buy stuff that says Made in China (or elsewhere) they incorrectly assume our manufacturing base is in deep trouble.

Furthermore, do not confuse a loss of manufacturing jobs to mean the US doesn't manufacture things. Efficiencies in the manufacturing process means less people are needed, and not necessarily that less products are produced.

As someone who lives in Silicon Valley and who has worked in the aerospace, telecommunications and defense industries my entire career I approve of this message. :up:

 

[PureX]

When the car makers were in trouble a few years ago, the employee parking lot was filled with foreign cars. Whine because there's no jobs but buy foreign garbage. I buy american every chance I get and will never buy a foreign car.

We need people to buy american and we need protectionism like we used to have. Tax imports and create an outsourcing tax. And eliminate the income tax for all individuals and for business that hires exclusively americans

We can't do that because the people who run this country are the people who outsourced the manufacturing in the first place. The whole system is rigged in favor of the capitalist investor. That's why it's called 'capitalism'. And the capitalist investor wants cheap labor, and cheap parts, and they don't care about the middle class because they are not middle class. They are wealthy, and they're looking to get wealthier. They are so wealthy that they can buy politicians, and legislature. And they do exactly that.

 

[chrysostom]

We need people to buy american and we need protectionism like we used to have.

we need protection from terrorists
and
not from those who want to make stuff for us

 

[TrakeM]

The TPP is indeed a bad thing, but let's not pretend that republicans are fighting it and democrats are all supporting it. In congress, the republican party is pushing for it and democrats are against it. If we had more democrats in the senate, it would be harder to push this through.

 

[chrysostom]

If we had more democrats in the senate,.

the baby killers would be protected

 

[Saved.One.by.Grace]

Corporations with help from the government (farm subsidies) and free trade agreements where we import food instead of growing it here and so on.

Both sides are destroying jobs and this nation.

When I go to Kroger to buy grapes, those grapes are coming from Chile. Are all the grapes grown in this country used for wine? We used to feed the world, now we are dependent on a world economy. :sigh:

 

[Saved.One.by.Grace]

When the car makers were in trouble a few years ago, the employee parking lot was filled with foreign cars. Whine because there's no jobs but buy foreign garbage. I buy american every chance I get and will never buy a foreign car.

We need people to buy american and we need protectionism like we used to have. Tax imports and create an outsourcing tax. And eliminate the income tax for all individuals and for business that hires exclusively americans

The problem is most of your "American" cars are built, at least in part, by foreign companies. Ford Mustang 6-speed transmissions come from China, and some Ford assembly work is done in Mexico. The car with the most "American" parts and assembled in America by Americans is the Honda Civic. The highest quality American car I've ever owned was a 1994 Saturn SC2 with a 5-speed transmission. It still looked like it was "showroom fresh" after killing two deer with it, and 200,000 miles in 14 years of driving. I replaced the alternator twice, put new tires on it three times, gas and oil, and it was still getting near 40 mpg. Saturn was the first division cut by GM along with Pontiac when it was restructuring. I suspect the government loan dictated some downsizing details.

 

[Saved.One.by.Grace]

... mmmm you forgot GATT ... and they were both forwarded by every American president since '47, Bill was just on watch when it was signed ... welcome to America.

I do not remember GATT since I wasn't born yet.

 

[Saved.One.by.Grace]

Good for you! I love visiting Detroit and seeing something like 80-90% of the cars on the road being American cars. :thumb:

You better be armed if you visit Detroit now, especially at night.

 

[aCultureWarrior]

I will always support free trade

How about fair trade? Is it fair when US companies have to meet all kinds of bureaucratic federal regulations and pay an exorbitant amount of taxes in order do business and slave labor countries like communist China don't?

• NERA Economic Consulting study commissioned by MAPI found 2,183 federal regulations affecting manufacturing, of which 235 are considered "major" regulations with compliance costs of $100 million or more.
http://www.industryweek.com/regulat...-burden-harming-manufacturing-competitiveness

 

[Saved.One.by.Grace]

So the U.S. no longer manufactures many consumer goods but we are world leaders in airplane manufacturing, large machinery and equipment manufacturing, earth moving equipment, computers, servers and networking equipment, telecommunications networks and devices, defense and weapons systems, satellites and space based electronic equipment, avionics electronics, etc.

Our focus has changed from consumer to industrial goods but since consumers buy stuff that says Made in China (or elsewhere) they incorrectly assume our manufacturing base is in deep trouble.

Furthermore, do not confuse a loss of manufacturing jobs to mean the US doesn't manufacture things. Efficiencies in the manufacturing process means less people are needed, and not necessarily that less products are produced.

You could not make any of that now without components made in Taiwan, Japan, South Korea and Malaysia. I worked for the only American silicon wafer manufacturer before they sold the business to a German conglomerate. I don't know if it's still true, but IBM made their own silicon wafers at one time for their own use, and my company added our wafers to meet fluctuations in their demand. All other silicon, the basis for everything electronic, comes from foreign companies. Your iPhone, Android phone, calculator, computer, etc, would not exist without silicon. Boeing could not make a plane, GM could not make a car, etc. You can't increase efficiencies on something you don't make. And if you tax all imported items, you just hurt the Middle Class. The global economic war is over and we lost.

 

[CabinetMaker]

Don't forget Ronald Regan's part in this play. He is the one who broke the traditional relationships between unions and management. While never a perfect relationship, they generally worked towards the same general goals. When Ronald broke the Air Traffic Controllers union, that pretty well defined a new battle ground: labor versus management.

It had other side effects as it clearly revealed that large corporations have no real respect towards their employees. Employees learned this and any loyalty they may have felt towards their company kind of evaporated. The years right after Regan have seen a shift in employee attitudes towards their companies. Since companies no longer provide retirement benefits and other perks, there is little incentive for employees to remain loyal to company. Instead, they follow the money and go where they can get the most for what they do.

And this has the side effect of stripping a company of its knowledge base. People used to work for a company long enough to learn in great detail how the manufacturing process worked. They tweaked it and passed that knowledge on to their buddies but not always to management. So when those people leave and take that knowledge with them, the factory becomes hugely inefficient and no longer profitable so it closes.

This is not a one sided issue. There is blame enough to go around. The democrats and republicans are equally guilty for creating the economy we find ourselves in today. Those of us that voted share in that guilt because we elected those people and did not stop them from spending way more than we can ever hope to pay back or prevent them from making it all about the money. We should hang our heads in shame.

 

[PureX]

You could not make any of that now without components made in Taiwan, Japan, South Korea and Malaysia. I worked for the only American silicon wafer manufacturer before they sold the business to a German conglomerate. I don't know if it's still true, but IBM made their own silicon wafers at one time for their own use, and my company added our wafers to meet fluctuations in their demand. All other silicon, the basis for everything electronic, comes from foreign companies. Your iPhone, Android phone, calculator, computer, etc, would not exist without silicon. Boeing could not make a plane, GM could not make a car, etc. You can't increase efficiencies on something you don't make. And if you tax all imported items, you just hurt the Middle Class. The global economic war is over and we lost.

We are destroying ourselves with our own greed. And it just gets worse and worse, for most of us.

 

[Saved.One.by.Grace]

Don't forget Ronald Regan's part in this play. He is the one who broke the traditional relationships between unions and management. While never a perfect relationship, they generally worked towards the same general goals. When Ronald broke the Air Traffic Controllers union, that pretty well defined a new battle ground: labor versus management.

Labor and management was always a battleground. I worked with unions before and after Reagan and see no change.

It had other side effects as it clearly revealed that large corporations have no real respect towards their employees. Employees learned this and any loyalty they may have felt towards their company kind of evaporated. The years right after Regan have seen a shift in employee attitudes towards their companies. Since companies no longer provide retirement benefits and other perks, there is little incentive for employees to remain loyal to company. Instead, they follow the money and go where they can get the most for what they do.

I am or will receive retirement benefits from all the companies I work(ed) for.

And this has the side effect of stripping a company of its knowledge base. People used to work for a company long enough to learn in great detail how the manufacturing process worked. They tweaked it and passed that knowledge on to their buddies but not always to management. So when those people leave and take that knowledge with them, the factory becomes hugely inefficient and no longer profitable so it closes.

Manufacturing processes change so rapidly now that unless you have a technical background, it's fairly easy to replace one person with another. Many people at the company I work for have been here 20, 30, 40, 50+ years. Manufacturing is represented by the UAW. I should also note that the company I work for is a foreign owned company.

This is not a one sided issue. There is blame enough to go around. The democrats and republicans are equally guilty for creating the economy we find ourselves in today. Those of us that voted share in that guilt because we elected those people and did not stop them from spending way more than we can ever hope to pay back or prevent them from making it all about the money. We should hang our heads in shame.

On this, I agree.

 

[chrysostom]

We are destroying ourselves with our own greed. And it just gets worse and worse, for most of us.

this is true
but
can't you control your own greed?

you should be able to
but
I now it is your job to worry about what others do